Re: Hydraulic vs. Solid Roller Cam
[Re: hudsonhornet7x]
#3085040
10/11/22 09:19 AM
10/11/22 09:19 AM
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Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 1,126 Loudoun County, VA
Brad_Haak
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 1,126
Loudoun County, VA
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I don't have much faith in the current hydraulic roller lifters for BBM, primarily wrt RPM capability. I'd go w/ a solid roller and make sure the lobes are designed for street durability. Those generally don't require as much spring loads as typical race lobes, either.
2021 Challenger 6.4L Scat Pack 1320 100% stock: 1.680, 11.894 at 113.75 (DA 175 ft) weight reduction, wheels, tires, Hellcat air box: 1.661, 11.686 at 115.97 (DA 710 ft)
1973 Challenger 452 ci street/strip [2008] pump gas, DOT radials: 1.454, 10.523 at 126.44 (DA 514 ft)
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Re: Hydraulic vs. Solid Roller Cam
[Re: hudsonhornet7x]
#3085083
10/11/22 11:46 AM
10/11/22 11:46 AM
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Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 1,126 Loudoun County, VA
Brad_Haak
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Dec 2021
Posts: 1,126
Loudoun County, VA
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I've heard it's a good idea to keep any solid-type cam idling at 1000+ to encourage oil splash at low RPMS. Mine has enough cam that it idles about 1200, so I never gave it much thought.
2021 Challenger 6.4L Scat Pack 1320 100% stock: 1.680, 11.894 at 113.75 (DA 175 ft) weight reduction, wheels, tires, Hellcat air box: 1.661, 11.686 at 115.97 (DA 710 ft)
1973 Challenger 452 ci street/strip [2008] pump gas, DOT radials: 1.454, 10.523 at 126.44 (DA 514 ft)
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Re: Hydraulic vs. Solid Roller Cam
[Re: hudsonhornet7x]
#3085084
10/11/22 11:46 AM
10/11/22 11:46 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 21,072 Niles , Ohio
therocks
oh wait.but hey.lets see.oh yeah.
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oh wait.but hey.lets see.oh yeah.
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 21,072
Niles , Ohio
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Saw on engine master where they ran Hyd roller with solid rollers.Seemed to pick up HP and torque.Seems the hyd cam has less steep ramps They did say that Crane lifters were some of the best Also said some cheaper lifters were problems in hyds.
Chrysler Firepower
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Re: Hydraulic vs. Solid Roller Cam
[Re: hudsonhornet7x]
#3085121
10/11/22 01:10 PM
10/11/22 01:10 PM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,206 New York
polyspheric
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,206
New York
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If you go solid, you have to watch lash frequently, loose hammers the needles in the roller.
Boffin Emeritus
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Re: Hydraulic vs. Solid Roller Cam
[Re: hudsonhornet7x]
#3085149
10/11/22 02:57 PM
10/11/22 02:57 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,163 Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,163
Bend,OR USA
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Thanks for the advice. I have been reading up on hydraulic roller problems too. So, with a solid roller, do you need to keep your idle rpm higher? No, Mopar stock blocks have a lot of clearances (.003+) in the lifter bores to the lifters, way more than they should have That being said that does allow a lot of oil to drip down onto the cam lobes and around the lifters, even at idle RPM under 1000 RPM As far as maintenance on the solid roller lifters buy a good set, I like Crowers, and good rocker arm parts and run good clean oil to make the motor live. My last pump gas fast street car had a Comp Cams custom ground solid roller cam with their lifters and Harland Sharp aluminum roller rocker arm set up with their 1.65 ratio, I would check the lash after break in around once a year after everything was broken in and stop wearing the high points off the new moving parts like the pushrod and roller tips on the rocker arms
Last edited by Cab_Burge; 10/11/22 03:04 PM.
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: Hydraulic vs. Solid Roller Cam
[Re: hudsonhornet7x]
#3085199
10/11/22 05:50 PM
10/11/22 05:50 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,759 Windsor, ON, Canada
Diplomat360
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,759
Windsor, ON, Canada
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... What is a good cam/lifter setup for my application? ( Hydraulic or solid?)... Are you asking for specific size/part# combination recommendations, or for general feedback re: hydraulic vs solid? If specific size, I'd say there is a boat-load of info that needs to be shared before anyone can really comment: intended RPM range, drivetrain combo (if auto, what stall on the converter), what rear-end gearing and what tire size, vehicle weight, intake (single or dual) and exhaust setup (header sizing), engine CR, intended fuel use (you said street, so 87 or are you willing to cough up the cost of "arm&leg" to run premium - 93/94?), etc.
