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Headers Vs. HP Manifolds #586676 01/18/10 05:52 PM 01/18/10 05:52 PM
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 146 California P Plymouth273 OP member
Plymouth273 OP member P Joined: May 2005 Posts: 146 California	I am building a 66 Sport Fury 383-4 Automatic, 11.0:1 Compression, 484/284 Mopar Performance cam and I have been going back and forth on putting headers vs. HP Manifolds on the car. The C-Body headers are out there but they are expensive, is the added expense worth it for the headers? The car will be mainly a fun street car but also may hit the strip a few times. Thanks.

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: Plymouth273] #586677 01/18/10 05:57 PM 01/18/10 05:57 PM
Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 21,318 Manitoba, Canada DaytonaTurbo Too Many Posts
DaytonaTurbo Too Many Posts Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 21,318 Manitoba, Canada	How much are the cheapest headers for your car? I run the $100 summit headers on my car and they do just fine, however if no cheap option exists for your car I would go with some HP manifolds if you can get a decent deal on them.

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: Plymouth273] #586678 01/18/10 06:01 PM 01/18/10 06:01 PM
Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 212 Mid Michigan C Coronet-R/T-Rag enthusiast
Coronet-R/T-Rag enthusiast C Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 212 Mid Michigan	I think you would like the performace of the headers better than the manifolds.

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: Plymouth273] #586679 01/18/10 06:07 PM 01/18/10 06:07 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,029 Oregon A AndyF I Win
AndyF I Win A Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,029 Oregon	Big block HP manifolds work just fine up to the 550 or 600 hp level. No problem running them on your setup. There are some articles in the tech archives if you want to ready about dyno testing with HP manifolds.

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: AndyF] #586680 01/18/10 06:09 PM 01/18/10 06:09 PM
Joined: Apr 2007 Posts: 3,235 Marion Illinois 72d100 master
72d100 master Joined: Apr 2007 Posts: 3,235 Marion Illinois	i heard somewhere that b body headers fit c body's but you have to slide them in from the bottom

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: 72d100] #586681 01/18/10 07:28 PM 01/18/10 07:28 PM
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 2,295 dark side of the moon D Dougsmopars top fuel
Dougsmopars top fuel D Joined: May 2005 Posts: 2,295 dark side of the moon	with a full exhurst system on the car you'd never tell the difference in power. The headers may show a bit more on a dyno but not in the seat. You can only flow so much through any full system. Run the stock HP manifolds. They fit, they don't leak you'll never have to fool with them unlike any aftermarket from cheap summit headers through big dollar Hooker super comps. On a full on race car yes headers , uncorked will give a big power improvement. You can only force so much air through all that pipe and mufflers.

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: AndyF] #586682 01/18/10 07:46 PM 01/18/10 07:46 PM
Joined: Nov 2009 Posts: 520 New Zealand nz383man mopar
nz383man mopar Joined: Nov 2009 Posts: 520 New Zealand	The HP manifolds I have are - RH 2899879 N4 LH 2951865-2 B7C Made on dayshift 22nd October 1969 The testing I have done so far has proved the LH manifold is the better of the two Runner #5 & #7 are close #1 is the best flowing, but not a heap better than #5 & #7 #3 has 40% more restriction/back pressure than the others The RH manifold is worse. Runner #8 is the best of both sides, showing 1/2 the restriction/back pressure of #3 #4 is a bit better than #1, #5 & #7 while #2 is a bit worse than #1, #5 & #7 #6 is the worst of all & shows 120% more restriction/back pressure than #8 If I can get my flow issues sorted out I'm going all the way with anti-reversion at both joints (heads to manifolds & manifolds to headpipes), thermal barrier coatings on manifolds & headpipes etc I'm running 2 1/2" pipes now but I have started to build a 3" to 2 1/2" antireversion fitting at the flange between the manifold & headpipe. As there is documentation that a 3" headpipe helps the HP manifolds work.

