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Re: New 3.0L Inline 6 from Chrysler, 500hp [Re: hemi70se] #3029584
04/01/22 03:25 PM
04/01/22 03:25 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 12,158
Benton, IL.
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DaveRS23 Offline
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DaveRS23  Offline
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Benton, IL.
Originally Posted by hemi70se
I've had this idea for years now... with all the technology that has gone into modern engines why can't they design a NEW engine that has computer controlled solenoids to open the valves. This could eliminate the camshaft, timing gears and timing chains which are frequent cause of needed engine wear repairs/ failures.


It has already been tried: Koenigsegg Freevalve camless engine

www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3cFfM3r510

www.youtube.com/watch?v=tAqP7o_ZdK0

www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qjtvp0lUTdk


Master, again and still
Re: New 3.0L Inline 6 from Chrysler, 500hp [Re: DaveRS23] #3029587
04/01/22 03:35 PM
04/01/22 03:35 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,068
Irving, TX
feets Offline
Senior Management
feets  Offline
Senior Management

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Posts: 28,068
Irving, TX
And BMW had system that varied valve lift to do the work of throttle bodies.


We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind.
- Stu Harmon
Re: New 3.0L Inline 6 from Chrysler, 500hp [Re: feets] #3029687
04/01/22 05:49 PM
04/01/22 05:49 PM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,954
WI
Dcuda69 Online content
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Dcuda69  Online Content
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Posts: 4,954
WI
GM also has a variable lift system. Camless engines may very well go mainstream. As mentioned Koenigsegg has been playing with them for some time. I believe he was using pneumatic solenoid to open valves and springs to close them. Electric solenoids to open them against spring pressure would likely require more voltage than 12 volts so I can see them in some kind of Hybrid where high voltage is readily available. Infineatly adjustable valve timing with no valvetrain......talk about broad torque curves and big RPM!!! eek

Re: New 3.0L Inline 6 from Chrysler, 500hp [Re: Dcuda69] #3029696
04/01/22 06:09 PM
04/01/22 06:09 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
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HotRodDave Offline
I Live Here
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Posts: 12,419
Kalispell Mt.
I think the Konesigg uses air to close and solenoid to open but I could be wong.


I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!



Re: New 3.0L Inline 6 from Chrysler, 500hp [Re: HotRodDave] #3029807
04/01/22 11:07 PM
04/01/22 11:07 PM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 4,954
WI
Dcuda69 Online content
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Dcuda69  Online Content
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WI
Originally Posted by HotRodDave
I think the Konesigg uses air to close and solenoid to open but I could be wong.


A good read:

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/fu...segg-gemeras-600bhp-camless-engine-works

Re: New 3.0L Inline 6 from Chrysler, 500hp [Re: Dcuda69] #3029851
04/02/22 06:45 AM
04/02/22 06:45 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,028
Tulsa OK
Bad340fish Offline
master
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Posts: 8,028
Tulsa OK
That Freevalve setup from Koensisengigin or whatever is pretty amazing. It's amazing all the possibilities that limitless valve activation can do.


68 Barracuda Formula S 340
Re: New 3.0L Inline 6 from Chrysler, 500hp [Re: feets] #3029855
04/02/22 07:17 AM
04/02/22 07:17 AM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,162
USA
3
360view Offline
Moparts resident spammer
360view  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,162
USA
A question that has been endlessly debated in internet forums is:
should the gasoline engine throttle be mostly closed (high vacuum)
or mostly open ( low vacuum)
for best fuel economy?

The (complicated) answer is:
there should be no throttle and the intake valve movements should adjust cylinder filling to suit load.

It should be more discussed that:
a particular type of engine used to have no throttle (diesel)
and thanks to the EPA
most new diesels now have throttles
and diesel fuel economy has gone down
putting more CO2 out into the atmosphere
( and slightly less NOx)

Re: New 3.0L Inline 6 from Chrysler, 500hp [Re: 360view] #3029913
04/02/22 09:56 AM
04/02/22 09:56 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 21,524
N.E. OHIO, USA
A12 Offline
Too Many Posts
A12  Offline
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Posts: 21,524
N.E. OHIO, USA
Originally Posted by 360view
A question that has been endlessly debated in internet forums is:
should the gasoline engine throttle be mostly closed (high vacuum)
or mostly open ( low vacuum)
for best fuel economy?

