Re: Engine Masters: 6pack vs HEMI
[Re: mgoblue9798]
#2934709
06/18/21 10:20 PM
06/18/21 10:20 PM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,082 St. Paul , Mn.
tubtar
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master
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,082
St. Paul , Mn.
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Actually a 426 max wedge v/s hemi would be an interesting shootout. I'd like to see a small block vs gen 3 hemi shootout - maybe what can be built for 5k. Small block stroker vs 6.4 would be interesting as well. 5 K don't buy much these days. I just finished a 408 stroker and with machining , I am well over that. I also have a 405 inch R-3 / W-9 and I have well over that in the heads.
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Re: Engine Masters: 6pack vs HEMI
[Re: hudsonhornet7x]
#2934720
06/18/21 10:39 PM
06/18/21 10:39 PM
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Joined: May 2019
Posts: 713 Lake Villa Il
INTMD8
super stock
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super stock
Joined: May 2019
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Lake Villa Il
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but who builds stock displacement engines anymore? I just did
69 Charger. 438ci Gen2 hemi. Flex fuel. Holley HP efi. 650rwhp @7250 510rwtq @5700
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Re: Engine Masters: 6pack vs HEMI
[Re: INTMD8]
#2934724
06/18/21 10:50 PM
06/18/21 10:50 PM
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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,542 USA
hudsonhornet7x
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jan 2012
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USA
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but who builds stock displacement engines anymore? I just did Fair enough lol. What did you build?
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Re: Engine Masters: 6pack vs HEMI
[Re: INTMD8]
#2934726
06/18/21 10:53 PM
06/18/21 10:53 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,810 Sobieski Wi
bee1971
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master
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Sobieski Wi
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The 1971 440 Six Pack is going back in his 1971 Charger R/T , his first car
The Mopar Performance 426 Hemi is going in a AMC Gremlin on a future episode of roadkill
1971 Dodge Charger Superbee 2011 Ram Sport 1500 Quad Cab Deep Water Blue Loaded Siberian Huskies
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Re: Engine Masters: 6pack vs HEMI
[Re: tubtar]
#2934737
06/18/21 11:44 PM
06/18/21 11:44 PM
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,061 Atlanta, GA
mgoblue9798
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,061
Atlanta, GA
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Actually a 426 max wedge v/s hemi would be an interesting shootout. I'd like to see a small block vs gen 3 hemi shootout - maybe what can be built for 5k. Small block stroker vs 6.4 would be interesting as well. 5 K don't buy much these days. I just finished a 408 stroker and with machining , I am well over that. I also have a 405 inch R-3 / W-9 and I have well over that in the heads. I was thinking about a 5.9 with a set of pistons, cam, and heads, vs 5.7 with something similar as far as cam and compression goes. Regular guy street stuff, not racing engines.
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Re: Engine Masters: 6pack vs HEMI
[Re: metallicareload]
#2934746
06/19/21 01:13 AM
06/19/21 01:13 AM
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,163 CT
GTX MATT
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I did not know that Stage V made a dual plane? Somehow I suspect that a stock intake would have made more torque. https://www.hotrod.com/articles/mopp-0310-hemi-426-crate-engine-dyno-test/This is an article from Dulcich on Westechs dyno from 20 years ago. The otherwise stock 465 HP crate motor he used made WAY more low end torque with more cam with the crate motor intake manifold. How much do you want to bet its actually the same crate engine?
Last edited by GTX MATT; 06/19/21 01:14 AM.
Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street
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Re: Engine Masters: 6pack vs HEMI
[Re: polyspheric]
#2934788
06/19/21 10:04 AM
06/19/21 10:04 AM
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Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,779 Holland MI Ottawa
2boltmain
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Holland MI Ottawa
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Wedge motor was a successful transition of a passenger car engine design adapted to racing. Hemi was a successful transition of a race car engine design adapted to passenger car use. Many OEM heads can support 500hp. The iron OEM hemi head shines when tasked to make far FAR beyond that level. Hemi is cool and legendary but If I could afford one run Id let those big ole heads shine with big cubes and high RPM.
Keep old mopars alive.
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Re: Engine Masters: 6pack vs HEMI
[Re: krautrock]
#2934829
06/19/21 12:26 PM
06/19/21 12:26 PM
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Joined: Dec 2013
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GY3
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what were the cams in the motors for the dyno test comparison? Hydraulic rollers. Duration was 236° @ .050 intake, 241 @ .050 exhaust. Lift was .549 intake, .541 exhaust with 108° lobe separation.
Last edited by GY3; 06/19/21 12:39 PM.
'63 Dodge 330 11.19 @ 121 mph Pump gas, n/a, through the mufflers on street tires with 3.54's. 3,600 lbs. 10.01 @ 133mph with a 250 shot of nitrous an a splash of race gas. 1.36 60 ft. 3,700 lbs.
