Effect of advancing a cam
#457213
09/02/09 03:10 AM
09/02/09 03:10 AM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 815 PNW
Danan
OP
super stock
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OP
super stock
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 815
PNW
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Hello, I'm building a 360 for my 79 trailduster. Actual 9:1 compression, stock 340 cam (.420"/.444", 114 centerline). I built an identical engine for my wife's 85 RC and have been happy with it. Night and day difference in power when compared to a stock 360. The only thing is that our RC never sees the high side of 3500 rpm, so I think I'm leaving some power on the table. My thought was to advance the cam in this new engine and see how it works. Currently, the cam is degreed in at 111.75 degrees (2.25 degrees advanced).
Does anyone have any real-world experience on what effect 2 degrees advanced will have? Should I go 4 degrees??
Incidentally, I tried to do a search on moparts, to no avail. I tried searching 'advancing cam' and several similar phrases, going back one year. As usual, I got everything BUT message threads on advancing a cam. Is it just me, or is the search function basically unusable??
Thanks for any insight!!
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Re: Effect of advancing a cam
[Re: Dodgem]
#457215
09/02/09 09:38 AM
09/02/09 09:38 AM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,041 Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
Circle Track
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Circle Track
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,041
Lincoln Nebraska
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Definitely adv it 4 deg. Your app is the perfect setup for that. Low rpm diff in my pretty much stock 440(had a wild cam though) was night & day but I did mill the 906 heads .060" at the same time. Do check PV clearance also, one will increase & one will decrease. So I'm not the only one that hasn't figured out the search function, I'm doing something wrong, it's a total waste of time (for me so far).
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Effect of advancing a cam
[Re: Danan]
#457217
09/02/09 11:44 AM
09/02/09 11:44 AM
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,162 USA
360view
Moparts resident spammer
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Moparts resident spammer
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,162
USA
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If you seldom go past 3500 rpm, consider having a custom camshaft ground with less valve lift, and which closes the intake less past bottom dead center. Valve lift of 0.22 inches and closing 25 degrees past bdc would be in the ballpark. The 'ramp' of the cam lobe can also be steeper at these low lifts and rpms, which will open the valve faster.
This will give a torque boost at the lower rpm, due to an "inertia velocity" of the airflow closer to optimum at the lower total flow just before the intake valve closes, plus more swirl if the combustion chamber has some intake valve shrouding, like a 1979 should have stock.
There is also the potential for some MPG improvement in daily part-throttle driving.
If the RC is used for rock crawling and off-roading at low speeds, the engine behavior 1200 to 2200 rpm should feel stronger, but you do give up +3000 rpm WOT power.
Advancing the cam will give a much lower benefit, but in the same direction.
The variable valve timing addition on the newest 5.7 Hemi is for the same idea at lower rpms.
The Fiat 'Multi-Air' system that is coming to Chrysler engines adds variable lift to the valves for the same reasons.
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Re: Effect of advancing a cam
[Re: 360view]
#457218
09/02/09 12:34 PM
09/02/09 12:34 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,123 Grand Haven, MI
patrick
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,123
Grand Haven, MI
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your advice is partially right. less valve lift isn't the right way to go if you want to make power, period. if you want to maximize power for your lower RPM running, you want to open the valve as fast as possible and as much as possible for the shortest amount of time. get a cam with as much valve lift as possible with as much .050 & .2" duration and as short of seat duration, and as little overlap as possible. you're looking to maximize area under the lift curve, while minimizing seat duration, and closing the intake valve as soon as possible.
for a flat tappet, a lunati voodoo 60400 would be your best bet.
looking at the cam specs: the stock 340 cam is 268/276 adv, 208/214@.050, .429/.444 lift, 44 degrees overlap, intake closes 66 degrees ABDC
the voodoo 60400 is 250/256 adv (~20 degrees less duration for each!), 208/213@.050 (same .050 duration!), .454/.454 lift, 29 degrees overlap, intake closes, if it's installed at the recommended 108 ICL, at 53 degrees ABDC, or 13 degrees sooner than your old cam.
so you have the around same effective duration (heads don't flow meaningful amounts of air until .050-.1" lift), with more lift (more area under the lift curve=better cylinder filling and more power potential), and a much earlier intake closing point, which again will help with cylinder pressure to make more torque.
1976 Spinnaker White Plymouth Duster, /6 A833OD 1986 Silver/Twilight Blue Chrysler 5th Ave HotRod **SOLD!*** 2011 Toxic Orange Dodge Charger R/T 2017 Grand Cherokee Overland 2014 Jeep Cherokee Latitude (holy crap, my daughter is driving)
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Re: Effect of advancing a cam
[Re: Magnum]
#457220
09/02/09 11:58 PM
09/02/09 11:58 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 21,318 Manitoba, Canada
DaytonaTurbo
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 21,318
Manitoba, Canada
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Quote:
You have the wrong cam for this application.
I was thinking that too. 340 cam was not designed for pure bottom end power.
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