Re: Glidden’s Arrow
[Re: justinp61]
#3189931
11/09/23 07:56 PM
11/09/23 07:56 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,136 Melbourne , Australia
LA360
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If it ran at 6.65 pounds per cube, it would weigh right at 2100 pounds with a 314" engine. At 160 mph the Moroso calculator puts it at 660 hp and about 685 for an E.T. of 8.41. Still pretty impressive number for a mill that small IMHO. I think those kind of numbers would be in the ball park
Alan Jones
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Re: Glidden’s Arrow
[Re: LA360]
#3191022
11/15/23 07:38 AM
11/15/23 07:38 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,313 Charlotte, NC
LSP
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Charlotte, NC
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I used to talk to Mike Kennedy, who built the motors for Petty back when they raced SB Chryslers in NASCAR. Mike said that with the W2/59°std. lifter bore configuration, they could only rev them to 8500, past that and they couldn't keep the pushrods from jumping out of the rockers.
But, I think it was Dave Weber would said that he ran the std. 59° lifter bore configuration to 9200 without issue, and that cutting out the lifter valley and going with the 48° degree lifter configuration didn't show much of a gain.
I had a chat with Rusty Glidden once years back, and he said they ran the std. 59° lifter configuration to 9800.
Not my info, just passing it on.....
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Re: Glidden’s Arrow
[Re: LA360]
#3191057
11/15/23 11:12 AM
11/15/23 11:12 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,872 Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize
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I remember in 73 reading an article saying that Jenkins' 331" SBC in the vega was dynoing at 585 hp, considering the Iron heads of the day that's still pretty impressive.
I remember Darrin Morgan saying that normally aspirated the limits of a 2 valve engine iwith today's technology s approximately 1.65 lb/ft of torque per cube (and 1.3 is generally considered a very good street engine), but it's unlikely the wedge (or many any other) motors of that time were anything close to that.
Last edited by Streetwize; 11/15/23 11:14 AM.
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Re: Glidden’s Arrow
[Re: AndyF]
#3191690
11/17/23 11:13 PM
11/17/23 11:13 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,098 Massillon, Ohio
cudatom
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Feb 2003
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If those ported W2 heads made 900 hp back in the day I'm wondering why nobody ever copied them and sold that combination of rectangular W2 heads with matching intake. The stuff that Mopar sold over the counter never got close to 900 hp back then. Was surprised that I still had the article but in Popular Hot Rodding September 1979 there is a very in depth article about Bib's engine. Has all the DC part numbers, bire and stroke used, carb numbers etc. Anyways the article stated 700 hp. This seems in line with what you and most others felt.
Ok
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Re: Glidden’s Arrow
[Re: Streetwize]
#3191694
11/17/23 11:30 PM
11/17/23 11:30 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,241 fredericksburg,va
cudaman1969
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fredericksburg,va
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I remember in 73 reading an article saying that Jenkins' 331" SBC in the vega was dynoing at 585 hp, considering the Iron heads of the day that's still pretty impressive.
I remember Darrin Morgan saying that normally aspirated the limits of a 2 valve engine iwith today's technology s approximately 1.65 lb/ft of torque per cube (and 1.3 is generally considered a very good street engine), but it's unlikely the wedge (or many any other) motors of that time were anything close to that.
In the FABO article on Gliddens Arrow I told of my friends car running super modified (comp), he ran 2 engines SB Chevy, 266 and 331, 266 ran 8.70s 331 ran 8.0s @ 3100 pounds. Wallace says the 266 is 835 hp and 331 is 1074 hp. Verified these numbers from him today.
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Re: Glidden’s Arrow
[Re: cudaman1969]
#3191880
11/18/23 07:15 PM
11/18/23 07:15 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,136 Melbourne , Australia
LA360
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Melbourne , Australia
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I remember in 73 reading an article saying that Jenkins' 331" SBC in the vega was dynoing at 585 hp, considering the Iron heads of the day that's still pretty impressive.
I remember Darrin Morgan saying that normally aspirated the limits of a 2 valve engine iwith today's technology s approximately 1.65 lb/ft of torque per cube (and 1.3 is generally considered a very good street engine), but it's unlikely the wedge (or many any other) motors of that time were anything close to that.
In the FABO article on Gliddens Arrow I told of my friends car running super modified (comp), he ran 2 engines SB Chevy, 266 and 331, 266 ran 8.70s 331 ran 8.0s @ 3100 pounds. Wallace says the 266 is 835 hp and 331 is 1074 hp. Verified these numbers from him today. When was this guy making these kind of numbers?