The (complicated) answer is:
there should be no throttle and the intake valve movements should adjust cylinder filling to suit load.

It should be more discussed that:
a particular type of engine used to have no throttle (diesel)
and thanks to the EPA
most new diesels now have throttles
and diesel fuel economy has gone down
putting more CO2 out into the atmosphere
( and slightly less NOx)


I don't think it really matters to most if not all manufactures because the most important goal is to meet the emissions regulation using the FTP (EPA/CARB Federal Test Procedure) which the CAFE fuel economy results are derived from. They have to meet the FTP emissions reg and cannot put "ringers" into a fuel economy test that would be "tuned" for best MPG and then peg the NOX or HC or any other pollutant that's why the CAFE results are from the manufacture's FTP certification results. And all of the certification data is "Public Record" for EVERYONE to see at any time including all of the other manufactures, greenies and just plain you and me. Here's all of the information down to axle ratios, weight HC and everything else:

2022 EPA FTP and CAFE emissions and fuel economy results


And here from 2022 all the way back to 1984 (ironically the year of "Big Brother" laugh2 ) https://www.epa.gov/compliance-and-fuel-economy-data/data-cars-used-testing-fuel-economy

Re: New 3.0L Inline 6 from Chrysler, 500hp [Re: A12] #3029944
04/02/22 12:05 PM
04/02/22 12:05 PM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,162
USA
3
360view Offline
Moparts resident spammer
360view  Offline
Moparts resident spammer
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,162
USA
I agree reading the actual EPA results can be interesting.

Years ago I used to eat breakfast at a coffee shop near the EPA lab complex in Research Triangle Park NC
(thank you Senator Jesse Helms)

I met a lot of EPA engineers and perhaps even more employees at Contractors to the EPA.

At least half of these people were “gearheads” and not radicals.

They showed me how to get EPA database test results,
and at least twice alerted me that the EPA had set up equipment in nearby parking lots where the public was allowed to have their vehicles (confidentially) tested.

I have written here on Moparts that the research paper (1998?) where they converted a I4 VW diesel in house
to sparkplugs and port fuel injection (Holley injectors atomized best)
to run on alcohols at the same compression ratio
was one of the most interesting I have ever read.
The EPA employee authors compared the thermal efficiency of the fuels at the same compression ratio,
and also played around with using varying EGR amounts to control power output.

I miss that coffee shop.

Re: New 3.0L Inline 6 from Chrysler, 500hp [Re: 360view] #3029947
04/02/22 12:16 PM
04/02/22 12:16 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,085
NotRussia
2
2fast4yourBrain Offline
Whack top Dodger
2fast4yourBrain  Offline
Whack top Dodger
2

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,085
NotRussia
At least they're still offering an ICE engine.

I'm quite surprised they are, given the push for EVs.

I like it, and I'm sure you'll be able to hot rod this with bigger turbo(s)/boost.

Re: New 3.0L Inline 6 from Chrysler, 500hp [Re: 2fast4yourBrain] #3030115
04/02/22 11:28 PM
04/02/22 11:28 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,495
Minnesota
Hemi_Joel Offline
master
Hemi_Joel  Offline
master

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Posts: 7,495
Minnesota
Just because they can make it so that it's modular with the four cylinder, doesn't mean I want one. I'll take a Hemi any day. Doesn't look like I'll be buying any new trucks in the future.


[img]http://i.imgur.com/boeexFms.jpg[/img]
31 Plymouth Coupe, 392 Hemi, T56 magnum
RS23J71
RS27J77
RP23J71
RO23J71
WM21J8A
I don't regret the things I've done. I only regret the things I didn't do.
"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something. ~ Plato"
Re: New 3.0L Inline 6 from Chrysler, 500hp [Re: 360view] #3030164
04/03/22 08:56 AM
04/03/22 08:56 AM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,162
USA
3
360view Offline
Moparts resident spammer
360view  Offline
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3

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,162
USA
The IC Engines of our future may be on
the small trailers we tow behind our battery electric trucks to give them useful range?

If that is the sad future
a tiny multi-fuel high horsepower I6
connected to an inverter type electric generator
that can output multiple voltages and phases (including aircraft style 400 Hertz 3 phase )
can be thought of as an advance

The FSM for such an I6 will probably be 8000 pages long.
Set it by the toilet and read 8 pages a sitting.

Chandler Six
are you ashamed of your great grandchildren?

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