Re: Real world 440 Cube Gen 3 numbers
[Re: biff426]
#2249421
02/07/17 11:58 PM
02/07/17 11:58 PM
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 1,828 houston texas
gremlinsteve
top fuel
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top fuel
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houston texas
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I have supplied several cams to a customer of mine who's running a big inch 3gen hemi like that Has made 713 rwhp through a not so efficient transmission and has managed a very traction limited 9.40 pass or three
It's using custom thitek heads and a ported 6.1 intake and factory ect Weights about 3400 without the driver
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Re: Real world 440 Cube Gen 3 numbers
[Re: biff426]
#2249431
02/08/17 12:14 AM
02/08/17 12:14 AM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302 Nebraska
72Swinger
master
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master
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Nebraska
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That wouldnt be the no1special would it? Or the Red Baron?
Mopar to the bone!!!
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Re: Real world 440 Cube Gen 3 numbers
[Re: biff426]
#2249434
02/08/17 12:18 AM
02/08/17 12:18 AM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302 Nebraska
72Swinger
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Nebraska
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Im itching to CNC some Apaches and go max on a stock lifter rocker setup. Gonna require new pistons im afraid though. Only have about .070 PTV clearance now with 2.10 intake valves. IIRC though I took an old lifter and shimmed it solid to check though, shimmed it to zero lash.
Last edited by 72Swinger; 02/08/17 12:20 AM.
Mopar to the bone!!!
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Re: Real world 440 Cube Gen 3 numbers
[Re: biff426]
#2249759
02/08/17 04:42 PM
02/08/17 04:42 PM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302 Nebraska
72Swinger
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I think rocker geometry issues start to show past .630???? The rockers start to run out of sweep IIRC. Im not going to make HP claims, flow numbers are never consistent from one guy to another, but BES and Thitek have claimed flow numbers of ported Apache heads that rival W8/W9 stuff that is MAXED. If you have no heads at all and want HP just start with the Thitek's IMO.
Mopar to the bone!!!
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Re: Real world 440 Cube Gen 3 numbers
[Re: biff426]
#2249769
02/08/17 04:57 PM
02/08/17 04:57 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225 Charleston
sixpackgut
Drag Week Mod Champion
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Drag Week Mod Champion
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Charleston
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the thitek heads flowed exactly what Craig Thibeau said they would on my bench. In a phone conversation with "someone I would rather not name names" said the BES Apache heads go 400cfm at .600 which would be better than the Thitek did on my bench and better than Thitek claims. When I said my Apaches flow 360 @ .600, his comment was that is what they flow stock. I changed the subject then.
on another note, I see companies offering Apache heads ported by Thibeau at Thitek and never see any posted flow numbers on them.
Last edited by sixpackgut; 02/08/17 05:06 PM.
Gen 3 power 6.22@110, 9.85@135 Follow @g3hemiswap on instagram
performance only racing, CRT, ultimate converter, superior design concepts, ThumperCarbs
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Re: Real world 440 Cube Gen 3 numbers
[Re: biff426]
#2249799
02/08/17 05:23 PM
02/08/17 05:23 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225 Charleston
sixpackgut
Drag Week Mod Champion
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Drag Week Mod Champion
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Charleston
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Kicking the idea of doing a 440 cube Gen 3. Has anyone done one with any real world numbers preferably track results. I am really impressed with my 426 6.1 based deal and looking for an all out NA Gen 3 deal to put in my 65 Coronet super stock clone. obviously, if you want to have an all out deal, Barton has went 8.50s in factory stock trim.
Gen 3 power 6.22@110, 9.85@135 Follow @g3hemiswap on instagram
performance only racing, CRT, ultimate converter, superior design concepts, ThumperCarbs
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Re: Real world 440 Cube Gen 3 numbers
[Re: biff426]
#2257892
02/22/17 08:52 PM
02/22/17 08:52 PM
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 4,269 Canada
WO23Coronet
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Probably 6.4 (bigger bore) although the Hellcat block is stronger. 6.4 truck block is apparently the same block as the Hellcat but with the bigger bore
Edit: my bad, I thought the Hellcat had a smaller bore for more cylinder wall thickness, it's still a 4.09 bore
Last edited by WO23Coronet; 02/23/17 10:50 AM.
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Re: Real world 440 Cube Gen 3 numbers
[Re: biff426]
#2257896
02/22/17 09:06 PM
02/22/17 09:06 PM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302 Nebraska
72Swinger
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Hellcat and 6.4's have same 4.09 bore I thought. I doubt a N/A build is capable of finding the limits of any of the stock Gen 3 blocks. If big inch N/A is the goal then a 6.4 car or truck block starts out with the biggest bore without spending a boat load. Im unsure if the truck blocks have oil squirters like the 6.4 SRT and Hellcat blocks do and when a stroker crank is used they usually get blocked anyway.
