header welding question
#271187
03/29/09 11:18 PM
03/29/09 11:18 PM
|
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 388 wine valley
cudaben1968
OP
enthusiast
|
OP
enthusiast
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 388
wine valley
|
so i have two sets of headers, a fenderwell set and a old set of cppas. I have a 68 b'cuda with a rb and victor heads have a motor plate manual steering and manual brakes and dual external oil line pickup. I dont want to hack the heck of of the car to loose truning radius with full on fendewell headers and the cppas dont fit for a darn, both are 2" primaries. is it possible to cut and weld and make my own set of semi fenderwell headers (ie proparts) with a 220v mig on flux wire? also where would i look for slip fit pipes or collectors?????
Half measures availed us nothing. We stood at the turning point.
-Alcoholics Anonymous, The Big Book
|
|
|
Re: header welding question
[Re: cudaben1968]
#271189
03/29/09 11:36 PM
03/29/09 11:36 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
|
Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
|
Quote:
so i have two sets of headers, a fenderwell set and a old set of cppas. I have a 68 b'cuda with a rb and victor heads have a motor plate manual steering and manual brakes and dual external oil line pickup. I dont want to hack the heck of of the car to loose truning radius with full on fendewell headers and the cppas dont fit for a darn, both are 2" primaries. is it possible to cut and weld and make my own set of semi fenderwell headers (ie proparts) with a 220v mig on flux wire? also where would i look for slip fit pipes or collectors?????
Many places have the tubing your looking for, try Jegs or Summit or Google headers.... if your going to make a set of headers DONT use that flux wire, spend the money to get the 75/25 and a regulator, it makes a MUCH nicer weld and looks much better in the end... I tig all the headers I build but tack tac them with the mig
|
|
|
Re: header welding question
[Re: Leigh]
#271191
03/30/09 01:15 PM
03/30/09 01:15 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910 Eighty Four, PA
B G Racing
master
|
master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
|
Quote:
I'm not the greatest welder, but silicon bronze filler material works really good for headers. It flows at a low temp, and is tough.
Tig most all ours with Stainless filler.
|
|
|
Re: header welding question
[Re: Leigh]
#271193
03/30/09 02:48 PM
03/30/09 02:48 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910 Eighty Four, PA
B G Racing
master
|
master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
|
Quote:
My Syncrowave 180 doesn't like stainless. Or maybe it's me. How long did it take you take good at stainless on sheet metal and header tubes?
Lincoln squarewave 200 amp.Do header and cage work with ss filler.Liquid cooled torch.So easy a caveman can do it
|
|
|
Re: header welding question
[Re: Leigh]
#271194
03/30/09 04:48 PM
03/30/09 04:48 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
|
Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
|
Quote:
I'm not the greatest welder, but silicon bronze filler material works really good for headers. It flows at a low temp, and is tough.
Yeah I've done a ton of silicon bronze, I had to seal every muffler seam on all of the mufflers that went into the exhaust certification for production (ALOT of mufflers) just so we made sure we collected all of the gases
|
|
|
Post deleted by Defbob
[Re: hswhemi1]
#271197
03/31/09 09:08 AM
03/31/09 09:08 AM
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
|
|
|
Re: header welding question
[Re: hswhemi1]
#271198
03/31/09 09:23 AM
03/31/09 09:23 AM
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910 Eighty Four, PA
B G Racing
master
|
master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
|
Quote:
Lincoln squarewave 200 amp.Do header and cage work with ss filler.Liquid cooled torch.So easy a caveman can do it
Stainless is NOT the proper filler rod to use on a cage especially a moly cage or a mild steel one for that matter.Why would you use that? A caveman would even know that much!
You are absolutly correct SS filler exceeds the stength found in the CM and MS materials used and is not the recommended filler.With that been said,SS still can be used and is accepted since it makes for a stronger weld with more density.As long as your using a material that is compatiable and as strong as the material being welded or greater(SS)The only concern is it being done properly and the cost is higher.It's like saying CM must be welded with CM filler,if that be the case then every weld on a cage or chassis must be stress relieved.That you chose your knowledge and use your experience to dictate your methodology and application and I will not dispute your comments.I draw from my experience with techniques used in power plants,pressure vessels,heavy equipment repair,and structural building and bridge work.I also rely on advise from some of the best structural professional engineers.I will stand corrected by you but won't change my methods.
|
|
|
Re: header welding question
[Re: hswhemi1]
#271199
03/31/09 09:24 AM
03/31/09 09:24 AM
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207 Menomonee Falls
DemonDust
master
|
master
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207
Menomonee Falls
|
Quote:
Quote:
Lincoln squarewave 200 amp.Do header and cage work with ss filler.Liquid cooled torch.So easy a caveman can do it
Stainless is NOT the proper filler rod to use on a cage especially a moly cage or a mild steel one for that matter.Why would you use that? A caveman would even know that much!
I use E70S for most tig welding I do on MS.
|
|
|
Re: header welding question
[Re: DemonDust]
#271201
03/31/09 10:36 AM
03/31/09 10:36 AM
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910 Eighty Four, PA
B G Racing
master
|
master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
|
We used 80SD2 on most all MS and CM in the past,with the tensile stength of aprox.80,000,we switched to 309 SS with the tensile strength of aprox 88,000.For header work which was the orginal question we like the SS since we the welds are more impervious to rust(if you notice exhaust generally rust at and around the welds quicker (caused by hydrocarbon contamination)but it has little effect on SS.For sheetz and giggles I call Glenn Smith PE at Gannett Fleming Inc,he's their senior bridge engineer and Rob Conner,a structural professor at Prudue University and I feel more confident(warm and fuzzy)about my statement.Not meaning to offend anyone,just didn't want to be passing on any bad advise.
Last edited by B G Racing; 03/31/09 01:52 PM.
|
|
|
Re: header welding question
[Re: B G Racing]
#271202
03/31/09 10:40 AM
03/31/09 10:40 AM
|
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
|
Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
|
Here ya go Q. What filler material do I use? A. Although there are several good filler materials, ER80S-D2, is one you should consider. This filler material is capable of producing welds that approximate the strength of 4130. ER-70S-2 is an acceptable alternative to ER80S-D2, as is ER70S-6, although the weld strength will be slightly lower. Q. When I use ER70S-2 filler material, do I give up strength for elongation? A. Yes. The filler material, when diluted with the parent material, will typically undermatch the 4130. However, with the proper joint design (such as cluster or gusset, for example), the cross-sectional area and linear inches of weld can compensate for the reduced weld deposit strength. Q. Why is 4130 filler metal not recommended? A. 4130 filler typically is used for applications where the weld will be heat treated. Due to its higher hardness and reduced elongation, it is not recommended for sporting applications such as experimental airplanes, race car frames, roll cages, etc. Q. Can I weld 4130 using any other filler metals? A. Some fabricators prefer to use austenitic stainless steel fillers to weld 4130 tubing. This is acceptable provided 310 or 312 stainless steel fillers are used. Other stainless steel fillers can cause cracking. Stainless filler material is typically more expensive. This is from Lincoln welding A high percentage of the welding I do is with 312ss or ER70s-2
Last edited by MR_P_BODY; 03/31/09 10:49 AM.
|
|
|
Post deleted by Defbob
[Re: B G Racing]
#271206
03/31/09 06:53 PM
03/31/09 06:53 PM
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
Anonymous
Unregistered
|
|
|
|
|
|