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Re: Engine Masters: 6pack vs HEMI
[Re: cudaman1969]
#2934831
06/19/21 12:57 PM
06/19/21 12:57 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,223 Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
I Win
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I Win
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Posts: 43,223
Bend,OR USA
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You can build a 440 to have more power than a Hemi, then try to sell either. Buyers are standing in line to pay big bucks for the Hemi and you have to give away the wedge, facts of life folks. One other thing, I haven’t seen any 68 440 Darts or Cudas in Super Stock trim run as fast as the Hemi ones yet. let se, a single four barrel with stock smog heads versus two four barrels on a race motor, I wonder why the hemi does better in those cars for those that don't know about the stock hemiroid valve train take a real hard look at them, they SUCK
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: Engine Masters: 6pack vs HEMI
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#2934872
06/19/21 02:50 PM
06/19/21 02:50 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,290 fredericksburg,va
cudaman1969
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You can build a 440 to have more power than a Hemi, then try to sell either. Buyers are standing in line to pay big bucks for the Hemi and you have to give away the wedge, facts of life folks. One other thing, I haven’t seen any 68 440 Darts or Cudas in Super Stock trim run as fast as the Hemi ones yet. let se, a single four barrel with stock smog heads versus two four barrels on a race motor, I wonder why the hemi does better in those cars for those that don't know about the stock hemiroid valve train take a real hard look at them, they SUCK Exactly what I mean, no smog motor headed 440 even with the 6 Pac will run like a Hemi unless you restrict the Hemi (with hdydrolic cam) to run in the same rpm range. Build the 440 just like the race Hemi using the 906 head with a sheet metal intake (same mods as the S/S) no way you’re getting 8-900 HP out of that 440. First off those 906s will choke off at 6800 or less. Below the head, the 440 and 426 are the same, the head and above separates the men from the boys. Once the aftermarket wedge heads start flowing in the Hemi range then and only then will the engines match up.
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Re: Engine Masters: 6pack vs HEMI
[Re: Uberpube]
#2934878
06/19/21 03:07 PM
06/19/21 03:07 PM
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,061 Atlanta, GA
mgoblue9798
super stock
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super stock
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Anyone watch it? Interesting results. Has me wondering if the cams should have shared the same lift but otherwise been customized to suite each engine best. How about a link to it so we can watch it They are having a Father's Day sale, $36 a year. Well worth it. https://www.motortrend.com/news/motortrend-app-fathers-day-gifts/ Deal only available in the US. Bummer. If you get a VPN you can be a US customer as well.
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Re: Engine Masters: 6pack vs HEMI
[Re: GY3]
#2934891
06/19/21 04:02 PM
06/19/21 04:02 PM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,419 Kalispell Mt.
HotRodDave
I Live Here
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I Live Here
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Kalispell Mt.
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I just finished it and it was very interesting!
It's the same thing that had been said for years.
You have to spin the HEMI hard to get it to run. Not so much with the 440 as it makes tons more low end torque.
Here is a screenshot of the runs overlaid. Red is 440, black is Hemi. Sorry I don't know any other way to say this but If you increase the TQ per cube on the 426 to the same TQ per cube X 440 it is only down about 20lbs to the 440. The HP would also go up a little from the bigger bore unshrouding the valves more and the CID increase. Another way to look at it is you can always multiply TQ with gears but you can not multiply HP, what the engine makes is what it makes. In the same car with either cubic inch equal or gearing adjusted for the lower CID the hemi will win.
I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!
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Re: Engine Masters: 6pack vs HEMI
[Re: 2boltmain]
#2934895
06/19/21 04:22 PM
06/19/21 04:22 PM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,209 New York
polyspheric
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New York
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In Chrysler, the hemi is the older engine by 7 years (1951 vs 1958), and the B/RB wedge is not a descendant of any hemi.. In general, the wedge (pushrods and rocker arms, closed chamber with quench, parallel valves tilted at an angle to the bore axis) only came into general use in 1949 (Cadillac and Olds, and still used today in LSX), but the Harley-Davidson hemi engines date to 1926 and every English bike mfg. had a hemi engine before WW2.
Boffin Emeritus
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Re: Engine Masters: 6pack vs HEMI
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#2934945
06/19/21 10:42 PM
06/19/21 10:42 PM
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 15,119 85086
moparpollack
Lil Herman
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Lil Herman
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 15,119
85086
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If you insure through Hagerty they give you motor trend for free.
MT jumped the shark years ago haven't watched any new content in 3 years.
56 Plaza 63 D100 step side 67 Coronet, 68 Roadrunner, 69 Super Bees, 69 Coronet 500 convertible, 70 Roadrunner Post, 79 D150 360, and a severe case of Mopar a,d,d
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