Alan Jones
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Re: Glidden’s Arrow
[Re: LA360]
#3191918
11/18/23 11:43 PM
11/18/23 11:43 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,241 fredericksburg,va
cudaman1969
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,241
fredericksburg,va
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I remember in 73 reading an article saying that Jenkins' 331" SBC in the vega was dynoing at 585 hp, considering the Iron heads of the day that's still pretty impressive.
I remember Darrin Morgan saying that normally aspirated the limits of a 2 valve engine iwith today's technology s approximately 1.65 lb/ft of torque per cube (and 1.3 is generally considered a very good street engine), but it's unlikely the wedge (or many any other) motors of that time were anything close to that.
In the FABO article on Gliddens Arrow I told of my friends car running super modified (comp), he ran 2 engines SB Chevy, 266 and 331, 266 ran 8.70s 331 ran 8.0s @ 3100 pounds. Wallace says the 266 is 835 hp and 331 is 1074 hp. Verified these numbers from him today. When was this guy making these kind of numbers? 3-4 years ago, retired now for health issues. He never drove any of his cars from 1969 on, Allen Stanfield (Gregs uncle) drove till he had to quit then a guy named Chester ?. Nothing but the best equipment from top name guys. That comp stuff is a whole different world than our little doings.
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Re: Glidden’s Arrow
[Re: cudaman1969]
#3192143
11/20/23 09:36 AM
11/20/23 09:36 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,357 Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
I Live Here
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I Live Here
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Marion, South Carolina [><]
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My converter builder ran one of the super stock classes...not sure which one. His car had a 304" sb chevy w/ bowtie aluminum heads (nothing real exotic, had to have a factory part number), a sheetmetal manifold, and a pair of little holley 600 cfm carbs I believe. That engine made right at 1k hp and turned 11k rpm at the stripe. Impressive stuff. He was laughing about the converter and it being a 7" unit that flashed to around 8k rpm if I recall correctly. This was probably 10 years ago.
CHIP '70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60 '69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60 '71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75 '73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75 '90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt '06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
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Re: Glidden’s Arrow
[Re: cudaman1969]
#3192158
11/20/23 10:30 AM
11/20/23 10:30 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,872 Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize
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Small cube big bore short stroke motors today that spin 10-11K can fairly easily make 3-3.2+ Hp cube. I generally believe the short stroke allows for more of an RPM spread between peak torque and peak HP.
As with any other piston engine, after maximum VE (torque) RPM is achieved the bottom end acts like a friction brake trying to slow the crank.
What's really impressive to me are those Australian CHI Ford Cleveland heads some of the Aussie pro stockers run.... they are super impressive and make very similar HP/cube as our 500" NHRA pro stockers.
I'm thinking the unrestricted NASCAR motors are getting up near there too now, plus they have to live for 500-600 miles!
Last edited by Streetwize; 11/20/23 10:34 AM.
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Re: Glidden’s Arrow
[Re: Streetwize]
#3192225
11/20/23 04:05 PM
11/20/23 04:05 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,136 Melbourne , Australia
LA360
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Small cube big bore short stroke motors today that spin 10-11K can fairly easily make 3-3.2+ Hp cube. I generally believe the short stroke allows for more of an RPM spread between peak torque and peak HP.
As with any other piston engine, after maximum VE (torque) RPM is achieved the bottom end acts like a friction brake trying to slow the crank.
What's really impressive to me are those Australian CHI Ford Cleveland heads some of the Aussie pro stockers run.... they are super impressive and make very similar HP/cube as our 500" NHRA pro stockers.
I'm thinking the unrestricted NASCAR motors are getting up near there too now, plus they have to live for 500-600 miles! They haven'y run a cast head in Aussie Pro Stock in about 15 years or more. Most are running billet Slawko, MBE, or Visner heads.
Alan Jones
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Re: Glidden’s Arrow
[Re: cudaman1969]
#3192249
11/20/23 06:06 PM
11/20/23 06:06 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,313 Charlotte, NC
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Back to ‘stock’ 340s, I’m putting together a 70 Duster for stock with the 340. I’ve talked to a few running these cars, picking their brain thing. One gent who has raced his 71 since new turns his 7500 when heads up 6500 in bracket mode. Mid to low 10 sec ETs, he said it’s all about the valve springs since all componites have to be same weight and NHRA approved replacement. Makes you do a double take when hood is up and there’s a stock looking engine with cast iron heads and intake with an AVS, running that fast. Are you buying the engine or building it?