Mopar to the bone!!!
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Re: Real world 440 Cube Gen 3 numbers
[Re: gbeaty]
#2872966
01/12/21 03:04 AM
01/12/21 03:04 AM
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 9,719 Home
SRT6776
I hate internal combustion engines!
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I hate internal combustion engines!
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Re: Real world 440 Cube Gen 3 numbers
[Re: gbeaty]
#2873522
01/13/21 05:11 AM
01/13/21 05:11 AM
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Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 80 Australia
aus370
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Has anyone seen good (> 600whp) results out of a street car, pump gas stroker?
My disappointing 449 dynojet run is attached.
Five years ago I hydrolocked my 6.1 Magnum motor. I replaced it with a 449 Mopar aluminum block (4.185 / 4.08" bore and stroke) with the biggest Thitek heads, a ported 6.1 manifold and 2" Kooks headers. Recently I completed a manual swap (Tremec Magnum) and added a larger cam (237/249 0.57/0.58").
Coming from the LS world, I'm very disappointed in the power. Especially as these heads are said to outflow almost anything LS-based. Granted I'm knock-limited to 18-20 degrees of ignition timing (11.6:1 compression; I would have preferred 11:1) on 93 octane. There may be more power with more timing; I'll know when I try E85. These heads have also always let a good bit of oil by the seals. Probably not much at WOT to drop octane, but who knows.
My 90 mm Arrington throttle body seems to limit me to ~98 kPA at 6500. So while there's a few ponies to be had with a bigger TB, it's not a lot. My Legmaker 4" pre-TB intake doesn't appear to be a restriction at all.
HHP told me they get "mid-500s" out of their street car 426 strokers. Again, not great.
I'm wondering if the intake manifold (ported 6.1) is the cork. It's certainly not the dual 3.5" exhaust, which was originally built for a Hellephant I'm not going to be able to get. Can the potential of these motors be unlocked without an extremely tall intake? From every thing i've read the long runners in the 6.1 intake will be holding you back a lot in the higher rpms . The more vertical angle of a G3 Hemi port makes it hard to design a low profile race intake, without ending up with the runners too short.
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Re: Real world 440 Cube Gen 3 numbers
[Re: aus370]
#2910238
04/14/21 08:04 PM
04/14/21 08:04 PM
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Joined: Jan 2021
Posts: 4 Gainesville, FL
gbeaty
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From every thing i've read the long runners in the 6.1 intake will be holding you back a lot in the higher rpms . The more vertical angle of a G3 Hemi port makes it hard to design a low profile race intake, without ending up with the runners too short. Are curved runners no good? The above motor saw oil starvation on the road course, so we pulled it. I'll be looking to get it rebuilt, and when it goes back together I hope to have a plan to make 600+ NA whp with it. I've given the intake manifold to a mechanical engineering buddy of mine to CAD up; we hope to 3D print some different intake designs to try. The trouble with the high-rise stuff is of course hood clearance on a modern street car. Any suggestions on where to send the motor? I think the crank is ok, but the bearings don't look hot. You can catch your nail on some parts of the bore. Thanks.
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Re: Real world 440 Cube Gen 3 numbers
[Re: gbeaty]
#2910619
04/15/21 06:54 PM
04/15/21 06:54 PM
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Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 70 Souderton
Taylor
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Souderton
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From every thing i've read the long runners in the 6.1 intake will be holding you back a lot in the higher rpms . The more vertical angle of a G3 Hemi port makes it hard to design a low profile race intake, without ending up with the runners too short. Are curved runners no good? The above motor saw oil starvation on the road course, so we pulled it. I'll be looking to get it rebuilt, and when it goes back together I hope to have a plan to make 600+ NA whp with it. I've given the intake manifold to a mechanical engineering buddy of mine to CAD up; we hope to 3D print some different intake designs to try. The trouble with the high-rise stuff is of course hood clearance on a modern street car. Any suggestions on where to send the motor? I think the crank is ok, but the bearings don't look hot. You can catch your nail on some parts of the bore. Thanks. Modern Muscle Motors. https://www.modernmusclextreme.com
04 Ram 4x2 11.66@ 122 4750LBS ...phat pig Moves for fully loaded truck with NA 345ci Hemi 2020 1320 Challenger....stock daily driver.
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