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Cant drive my dart anymore #2636290
03/24/19 10:01 AM
03/24/19 10:01 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,863
middle Tennessee
mopower440 Offline OP
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mopower440  Offline OP
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middle Tennessee
I decided to get my dart out yesterday and wash it up and take it out driving being it was so nice out. Been sitting for 8 months or so in the garage. I took it down the road and had fun with it. I was turning around and heard a pop under the front end and i had never heard that before. I got it back home and raised the front end up and the the upper control arm bushings and the upper ball joints are absolutely SHOT! I almost pooped my pants when i saw how loose they were! I immediately thanked God for letting me still be here and for my car not being destroyed being i was going pretty fast in it and it sure could have come apart on me. Anyways, now i dont know what to do because i dont know anyone in the area that could do the front end rebuild. This may sound stupid being i built the engine and everything else myself, but i dont know much about front end stuff and dont have the presses or tools for ball joints and stuff, then theres the torsion bars..hearing horror stories about them hurting people really bad because they didnt know what they were doing.. I have a really nice kelsey-hayes disk brake set up sitting in the garage that i bought almost 20 years ago that ive never put on the car because i dont feel confident in doing the work.. So, i dont know what im going to do about getting this front end rebuilt.

Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: mopower440] #2636299
03/24/19 10:23 AM
03/24/19 10:23 AM
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Posts: 3,805
Arlington, Texas
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bobby66 Offline
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Dig out your service manual and read through the procedures a few times. It's a chore, but not really a bad job. You'll need a socket for the upper ball joints. The rest of the stuff you probably have already. Loosen the tension on the torsion bars and they are pretty harmless. Take your time, and be careful. You'll be back on the road soon.

Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: bobby66] #2636302
03/24/19 10:29 AM
03/24/19 10:29 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,863
middle Tennessee
mopower440 Offline OP
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mopower440  Offline OP
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Is that socket still available for the upper ball joint?

Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: mopower440] #2636303
03/24/19 10:30 AM
03/24/19 10:30 AM
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Posts: 12,036
Benton, IL.
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DaveRS23 Offline
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Benton, IL.
Really not that big a deal. Just typical suspension wear items that need replaced. If you only need the upper items replaced (which I doubt) all you need to do is release the preload on the torsion bars and you are good to go on the upper items. You don't even need a press. Except for the alignment, any competent mechanic should be able to change the upper ball joints and bushings. It's not that hard.

Now the lower control arm bushings are quite a bit more involved. And unless they have been changed, will be in similar condition.

If we weren't so far apart, I would help you with it.


Master, again and still
Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: mopower440] #2636304
03/24/19 10:30 AM
03/24/19 10:30 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 42,714
Spokane Washington
ScottSmith_Harms Offline
Mr Wizzard
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Spokane Washington
I got my first car when I was 16, a 1973 Gold Duster. It was as clean as a pin and ran perfectly until one day when the lights dimmed and it sputtered to a stop. After having it towed home my dad (who knows cars very well) helped me identify the problem (bad alternator) and pointed it out to me (nope, I didn't even know what an alternator was yet). He pointed to his toolbox and handed me a Chiltons Repair manual and said " Now go fix it". That's how I learned, I loved the challenge and learned that I enjoyed working on the car, within a month I was doing engine swaps.

My suggestion? dig into it and give it a try, it's not that difficult (or dangerous) if you do some reading first (also, Youtube can be very helpful). Most muffler or brake shops can do any pressing out of parts on the cheap if you don't want to buy special tools but these days you can get a lot of the items you'll need dirt cheap at Harbor Freight, or used on Craigslist.

.02

Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: mopower440] #2636329
03/24/19 11:03 AM
03/24/19 11:03 AM
Joined: Feb 2003
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Andrewh Offline
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Originally Posted by mopower440
Is that socket still available for the upper ball joint?


yeah, from several sources now.
when I bought mine, it was a specialty item and I had to find a snapon truck to get it.
today you can pick one up pretty much at any of the major sellers.
heck some parts stores even "rent" it out.

you didn't say what year dart, as that makes a difference.
The a-bods through model year 1972 use the smaller socket.
73-76 use the larger.
which is the same as the b body and c-body size.
Middle size as there is a larger for trucks and some d-bodies.