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Re: Hydraulic vs. Solid Roller Cam
[Re: hudsonhornet7x]
#3085252
10/11/22 09:28 PM
10/11/22 09:28 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,485 SoCal
Brian Hafliger
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,485
SoCal
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Almost every BB we do now gets lifter bore bushings...idle pressure is 50+lbs. hot, little to no leaks, little to no air in the oil leading to the mains and rods...and much less engine noise. Bam DLC coated solid roller lifters, and a good smooth lobe with some lift will make great power...you'll need good rockers though... Brian
Brian Hafliger
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Re: Hydraulic vs. Solid Roller Cam
[Re: Brian Hafliger]
#3085280
10/11/22 11:06 PM
10/11/22 11:06 PM
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,010 Sac, CA
mopowers
master
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master
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,010
Sac, CA
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Almost every BB we do now gets lifter bore bushings...idle pressure is 50+lbs. hot, little to no leaks, little to no air in the oil leading to the mains and rods...and much less engine noise. Bam DLC coated solid roller lifters, and a good smooth lobe with some lift will make great power...you'll need good rockers though... Brian What are some good rockers you recommend?
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Re: Hydraulic vs. Solid Roller Cam
[Re: Diplomat360]
#3085385
10/12/22 11:40 AM
10/12/22 11:40 AM
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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,541 USA
hudsonhornet7x
OP
pro stock
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OP
pro stock
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,541
USA
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... What is a good cam/lifter setup for my application? ( Hydraulic or solid?)... Are you asking for specific size/part# combination recommendations, or for general feedback re: hydraulic vs solid? If specific size, I'd say there is a boat-load of info that needs to be shared before anyone can really comment: intended RPM range, drivetrain combo (if auto, what stall on the converter), what rear-end gearing and what tire size, vehicle weight, intake (single or dual) and exhaust setup (header sizing), engine CR, intended fuel use (you said street, so 87 or are you willing to cough up the cost of "arm&leg" to run premium - 93/94?), etc. My original question was for what type, hydraulic or solid. Does anyone know who makes the Trick Flow hydraulic lifters? I assume they buy them from someone else but not sure. Do they have a good rep?
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Re: Hydraulic vs. Solid Roller Cam
[Re: hudsonhornet7x]
#3087454
10/19/22 12:15 PM
10/19/22 12:15 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,363 Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,363
Marion, South Carolina [><]
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I prefer solid rollers over everything else. Just my
CHIP '70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60 '69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60 '71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75 '73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75 '90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt '06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
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Re: Hydraulic vs. Solid Roller Cam
[Re: fast68plymouth]
#3087478
10/19/22 01:25 PM
10/19/22 01:25 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,026 Tulsa OK
Bad340fish
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,026
Tulsa OK
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My thoughts on a solid setup. Lash it a few times early on and get a feel for it. Once its set it really shouldn't move unless there is a problem. You will learn what it sounds like and will know if it needs attention. Know that long highway drives usually add to the noise from the prolonged heat soak that isn't normally present in main street cruisers. Mine usually needs some tiny adjustment to make me feel good, and I mean tiny, tiny enough that it could easily be chalked up to the engine position not being 100% the same as when it was set last time. That is a downside to checking it using the EOIC method and the starter I suppose.
If I drove my solid roller car daily I would probably check it once a month. It takes me 5-10 minutes at most to zip the covers off and run through the valves.
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68 Barracuda Formula S 340
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Re: Hydraulic vs. Solid Roller Cam
[Re: 69dart]
#3087496
10/19/22 02:17 PM
10/19/22 02:17 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,496 So. Burlington, Vt.
fast68plymouth
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,496
So. Burlington, Vt.
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You wouldn’t be the first, or last person to do it.
You can plan on needing different length pushrods as well.
68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123 Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
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Re: Hydraulic vs. Solid Roller Cam
[Re: calrobb2000]
#3087541
10/19/22 05:17 PM
10/19/22 05:17 PM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,206 New York
polyspheric
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,206
New York
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Noisy hydraulic tappets: something is wrong. Too much lifter body to bore clearance, misalignment of oil feed holes to the tappet, or not enough oil pressure. Other cause: are you sure your rockers are doing the right thing?
A solid roller tappet is struck violently by the cam lobe's opening ramp during the lash take-up, large tappet clearance amplifies this, and the entire shock load is taken by a small number of needles (not even half) in the roller assembly. Not real numbers, but if the roller OD is .750", the roller ID has to be at least .375" (roller is 3/16" wall). Allowing for 1/16" needles, there are only about 16 to 20 needles , and only those at 6:00 position (5-6?) are loaded.They don't like it.
Boffin Emeritus
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Re: Hydraulic vs. Solid Roller Cam
[Re: polyspheric]
#3087554
10/19/22 06:08 PM
10/19/22 06:08 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,489 Minnesota
Hemi_Joel
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,489
Minnesota
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For street use, if you go with a solid roller, it is important to go with a lifter that has pressure oiling to the roller axle. Do not us a splash lube roller lifter, it is very likely that you will have problems if you do. Also, the bushed lifters are pretty tuff, and there are no needles to fail.
[img]http://i.imgur.com/boeexFms.jpg[/img]31 Plymouth Coupe, 392 Hemi, T56 magnum RS23J71 RS27J77 RP23J71 RO23J71 WM21J8A I don't regret the things I've done. I only regret the things I didn't do. "Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something. ~ Plato"
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