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: nz383man] #586683 01/18/10 08:12 PM 01/18/10 08:12 PM
Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 733 Long Island NY yellow sixpack super stock
yellow sixpack super stock Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 733 Long Island NY	I agree with Doug if your not racing go with the HP alot less hassles they flow really well and with the right mufflers they sound great. If you can't be smart.....don't be stupid!

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: Plymouth273] #586684 01/18/10 08:55 PM 01/18/10 08:55 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 12,861 Gloucester,VA STOP MOVING HERE RangerDan440 I Live Here
RangerDan440 I Live Here Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 12,861 Gloucester,VA STOP MOVING HERE	you will always get more HP out of headers but are you willing to cough up the initial expense, live with unending leaks and having to remove them every time you need to replace the starter? 68 Valiant 408 69 Charger 318 69 Cougar 351W 70 Torino GT 351C 71 Country Squire 351W 71 Road Runner 440+6 71 Satellite sedan 318 73 Duster 318 73 Challenger 383 77 Grand Prix 455 83 Malibu 9C1 383 84 Delta 88 403 87 Grand National 96 Ram 360 09 Crown Vic 10 Challenger R/T M6 15 Challenger Hellcat M6

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: Plymouth273] #586685 01/18/10 09:33 PM 01/18/10 09:33 PM
Joined: Feb 2005 Posts: 4,313 Prospect, PA BSB67 master
BSB67 master Joined: Feb 2005 Posts: 4,313 Prospect, PA	It really is a personal choice based on what you want. However, it is my opinion that the MP484 cam is not a good choice with exhaust manifolds.

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: RangerDan440] #586686 01/19/10 01:02 AM 01/19/10 01:02 AM
Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 21,318 Manitoba, Canada DaytonaTurbo Too Many Posts
DaytonaTurbo Too Many Posts Joined: Feb 2003 Posts: 21,318 Manitoba, Canada	Quote: you will always get more HP out of headers but are you willing to cough up the initial expense, live with unending leaks and having to remove them every time you need to replace the starter? Hey I installed my stock 90's mopar ministarter WITH my cheapie summit headers already bolted to my 440! Wasn't fun but I did it.

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: BSB67] #586687 01/19/10 10:13 AM 01/19/10 10:13 AM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 848 Avondale AZ Prodart440 super stock
Prodart440 super stock Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 848 Avondale AZ	Quote: It really is a personal choice based on what you want. However, it is my opinion that the MP484 cam is not a good choice with exhaust manifolds. I couldn't agree more. Night and day difference with the same cam in my cuda. Aaron 68 Roadrunner 383/AT 69 Dart GT Conv. 383/AT 05 Dodge Ram 4x4 Cummins 06 GoManGo R/T Daytona #757 68 Coronet 440

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: Plymouth273] #586688 01/19/10 10:20 AM 01/19/10 10:20 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md Mr.Yuck Not enough dumb comments...yet
Mr.Yuck Not enough dumb comments...yet Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md	well 1st I'll say this, that cam is not a "driver" cam. It is designed for bracket racing, It works with HEADERS, good intake, high stall and 3.91 gears. I had one in a mild 440, w/ logs and 3.55's and it was a complete dog. As for the header question, yes they help alot but if you alrady have that cam in the car w/ no stall and less that 3.91 gears, it won't trelly matter if you have headers or not. [IMG]http://i66.tinypic.com/pui5j.jpg[/IMG] Coming soon!!!!

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: Mr.Yuck] #586689 01/19/10 01:32 PM 01/19/10 01:32 PM
Joined: May 2005 Posts: 146 California P Plymouth273 OP member
Plymouth273 OP member P Joined: May 2005 Posts: 146 California	Thanks for the replies, the car does have a stall and 3.91 gears in it, the heads have are 906 with a little work, stock intake that has been mildly worked but I will upgrade if necessary in the future. If it makes a difference, the HP manifolds are 67 C-Body 440 HP's, not sure how well they breath compared to a B-Body HP. Thanks, any info is appreciated.

