Valvetrain that leads a long and happy life?
#2846716
11/15/20 07:02 PM
11/15/20 07:02 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,069 Irving, TX
feets
OP
Senior Management
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OP
Senior Management
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,069
Irving, TX
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I know stock stuff runs for a bazillion miles with no worries but lets not go there. I've whittled down the head selection on my 543. The Eddy RPM heads are heading out for a tasty CNC job. Now, I need to solidify the uppy downy bits that lets the poor thing breathe. Again, 5300 lb street car built for general hooliganism and the occasional road trip. That means trading off crazy power for longer life. It's also in my best interest to keep this thing under 6000 RPM so the crank doesn't go on vacation. I'm looking hard at the Hughes 232/236/110 hydraulic flat cam. Teaming that thing up with some 1.6 rockers looks pretty tasty. Lift goes to .571/.582 and isn't too hard on parts. Typical lifter weight and moderate specs open up spring options. However, I'm tempted to go with a more aggressive hydraulic roller cam like the Comp 236/242/110 .544/.541 which moves to .580/.577 with the faster rockers. The roller lifters are a lot heavier and will put more load on the springs and the rpm is a bit closer to my self imposed red line. When it comes to racking up the miles will there be a significant difference in longevity of the components? Neither of these cams are radical but the motion is starting to get a little snappy, especially with the higher ratio rockers. I don't mind the price difference of going roller if longevity is there. Valve spring technology has taken a big jump since I built my last motor. Ovate wire beehive type springs are doing the job of those old dual springs but I'm not sure if the action rate of these cam combos merit that type of thing. Each cam retailer has their preferred spring but there are sometimes better options available. As for the rockers themselves, are the Mancini's good enough for daily type use or should I drop the coin for Harland?
We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind. - Stu Harmon
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Re: Valvetrain that leads a long and happy life?
[Re: feets]
#2846806
11/15/20 10:26 PM
11/15/20 10:26 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,486 SoCal
Brian Hafliger
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,486
SoCal
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Be careful of aggressive hyd rollers....very fun to control. And not worth a bunch of power compared to something smoother with more lift. We would run around .650 at the valve.
Brian Hafliger
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Re: Valvetrain that leads a long and happy life?
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#2846821
11/15/20 11:19 PM
11/15/20 11:19 PM
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Joined: May 2019
Posts: 713 Lake Villa Il
INTMD8
super stock
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super stock
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 713
Lake Villa Il
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I agree. Wish I would have discussed things with Dale other than old Cadillacs.
69 Charger. 438ci Gen2 hemi. Flex fuel. Holley HP efi. 650rwhp @7250 510rwtq @5700
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Re: Valvetrain that leads a long and happy life?
[Re: Brian Hafliger]
#2846827
11/15/20 11:26 PM
11/15/20 11:26 PM
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,051 The Great White North
RAMM
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,051
The Great White North
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Be careful of aggressive hyd rollers....very fun to control. And not worth a bunch of power compared to something smoother with more lift. We would run around .650 at the valve. Totally agreed. I've made more with less grief with a well thought out solid flat. J.Rob
2009 PHR\EMC Competitor 2010 PHR\EMC Competitor 2011 PHR\EMC Competitor 2012 PHR\EMC Competitor 2013 PHR\EMC Competitor 2014 HotRod/EMC Competitor 2015 HotRod/EMC NoShow 2016 HotRod/EMC 3rd place SPEC Bigblock 2018 HotRod/EMC 7th place G3
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Re: Valvetrain that leads a long and happy life?
[Re: LSP]
#2846905
11/16/20 09:29 AM
11/16/20 09:29 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,069 Irving, TX
feets
OP
Senior Management
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OP
Senior Management
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,069
Irving, TX
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Lifter and pushrod weight means nothing, at 5000 or 10000 rpm.
Disagree about an aggressive hydraulic roller, did a small block with Morel std. travel lifters, small PSI dual spring, 615 hp and 8300 rpm And how many thousands of miles did you put on it?
We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind. - Stu Harmon
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Re: Valvetrain that leads a long and happy life?
