Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Dimension Needed from 440 or Hemi #3011323
02/01/22 09:17 PM
02/01/22 09:17 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 957
MI, Lapeer
M
maximus Offline OP
super stock
maximus  Offline OP
super stock
M

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 957
MI, Lapeer
Looking into possibly installing a Big Block or 426 Hemi into a front engine dragster. What I need from someone, is a width of the engine with a mini-starter attached. I am limited to 10.5 inches from center-line of the engine to the outside width of the starter.. Any measurement would do that I can calculate from. The clearance distance from the total width is my deciding factor to see if it will fit. Thanks

Re: Dimension Needed from 440 or Hemi [Re: maximus] #3011340
02/01/22 09:44 PM
02/01/22 09:44 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 31,029
Oregon
A
AndyF Online content
I Win
AndyF  Online Content
I Win
A

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 31,029
Oregon
You might want to use a transmission or a bellhousing as a gauge since one of those will be the max width.

Re: Dimension Needed from 440 or Hemi [Re: maximus] #3011381
02/01/22 11:04 PM
02/01/22 11:04 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,925
NC
440Jim Offline
I Live Here
440Jim  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,925
NC
I can take a measurement for you.
I have a 440 and mini starter (not in use). Are you using a 727 trans or a manual transmission bellhousing?
Or even a PowerGlide... with a JW Bellhousing....

Engine-trans_5-13-2019_small.jpg

1993 Daytona, 5.50 at 130mph (1/8) 1.19 sixty ft (PG). Link to 572 B1 - Part 1
Re: Dimension Needed from 440 or Hemi [Re: 440Jim] #3011409
02/02/22 12:36 AM
02/02/22 12:36 AM
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,257
fredericksburg,va
C
cudaman1969 Offline
master
cudaman1969  Offline
master
C

Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,257
fredericksburg,va
I think the oil pump sticks out more than starter

Re: Dimension Needed from 440 or Hemi [Re: maximus] #3011427
02/02/22 02:20 AM
02/02/22 02:20 AM
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 609
Boise
M
Moparteacher Offline
mopar
Moparteacher  Offline
mopar
M

Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 609
Boise
According to the Mopar chassis book 8th edition; the center of the starter nose support in the bellhousing is 7.08" measured from the center of big block bellhousing.
I assume this measurment from the book is for an 11" flywheel. The small block bell measurement is less, but does not give the measurement. It appears to be about .25" less. The book does not specify which BB bellhousing in pictured in chapter 4.
The slant 6 distance shows to be 6.219"
I measure approximately 4" from the starter nose center to the outer side of the starter motor. Motor diameter about 2.8 inches.

Reclocking the starter motor in relation to the crank would bring the motor closer to the crank.

Last edited by Moparteacher; 02/02/22 02:33 AM.
Re: Dimension Needed from 440 or Hemi [Re: cudaman1969] #3011442
02/02/22 08:15 AM
02/02/22 08:15 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 957
MI, Lapeer
M
maximus Offline OP
super stock
maximus  Offline OP
super stock
M

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 957
MI, Lapeer
Cudaman. The oil pump sticks out 9.5 inches from C/L of the crankshaft. So that is a non clearance issue. Thanks for bringing it up.

Have a JW housing and glide. The outermost edge of the bell housing is also 9.5 inches for C/L. So if the starter does not exceed the width of the bell housing, there should not be a problem.

Re: Dimension Needed from 440 or Hemi [Re: maximus] #3011477
02/02/22 10:33 AM
02/02/22 10:33 AM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 876
Missouri
J
jwb123 Offline
super stock
jwb123  Offline
super stock
J

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 876
Missouri
A few years back I put a 440 with a powerglide in a front engine dragster and as mentioned the oil pump and filter were the issue. One of the uprights in the frame hit right where the oil filter was and we had to cut it out and relocate it.

Re: Dimension Needed from 440 or Hemi [Re: maximus] #3011502
02/02/22 11:21 AM
02/02/22 11:21 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 12,076
Benton, IL.
D
DaveRS23 Offline
Special needs idiot
DaveRS23  Offline
Special needs idiot
D

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 12,076
Benton, IL.
Years ago, I really wanted an FED to put my spare big block in. I was told time and again that unless the rails were laid out for Mopar (and few are), that our engines are too wide to fit with the starter in the stock location. But I never actually tried it myself. The few Mopar frames that I found were either too far away, too expensive, or too incomplete. So, I've never had one but still think about it now and then.