This guy used a weird 10 dollar socket
https://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/threads/10-upper-ball-joint-socket-really.280871/

but I have seen them as cheap as 12 bucks for the correct one.

Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: Andrewh] #2636344
03/24/19 11:24 AM
03/24/19 11:24 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 528
SW CO
HemiSportFury Offline
mopar
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SW CO
In addition to the upper ball joint socket mentioned above the only other special tool that is very helpful is a torsion bar removal tool. There are several different styles available, just check any of the Mopar suppliers. You may be able to improvise something yourself but be sure to not nick or gouge the torsion bar or you will create a stress riser and a place for it to break. Otherwise I've always been able to improvise tools for removing or installing bushing etc.

Go for it yourself so you know it will be done right!


'64 Sport Fury, 528 Hemi, FiTech EFI, 4-speed, 4.10 Dana 60
'57 Belvedere 2dr sedan, current project in process
'19 Cherokee Trail Hawk Elite
'03 Ram 2500 CTD HO, 6-speed 214,000 miles and still going strong
Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: mopower440] #2636348
03/24/19 11:27 AM
03/24/19 11:27 AM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 604
TN
1DGEMAN Offline
mopar
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Where in Middle TN are you?


Real Men shift for themselves
Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: Andrewh] #2636349
03/24/19 11:28 AM
03/24/19 11:28 AM
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
Supercuda Offline
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up yours
Whomever told you this

Quote
then there's the torsion bars..hearing horror stories about them hurting people really bad because they didn't know what they were doing.


must have some seriously brown eyes.

Unless you drop the thing on your foot or something like that.


They say there are no such thing as a stupid question.
They say there is always the exception that proves the rule.
Don't be the exception.
Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: Supercuda] #2636354
03/24/19 11:36 AM
03/24/19 11:36 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,976
Chilliwack B.C. Canada
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RUNCHARGER Offline
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Chilliwack B.C. Canada
If you're careful you can use a pipewrench with a cheater bar to remove the upper balljoints (do them with the A-arms still mounted in the car). The upper bushings are pretty easy to change as well. No need to undo the torsion bars to service the upper A-arms However you best check the condition of the lower balljoints, bushings and tie rod ends, pitman and idler arm as well.


Sheldon
Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: mopower440] #2636366
03/24/19 12:00 PM
03/24/19 12:00 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,363
Cotati, CA
Dave Hall Offline
top fuel
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Cotati, CA
You can buy the entire rebuilt a-arm as well. No need for special tools.

Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: Dave Hall] #2636434
03/24/19 01:30 PM
03/24/19 01:30 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 7,982
Scranton, PA
Montclaire Offline
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Montclaire  Offline
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Originally Posted by Dave Hall
You can buy the entire rebuilt a-arm as well. No need for special tools.


X2 on this

Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: Montclaire] #2636465
03/24/19 02:43 PM
03/24/19 02:43 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,863
middle Tennessee
mopower440 Offline OP
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mopower440  Offline OP
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middle Tennessee
we have a regular press at work (GM shop) that i could get someone to do the A-arm bushings. I think what im worried about is the torsion bars..I have no clue about them..I did NOT know you needed a special tool to remove them though..?

Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: Montclaire] #2636468
03/24/19 02:49 PM
03/24/19 02:49 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,863
middle Tennessee
mopower440 Offline OP
master
mopower440  Offline OP
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Posts: 2,863
middle Tennessee
Originally Posted by Montclaire
Originally Posted by Dave Hall
You can buy the entire rebuilt a-arm as well. No need for special tools.


X2 on this


Can you buy the rebuilt lower control arms with new bushings already installed being the lower is the one thats said to be the pain to replace the bushings?

Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: mopower440] #2636474
03/24/19 03:01 PM
03/24/19 03:01 PM
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Posts: 5,357
Rancho Cordova, California (Sa...
hemi71x Offline
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Originally Posted by mopower440
Originally Posted by Montclaire
Originally Posted by Dave Hall
You can buy the entire rebuilt a-arm as well. No need for special tools.


X2 on this


Can you buy the rebuilt lower control arms with new bushings already installed being the lower is the one thats said to be the pain to replace the bushings?