[Re: AndyF]
#2846960
11/16/20 11:21 AM
11/16/20 11:21 AM
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,700 Wichita
GY3
master
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master
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,700
Wichita
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Yes, a set of Isky nodular rocker arms would work great but they are hard to find these days. I kind of regret selling the couple of pair that I used to own since they would come in handy on some street builds. I use the old tried and true Cranes. Found brand new in a box from years ago at a swap meet for $100. As for the Comp hydraulic roller lifters, they are garbage. More than one person I know that had problems with them. A lot of us run Howards now and have zero issues. Mine have well over 7,000 hard miles on them. Do yourself a favor and run the Crane melonized distributor drive gear as well.
Last edited by GY3; 11/16/20 11:23 AM.
'63 Dodge 330 11.19 @ 121 mph Pump gas, n/a, through the mufflers on street tires with 3.54's. 3,600 lbs. 10.01 @ 133mph with a 250 shot of nitrous an a splash of race gas. 1.36 60 ft. 3,700 lbs.
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Re: Valvetrain that leads a long and happy life?
[Re: feets]
#2846998
11/16/20 12:45 PM
11/16/20 12:45 PM
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Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399 Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar
master
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master
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
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I have the comp Hydraulic roller cam in the 505" stroked 440. Only have about 2,000 mile on it though. Originally tried the cheap CAT 1.7:1 rocker arms, but they were not oiling correctly. If I spent some $$$ rebuilding them with quality parts, they might be OK, but I just put on 1.6:1 Harlan Sharpe rockers, and on inspection after 1,000+ miles everything looks great. Engine is rev limited to 6,000 RPM, and I really recommend some type of RPM limiter because the valve springs are only 400 lb/in rate (ISKY 8005A) The hydraulic roller seems to work OK, but is more expensive than a solid roller setup with no real benifit. This is my only Hydraulic roller cam engine. Now, I just use mild solid roller cams. Spring selection is easier, and don't have to worry as much about the RPM limit. Also, I can't tell any difference in valve train noise. The Hydraulic setup seemed just as loud, but most of what I hear is all the roller components, sounding like a sewing machine. A mild exhaust drowns out any of the engine sounds anyway.
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Re: Valvetrain that leads a long and happy life?
[Re: feets]
#2847157
11/16/20 05:32 PM
11/16/20 05:32 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,908 Nebraska
4406bbl
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,908
Nebraska
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I know stock stuff runs for a bazillion miles with no worries but lets not go there. I've whittled down the head selection on my 543. The Eddy RPM heads are heading out for a tasty CNC job. Now, I need to solidify the uppy downy bits that lets the poor thing breathe. Again, 5300 lb street car built for general hooliganism and the occasional road trip. That means trading off crazy power for longer life. It's also in my best interest to keep this thing under 6000 RPM so the crank doesn't go on vacation. I'm looking hard at the Hughes 232/236/110 hydraulic flat cam. Teaming that thing up with some 1.6 rockers looks pretty tasty. Lift goes to .571/.582 and isn't too hard on parts. Typical lifter weight and moderate specs open up spring options. However, I'm tempted to go with a more aggressive hydraulic roller cam like the Comp 236/242/110 .544/.541 which moves to .580/.577 with the faster rockers. The roller lifters are a lot heavier and will put more load on the springs and the rpm is a bit closer to my self imposed red line. When it comes to racking up the miles will there be a significant difference in longevity of the components? Neither of these cams are radical but the motion is starting to get a little snappy, especially with the higher ratio rockers. I don't mind the price difference of going roller if longevity is there. Valve spring technology has taken a big jump since I built my last motor. Ovate wire beehive type springs are doing the job of those old dual springs but I'm not sure if the action rate of these cam combos merit that type of thing. Each cam retailer has their preferred spring but there are sometimes better options available. As for the rockers themselves, are the Mancini's good enough for daily type use or should I drop the coin for Harland? FWIW, the set Pac 1220 beehives I had with Pac 10 degree retainers gave me 160# on the seat, 370# at .550, and 130-330 with + .050 keepers, on stock 1.875 67 915 heads. Your results could vary, don't know if that's enough spring or not. The pro magnums will be the cheap way to go steel, if you find used iskys they better be mint.... rocker arms unlimited quoted $650 to bush, correct ratio, new adjusters, and new or redone shafts. The comps were $636 when I bought them.
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