Good luck! And I am a little envious because that is a project that I have always wanted to do. bow Be sure and keep us posted on the progress.


Master, again and still
Re: Dimension Needed from 440 or Hemi [Re: maximus] #3011554
02/02/22 01:24 PM
02/02/22 01:24 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,110
Byron, NY
W.I.N. Racing Offline
top fuel
W.I.N. Racing  Offline
top fuel

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,110
Byron, NY
I wound up moving my starter to the righ tside of the motor. Here is some pics that may help

525 Hemi crank 005.jpg525 Hemi crank 015.jpgBB_Mopar_bell4.jpg

'01 P1500, Blown/Inj BAE,/Veney ,Bruno/CS2,Dana 60
'01 Dodge 3500 S Cummins Auto, Fresh air kit, 4" Exhaust,
'05 Dodge Magnum R/T - Too Much to list
'60 Willys CJ5
'01 International LPX - Project,DT466, Allison
'64 Plymouth Valiant, Inj 528 Hemi, 2spd
Re: Dimension Needed from 440 or Hemi [Re: W.I.N. Racing] #3011595
02/02/22 03:33 PM
02/02/22 03:33 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,925
NC
440Jim Offline
I Live Here
440Jim  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,925
NC
I attached a mini-starter to my JW Bellhousing on a PG transmission.
From the picture, you can see the starter is wider than the JW Bellhousing.
From the center of the transmission shaft to the outside of the motor is about 11-3/16" (plus or minus a 1/16).

Starter_JW_Bellhousing-post.jpg

1993 Daytona, 5.50 at 130mph (1/8) 1.19 sixty ft (PG). Link to 572 B1 - Part 1
Re: Dimension Needed from 440 or Hemi [Re: Moparteacher] #3011610
02/02/22 04:15 PM
02/02/22 04:15 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,925
NC
440Jim Offline
I Live Here
440Jim  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,925
NC
Originally Posted by Moparteacher
According to the Mopar chassis book 8th edition; the center of the starter nose support in the bellhousing is 7.08" measured from the center of big block bellhousing.
I assume this measurment from the book is for an 11" flywheel.

This picture is an aftermarket Lakewood BB Mopar bellhousing with several manual transmission bolt patterns. It has two starter positions.
This is what I came up with for measurements.

Lakewood_Bellhousing_starter-positions-dims.jpg

1993 Daytona, 5.50 at 130mph (1/8) 1.19 sixty ft (PG). Link to 572 B1 - Part 1
Re: Dimension Needed from 440 or Hemi [Re: 440Jim] #3011631
02/02/22 05:16 PM
02/02/22 05:16 PM
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,257
fredericksburg,va
C
cudaman1969 Offline
master
cudaman1969  Offline
master
C

Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,257
fredericksburg,va
Bolt a starter to an auto trans, measure from input shaft. Hope it sticks thru frame

Re: Dimension Needed from 440 or Hemi [Re: maximus] #3011636
02/02/22 05:29 PM
02/02/22 05:29 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,925
NC
440Jim Offline
I Live Here
440Jim  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,925
NC
Originally Posted by maximus
Have a JW housing and glide. The outermost edge of the bell housing is also 9.5 inches for C/L. So if the starter does not exceed the width of the bell housing, there should not be a problem.
Although the JW bellhousing is 19" total width (9.5 x 2), it is not the same on both sides. The starter side is close to 10.5" from the center and the other side is much less.


1993 Daytona, 5.50 at 130mph (1/8) 1.19 sixty ft (PG). Link to 572 B1 - Part 1
Re: Dimension Needed from 440 or Hemi [Re: cudaman1969] #3011651
02/02/22 06:07 PM
02/02/22 06:07 PM
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,916
usa
L
lewtot184 Offline
master
lewtot184  Offline
master
L

Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,916
usa
Originally Posted by cudaman1969
I think the oil pump sticks out more than starter
that was a big issue the genII hemi's in front engine cares. the old frames would fit an early hemi or big block chevy the mopar wedge and hemi needed pump mods to fit the frame.







Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1