STOP on a dime? NOT! (UPDATE)
#58975
05/17/08 06:10 PM
05/17/08 06:10 PM
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Anonymous
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in my 22 years as a mechanic.. never ever ran into this kinda problem. so here goes....
1997 neon, replaced the front pads, adjusted up the rear shoes and whoa, no pedal. changed the master cylinder (bench bled), bled the brakes, still no pedal. changed the m/c again, still no pedal. checked all the lines, wheel cylinder etc, no leaks. bled them a 3rd and 4th time, still no pedal. when i mean no pedal.. i mean right to the floor. what the heck is going on here?
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Re: STOP on a dime? NOT!
#58976
05/17/08 06:23 PM
05/17/08 06:23 PM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 5,314 Carstairs, Alberta, Canada
dave571
master
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master
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 5,314
Carstairs, Alberta, Canada
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I've seen on these fwd chryslers, that it is very important to have a wheel nut holding the rotors in place when you put the calipers back on. If not, it's easy for it to be installed cocked off to one side. Looks fine, but's it's crooked. The pedal travel is all taken up straightening it back out again. The guy who did it in my shop had 30 plus years of trade experience, so it can happen to anyone. Something to check anyway.
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Re: STOP on a dime? NOT!
#58977
05/17/08 06:24 PM
05/17/08 06:24 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 32,929 Grand Prairie,Texas
stumpy
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 32,929
Grand Prairie,Texas
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Start from the begining. What happened to need the brake swap? When you say no pedal does that mean it never pumps up or what?
Last edited by stumpy; 05/17/08 06:25 PM.
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Re: STOP on a dime? NOT!
[Re: stumpy]
#58978
05/17/08 06:28 PM
05/17/08 06:28 PM
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Anonymous
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just came in cause the pads where worn out. still had lots of pedal. changed the front pads, the brake pedal went right to the floor, i told my helper its normal, and just pump up the brakes. but they would not pump up. they just go right to the floor. Dave571.. did the wheel nut to hold the rotor thing. thanks
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Re: STOP on a dime? NOT!
#58979
05/17/08 06:29 PM
05/17/08 06:29 PM
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,074 Manitoba Canada
67autocross
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,074
Manitoba Canada
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I was sure it was the wind....
A new iron curtain drawn across the 49th parallel
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Re: STOP on a dime? NOT!
[Re: stumpy]
#58981
05/17/08 06:36 PM
05/17/08 06:36 PM
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Anonymous
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yah, there was enough there to hold the wheels. front and back. i also adjusted the rear shoes up. i visually looked to see if the calipars and wheel cylinders were moving, they were.
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Re: STOP on a dime? NOT!
#58982
05/18/08 08:20 AM
05/18/08 08:20 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 21,072 Niles , Ohio
therocks
oh wait.but hey.lets see.oh yeah.
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oh wait.but hey.lets see.oh yeah.
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 21,072
Niles , Ohio
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Had an Itntepid at work with the same kind of problem.New pads all around and no pedal.Installed new master as it was bad still no pedal.It was the PP valve that is for non ABS brakes only.Couldnt get any pressure or fluid especially the rears.A new block from dealer and great brakes.Rocky
Chrysler Firepower
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Re: STOP on a dime? NOT!
[Re: therocks]
#58983
05/18/08 08:33 AM
05/18/08 08:33 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,728 places
79powerwagon
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,728
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Maybe I'm too anal about brakes, but this is why when my brakes are about 5-7 years old and needing a pad change, I simply dive in and replace the ENTIRE brake system, including hard and soft lines. Yes, it's bucks, but it sure eliminates the frustrations kinda like you're going through now! Of course, you say this is a customer's car, so they won't want to cough up the ching to do it, but for my personal vehicles, this is what I always do. Money well spent, in my opinion!
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Re: STOP on a dime? NOT!
#58985
05/18/08 10:50 AM
05/18/08 10:50 AM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,759 So Cal
HealthServices
Why would you even post that?
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Why would you even post that?
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,759
So Cal
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Almost sounds like your master is too small. The first one may have been damaged or got something in the piston cup to cause the master bypass and go bad but the replacements do not have enough volume to pump up the brakes. After a couple quick pumps does the pedal come up? I've always heard but never experience that if you push too much or too hard when bleeding the master you could damage it. Another thing could be a big air buble in the system that got pushed in when the master was replaced. On some cars this air can be a total pain to remove with out pressure bleeding. Are you using a power bleeder or manually bleeding it? Good luck
Allen
Here's a novel idea, let's not throw a bunch of parts at the car hoping it will fix the problem and instead spend a little time diagnosing it first.
Life was a little easier when I was just a wrench.
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Re: STOP on a dime? NOT!
[Re: HealthServices]
#58986
05/18/08 11:24 AM
05/18/08 11:24 AM
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pedal woudn't come up no matter what. and yah.. manually bleeding it, no power bleeder. if theres still air in it, its hiding pretty good . i'll try gravity bleed it today, if that fails, then i'll change porportioning valve. stupid neon messing up my whole long weekend
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Re: STOP on a dime? NOT!
[Re: DoctorDiff]
#58988
05/18/08 11:38 AM
05/18/08 11:38 AM
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Anonymous
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well they face to the "side". otherwise they are at its highest point.
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Re: STOP on a dime? NOT!
#58989
05/18/08 12:09 PM
05/18/08 12:09 PM
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,505 God's Country Maryland
GODSCOUNTRY340
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master
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God's Country Maryland
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When you compressed the pistons did you loosen the bleeders to relieve the pressure or force it back into the MC? If you forced it back to the MC you may have damaged the proportioning valve. Just a thought.
I love the smell of Deer guts in the morning, it smells like... VICTORY!
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Re: STOP on a dime? NOT!
#58990
05/18/08 01:59 PM
05/18/08 01:59 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889 up yours
Supercuda
About to go away
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About to go away
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
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Got ABS?
If so there is a specific method to bleed them, the regular old style doesn't do it.
They say there are no such thing as a stupid question. They say there is always the exception that proves the rule. Don't be the exception.
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Re: STOP on a dime? NOT!
[Re: Supercuda]
#58991
05/18/08 05:49 PM
05/18/08 05:49 PM
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Anonymous
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no abs. tried everything today, including replacing the p-valve. result? same thing this thing is gonna be the death of me. did 100's of brake jobs.. replace the front pads, adjust the rear drums, out the DOOR no problem. this thing is driving me gonna save it to tuesday, get a vacuum bleeder and try again. thanks for the help everyone
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Re: STOP on a dime? NOT!
#58992
05/18/08 06:34 PM
05/18/08 06:34 PM
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 292 dead center
CHRONiklyDEMONic
Demonized
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Demonized
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 292
dead center
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Trial and error. There are only a number of components. Check, check again, and then recheck.
Remember, NEVER count on "new parts" to be in working order, no matter what the box says.
Good luck, let us know what happens.
"After a Day filled with burning Rubber, you may find it time to re-tire."
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Re: STOP on a dime? NOT!
[Re: RobR]
#58994
05/18/08 07:43 PM
05/18/08 07:43 PM
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CHRONiklyDEMONic.. i know never to trust "new" parts.. i will keep yall posted tho. RobR.. damn near replace everything twice or three times (master cylinder). Its gotta be air somewhere.. even tho the brakes bleed normally (ie: no air coming out). m/c checked out just peachy. It started out as a simple 15min change the pad thing.. which is now on day two.
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