What it takes to kill nearly .25 in the 1/4
#3147391
05/29/23 10:25 AM
05/29/23 10:25 AM
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,848 MI, usa
dvw
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,848
MI, usa
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Ran N/SS this weekend at Columbus. Swirling winds from right head to the right tail all weekend. Didn't look like it would go 9.00 in the heat of the day with the headwind. So for the first time since the motors been back together we decided to run 9.25. I only have about 180lbs of ballast that there is a space to bolt it. So decided to kill it by pulling timing. Went from 35 degrees to 29 on pass #3. Very surprised it only killed .02. But again the wind was all over the place. Pulled 2 more to 27 total. That got us to 9.14. Started sneeking up on it with weight Saturday. First run we got closer but again depended on the wind and missd it with a 9.18. Ended up quailifing #4 with a 9.279. Winner of rd 1 had a bye in rd #2. We had it set 9.26 for rd #1. I did sit on the tree as my oponnent had been off by .06 in qualifing. But I really sat on it, .106. Day done. Sunday just ran the same weight to see if it follwed the weather as many thought the weather was way off. We were right it followed with a 9.268. Good enough for #1 qualifier and $100. Got by my buddy Mike Retford who was R/U on Saturday with an .032 / 9.260 run. That got us a bye in Rd #2. Again wind got us and slowed a bit, 9.282. Removed some ballast for rd #3. Set for 9.260. I made 3 mistakes. Bad burnout. Not enough wheel speed. It went crooked, and hooked hard in the box. It was then I realised it was in 1st gear. I always start in 3rd. Then pulled up to stage. Setting the tach recorder it moved and turned on the 2nd stage light. Had time to back out as my opponent wasn't in yet. Of course from the crooked burn out It was over to the right side of the groove. Hit the throttle. It hooked hard, yanked the front end and headed for the tree. An abrupt lift and steering correction, day done. What was good? The car. Many having traction issues. Not us, car was perfect. What was bad? The driver, lousy lights, mistakes. I'll be back out Friday at Milan running Open Comp. First time on a Pro tree in 20 years. Doug
Last edited by dvw; 05/29/23 10:27 AM.
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Re: What it takes to kill nearly .25 in the 1/4
[Re: dvw]
#3147407
05/29/23 12:08 PM
05/29/23 12:08 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,372 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,372
Las Vegas
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You were racing so not all bad....Have you tried short shifting of shifting out of first almost immediately? We have found that to work really well running index stuff.
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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Re: What it takes to kill nearly .25 in the 1/4
[Re: dvw]
#3147422
05/29/23 12:38 PM
05/29/23 12:38 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,223 Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,223
Bend,OR USA
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many different ways to slow the cars down, short shifting, over winding the motor in 1st and 2nd gears, lifting at a certain point on the track, varying valve lash, loosening it seems best to slow the car down a tiny amount lower air pressure in the front tires and so on
Last edited by Cab_Burge; 05/29/23 12:38 PM.
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: What it takes to kill nearly .25 in the 1/4
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#3147438
05/29/23 02:15 PM
05/29/23 02:15 PM
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 2,049 Mooresburg, Tn
'72CudaRacer
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 2,049
Mooresburg, Tn
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Mechanical throttle stop. (less than full throttle) The biggest reason for this method, adjusting timing and such always messed with my reaction times.
Brian
Last edited by '72CudaRacer; 05/29/23 02:17 PM.
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Re: What it takes to kill nearly .25 in the 1/4
[Re: jwb123]
#3147464
05/29/23 05:20 PM
05/29/23 05:20 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,166 Plymouth, MI
Blusmbl
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,166
Plymouth, MI
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It was going so well until eliminations!
Good luck Friday at Milan. It’s a great crowd on the shootout nights!
'18 Ford Raptor, random motorcycles, 1968 Plymouth Fury III - 11.37 @ 118
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Re: What it takes to kill nearly .25 in the 1/4
[Re: HardcoreB]
#3147541
05/30/23 08:33 AM
05/30/23 08:33 AM
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,848 MI, usa
dvw
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,848
MI, usa
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Hopefully you'll be more in the zone Friday. Are you going to play around with weight or timing or just run it all-out? I think the strategy is to have a tenth in reserve after you qualify? Timing will be back in. The dial is .10 below the best qualifing run. No way I'd leave a .10 on the table. 100lbs or so for qualifing. Then adjust as necesary for weather. A .10 is cake. Doug
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Re: What it takes to kill nearly .25 in the 1/4
[Re: tboomer]
#3147547
05/30/23 08:51 AM
05/30/23 08:51 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,987 new jersey usa
11secdart
master
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master
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,987
new jersey usa
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Throttle stop .. I have been using one for over 10 years with great success slowing from 10.90s to 11.50s as I run 11.50 Index. Mine is a modified Moroso unit , it basically bolts to the rear carb bolt / stud and is adjusted to regulate the throttle cable action. On my set up my secondaries are barely opening. I have tried the E.Z. plate system as well as the Willys adjustable plate system and I found they killed to much mph on my combination so I went back to my bolt system.