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Re: Glidden’s Arrow
[Re: LSP]
#3192255
11/20/23 06:18 PM
11/20/23 06:18 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 21,406 It's a dry heat
gtx6970
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
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Posts: 21,406
It's a dry heat
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Whats the advantage of the 314 versus going bigger ???
I remember reading Years ago Glidden had completely reconfigured the lifter area to straighten the angle between lifter and pushrod
Last edited by gtx6970; 11/20/23 06:19 PM.
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Re: Glidden’s Arrow
[Re: LSP]
#3192257
11/20/23 06:23 PM
11/20/23 06:23 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,241 fredericksburg,va
cudaman1969
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fredericksburg,va
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Back to ‘stock’ 340s, I’m putting together a 70 Duster for stock with the 340. I’ve talked to a few running these cars, picking their brain thing. One gent who has raced his 71 since new turns his 7500 when heads up 6500 in bracket mode. Mid to low 10 sec ETs, he said it’s all about the valve springs since all componites have to be same weight and NHRA approved replacement. Makes you do a double take when hood is up and there’s a stock looking engine with cast iron heads and intake with an AVS, running that fast. Are you buying the engine or building it? Buying and building, had the ,060 over shortblock with correct balanced internal parts. bought heads, intake, cam-parts from a big time eastern racer. might be outdated a little, but it’s a start. I’ll pull the heads apart to do some molds (to duplicate if needed) touch up the valves and new springs. I’ll try to duplicate a TQ intake from the AVS one in case I want to run it as a 71. So many things to do lol.
Last edited by cudaman1969; 11/20/23 06:24 PM.
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Re: Glidden’s Arrow
[Re: cudaman1969]
#3192372
11/21/23 09:42 AM
11/21/23 09:42 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,872 Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize
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I think Bob ran 314 cubes because he could get the most favorable power to (NHRA Factored) weight for a wedge head Pro Stock in 1979
Another huge advantage to the Arrow was it was narrow and had so much less frontal area compared to the typical A or F body or even the Camaros and mustang II's of the day.
I can't remember the first Fox body Mustang Pro stocker (maybe Nicholson ran one?) but I think that body style debuted in late 78, but the Arrow was still slicker than anything the competition was running. It almost looked like a Toy compared to other cars going down the track.
And for 79 I think Glidden ran the Fairmont instead of the new Mustang because back then I believe there was still the "Tiuana Taxi" weight break for anything over a 105" Wheelbase. It's interesting to think how cool it might have been for Glidden to have run the Volare....but Ma ran out of $$$ and went into Bankrupcy.
Last edited by Streetwize; 11/21/23 09:48 AM.
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Re: Glidden’s Arrow
[Re: Streetwize]
#3192403
11/21/23 12:52 PM
11/21/23 12:52 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,241 fredericksburg,va
cudaman1969
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fredericksburg,va
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I think Bob ran 314 cubes because he could get the most favorable power to (NHRA Factored) weight for a wedge head Pro Stock in 1979
Another huge advantage to the Arrow was it was narrow and had so much less frontal area compared to the typical A or F body or even the Camaros and mustang II's of the day.
I can't remember the first Fox body Mustang Pro stocker (maybe Nicholson ran one?) but I think that body style debuted in late 78, but the Arrow was still slicker than anything the competition was running. It almost looked like a Toy compared to other cars going down the track.
And for 79 I think Glidden ran the Fairmont instead of the new Mustang because back then I believe there was still the "Tiuana Taxi" weight break for anything over a 105" Wheelbase. It's interesting to think how cool it might have been for Glidden to have run the Volare....but Ma ran out of $$$ and went into Bankrupcy. I’m thinking he ran that size engine because Chrysler already had the 305 crank and he just bored the block out. At that time crank sizes were not a dime a dozen like today.
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Re: Glidden’s Arrow
[Re: Streetwize]
#3192415
11/21/23 01:37 PM
11/21/23 01:37 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,361 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
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I Live Here
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Las Vegas
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How many RPM are the Aussie Pro Stocks turning?
I've always been fascinated by high RPM motors< I remember the first time I ever saw the tachometer of a turbo F1 car, the sweep started at 4000RPM !!! We run what is basically an Aussie Pro Stock engine in the NA10.5 car, 6" larger and a single carb rather than 2. These days they are 11,000 rpm pieces pretty much. We see 10,000+ every run. FWIW we try to keep the converter at 9400ish. The owner of the car did Aussie Pro Stock engines at Waters, mainly Ford and Mopar stuff. They were THE place to have stuff done back then,.
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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