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: Plymouth273] #586690 01/19/10 06:28 PM 01/19/10 06:28 PM
Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 212 Mid Michigan C Coronet-R/T-Rag enthusiast
Coronet-R/T-Rag enthusiast C Joined: Apr 2008 Posts: 212 Mid Michigan	If you have a good exhaust system (2.5 or better) and hi flow mufflers, I think you will notice a big difference with headers. With that cam, I think you can expect a fall off in power big time over 5k. I switched to headers on my car with a mild combo and it made a ton more power.

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: Mr.Yuck] #586691 01/19/10 11:03 PM 01/19/10 11:03 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 3,488 Annapolis, MD, USA V Vert master
Vert master V Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 3,488 Annapolis, MD, USA	Quote: well 1st I'll say this, that cam is not a "driver" cam. It is designed for bracket racing, It works with HEADERS, good intake, high stall and 3.91 gears. I had one in a mild 440, w/ logs and 3.55's and it was a complete dog. As for the header question, yes they help alot but if you alrady have that cam in the car w/ no stall and less that 3.91 gears, it won't trelly matter if you have headers or not. I think this cam expects higher compression than a stock deck 440 will have. This combo on a zero-deck engine with true 10.5:1 will have some bite. Vert > [img]http://i.imgur.com/JHXmM.jpg[/img]71 Barracuda vert[/url] \| Hemi idling on dyno \| Hemi Dyno pull

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: Vert] #586692 01/20/10 12:05 AM 01/20/10 12:05 AM
Joined: Jan 2008 Posts: 350 CT USA N Nick Mineau enthusiast
Nick Mineau enthusiast N Joined: Jan 2008 Posts: 350 CT USA	look into shumaker headers. fit in my 440 duster with p/s great can't imagin a problem in your car. very good quality.

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: AndyF] #586693 01/20/10 02:03 AM 01/20/10 02:03 AM
Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 4,319 Puyallup, WA S StealthWedge67 master
StealthWedge67 master S Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 4,319 Puyallup, WA	Quote: Big block HP manifolds work just fine up to the 550 or 600 hp level. No problem running them on your setup. There are some articles in the tech archives if you want to ready about dyno testing with HP manifolds. Seeing this from Andy makes me feel better about the 1-3/4" headers I'm using on my 451 build. (shooting for 525 hp.) (sorry to hi-jack) LemonWedge - Street heavy / Strip ready - 11.07 @ 120

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: StealthWedge67] #586694 01/20/10 09:38 AM 01/20/10 09:38 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 16,123 Grand Haven, MI patrick I Live Here
patrick I Live Here Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 16,123 Grand Haven, MI	for a big C body with a small motor, you'll prefer a cam more like a lunati voodoo 60302 or 60303 than the MP484. 1976 Spinnaker White Plymouth Duster, /6 A833OD 1986 Silver/Twilight Blue Chrysler 5th Ave HotRod SOLD!* 2011 Toxic Orange Dodge Charger R/T 2017 Grand Cherokee Overland 2014 Jeep Cherokee Latitude (holy crap, my daughter is driving)

Re: Headers Vs. HP Manifolds [Re: patrick] #586695 01/20/10 09:08 PM 01/20/10 09:08 PM
Joined: Jan 2004 Posts: 357 The Garden State LimelightCuda enthusiast
LimelightCuda enthusiast Joined: Jan 2004 Posts: 357 The Garden State	Quote: I agree with Doug if your not racing go with the HP alot less hassles they flow really well and with the right mufflers they sound great. A friend of mine who knows a lot more about racing than me said the same thing. He also said the MoPar HP manifolds are designed really well and are better than the Chevy or Ford version and he is a Chevy guy. I am trying to make the same decision about headers vs. HP manifolds. I have headers right now and I love the sound and performance the car has. What I don't like is no power steering and the fact that the headers capture the starter. If I didn't go on long trips with the car I wouldn't care about that but I worry should the starter fail far from home. The car has a 440 with the MP474 cam in and it has high compression. I'm guessing at least 10:1. I've had the headers for 4 years and have yet to have a leak but due to where the car was kept they have rusted badly. I guess I am lucky in the leak department. [knock on wood] Phil 1970 Barracuda Gran Coupe 1970 A66 Challenger Convertible

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