68 Dart 410 / 904 92 D150 original owner 21 Ram 1500 Quad Cab, Big Horn , Hemi ,4x4 23 Audi Q5 16 Honda HRV
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Re: What it takes to kill nearly .25 in the 1/4
[Re: dvw]
#3147584
05/30/23 12:16 PM
05/30/23 12:16 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,372 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,372
Las Vegas
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FWIW in our dragster we ran a coupole races where 5.00 was as quick as could be dialed. We shifted the car immediately into high gear and it would run 5.0/150 and all out on those days would have run 4.50/153. Used that set up on occasion to bracket race as well. As folks didn't expect a 5.0 car to run 150. was very affective. I have run the blue car in the 9.60 class and used the same strategy to slow it down. Immediately shift first gear and short second. Slows it down more than enough to make it raceable at 9.60 from 8.80's or 9.0's here
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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Re: What it takes to kill nearly .25 in the 1/4
[Re: Al_Alguire]
#3147588
05/30/23 12:29 PM
05/30/23 12:29 PM
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,848 MI, usa
dvw
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,848
MI, usa
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FWIW in our dragster we ran a coupole races where 5.00 was as quick as could be dialed. We shifted the car immediately into high gear and it would run 5.0/150 and all out on those days would have run 4.50/153. Used that set up on occasion to bracket race as well. As folks didn't expect a 5.0 car to run 150. was very affective. I have run the blue car in the 9.60 class and used the same strategy to slow it down. Immediately shift first gear and short second. Slows it down more than enough to make it raceable at 9.60 from 8.80's or 9.0's here We have to manually shift. The converter falls back to 6300. I hit the 1/2 shift at 6500. It takes about 500 rpm to make the shift on 1/2. If I were to just hit the button for 1/2 imediatly after the hit I'd be guesing on shift timing. As long as it makes the shift while it's still in converter slip do you think the 1/2 shift time varience will affect a consistent slow down of the ET? Doug
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Re: What it takes to kill nearly .25 in the 1/4
[Re: dvw]
#3147615
05/30/23 02:39 PM
05/30/23 02:39 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,372 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,372
Las Vegas
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Since you footbrake why not rry leaving in second gear and or short shifting? Id be willing to et leaving in second will kill most if not more than you want. Since it will affect your short times the most. I am sure that will kill more than enough as long as you can hit the tree still. I am a stop racer at heart and my old car and new one both need to kill 3 seconds of ET to run 10.90. We do it a similar way kill it as soon as possible and as hard as you can. I get this is a bit apples to oranges but the theory applies. I know alot of folks with three speeds who have 1st and 2nd gear leave valve bodies for this reason. In a stop car will kill it immediately to have as much MPH as possible, and use the shift point to get to the ideal/target 60' time.
The blue car is manually shifted like yours but I use a break. I shift as soon as I let go. It has not seemed to affect it as long as you are consistent and the car is. Your car sems to work very well so the variable would be you. The 2/3 light is set at 6400 my converter is dumb tight at 6200. I have no issues killing over 1/2 a second this way. I did just put an air shifter in the car though to make it all easier. Will shift 1-2 immediately and likely 2-3 on time to adjust. But have not gotten to run it yet as we are done here til the end of September. I am still hunting for a good bottom bulb set up, but I like more MPH for the ET than vice versa. Makes the race "look" different to my opponent. My car is already not as efficient as yours as my MPH is a good bit higher for the ET but I am also a fair amount heavier and am pulling timing at the hit when I am running it all in. I run 148/9 here at 9 ohs fwiw.
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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Re: What it takes to kill nearly .25 in the 1/4
[Re: dvw]
#3147861
05/31/23 04:28 PM
05/31/23 04:28 PM
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 11,608 Fulton County, PA
CMcAllister
Mr. Helpful
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Mr. Helpful
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 11,608
Fulton County, PA
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Spot drop at the 1000' cone.
That's how the Stockers do it.
If the results don't match the theory, change the theory.
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Re: What it takes to kill nearly .25 in the 1/4
[Re: dvw]
#3148055
06/01/23 07:49 PM
06/01/23 07:49 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,010 Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
gregsdart
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,010
Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
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FWIW in our dragster we ran a coupole races where 5.00 was as quick as could be dialed. We shifted the car immediately into high gear and it would run 5.0/150 and all out on those days would have run 4.50/153. Used that set up on occasion to bracket race as well. As folks didn't expect a 5.0 car to run 150. was very affective. I have run the blue car in the 9.60 class and used the same strategy to slow it down. Immediately shift first gear and short second. Slows it down more than enough to make it raceable at 9.60 from 8.80's or 9.0's here We have to manually shift. The converter falls back to 6300. I hit the 1/2 shift at 6500. It takes about 500 rpm to make the shift on 1/2. If I were to just hit the button for 1/2 imediatly after the hit I'd be guesing on shift timing. As long as it makes the shift while it's still in converter slip do you think the 1/2 shift time varience will affect a consistent slow down of the ET? Doug From a crazy run i made thirty years ago, I suspect an almost instant shift to second would be able to add . 25 to your ET. If the trans can take a shift real early, like at about one to two feet out , then correct with balast? mental timing for that shift might have to be tied to say, the green, or .5 after the third amber. That will put you in a rhythm , on the half second mark. One, (amber), two, (2ndamber) three, launch, (3rd amber)4shift(green)
Last edited by gregsdart; 06/01/23 07:51 PM.
8..603 156 mph best, 2905 lbs 549, indy 572-13, alky
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