I sell them rebuilt.

https://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopa...ll-the-62-76-a-body-line-of-cars.427755/


RF-4C Phantom 69-370 Zweibrucken, Germany

Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: mopower440] #2636480
03/24/19 03:13 PM
03/24/19 03:13 PM
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Posts: 8,671
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Andrewh Offline
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Originally Posted by mopower440
we have a regular press at work (GM shop) that i could get someone to do the A-arm bushings. I think what im worried about is the torsion bars..I have no clue about them..I did NOT know you needed a special tool to remove them though..?


torson bars are no big deal.
you don't need special tools.
I have pulled 4 or 5 sets doing rebuilds or replacing them over the years and have never needed any special tools.

Generally I raise the front end, then loosen the adjuster on the torsion bars till they have slack, and then have a jack stand just a little lower than the lower control arm. then pop the upper ball joint. When it gives, it drops right one to the jack stand, controling its spring.
Then I use a jack to pick it up and then lower it with the knuckle till it is unloaded and just hanging there.
you can then use another jack or jack stand to support the knuckle as you unbolt the lower ball joint.

Then you can use like a tie rod puller to break the lower balljoint off the lower control arm.

Or you can do it the lower balljoint first and unbolt it from the knuckle later, instead of popping the upper first.

Once the lower control arm is down all the way no tension is left on the torsion bar.

I then note the indexing and if it is resting on part of the frame.
That is the flats on the torsion bar orientation to the lower control arm.

there is a retaining clip in the rear of the torsion bar, and all the years of crud have to be cleaned out.

Unbolt the lower control arm pin and hammer it back to push out the torsion bar.
hammer the control arm forward with the torsion bar cocked a bit to lock it in place to get the lower control arm off.

probably a few items like the shocks and strut rods I missed. but those all unbolt first too.
Might as well replace all those bushings while you are under there.

I usually take a week. unbolt it all, then clean them up and repaint pieces, then bolt it all back together.

you can piece together parts, or order a kit from PST or some others.

As said above, you can order parts from places like firm feel with stuff already installed on it.
like ball joints and bushings.
but most machine shops will do the press in and out for 10 bucks a bushing. Depending on if they have done it before.

Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: Andrewh] #2636484
03/24/19 03:22 PM
03/24/19 03:22 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,363
Cotati, CA
Dave Hall Offline
top fuel
Dave Hall  Offline
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Posts: 2,363
Cotati, CA
Originally Posted by Andrewh
Originally Posted by mopower440
we have a regular press at work (GM shop) that i could get someone to do the A-arm bushings. I think what im worried about is the torsion bars..I have no clue about them..I did NOT know you needed a special tool to remove them though..?


torson bars are no big deal.
you don't need special tools.
I have pulled 4 or 5 sets doing rebuilds or replacing them over the years and have never needed any special tools.

Generally I raise the front end, then loosen the adjuster on the torsion bars till they have slack, and then have a jack stand just a little lower than the lower control arm. then pop the upper ball joint. When it gives, it drops right one to the jack stand, controling its spring.
Then I use a jack to pick it up and then lower it with the knuckle till it is unloaded and just hanging there.
you can then use another jack or jack stand to support the knuckle as you unbolt the lower ball joint.

Then you can use like a tie rod puller to break the lower balljoint off the lower control arm.

Or you can do it the lower balljoint first and unbolt it from the knuckle later, instead of popping the upper first.

Once the lower control arm is down all the way no tension is left on the torsion bar.

I then note the indexing and if it is resting on part of the frame.
That is the flats on the torsion bar orientation to the lower control arm.

there is a retaining clip in the rear of the torsion bar, and all the years of crud have to be cleaned out.

Unbolt the lower control arm pin and hammer it back to push out the torsion bar.
hammer the control arm forward with the torsion bar cocked a bit to lock it in place to get the lower control arm off.

probably a few items like the shocks and strut rods I missed. but those all unbolt first too.
Might as well replace all those bushings while you are under there.

I usually take a week. unbolt it all, then clean them up and repaint pieces, then bolt it all back together.

you can piece together parts, or order a kit from PST or some others.

As said above, you can order parts from places like firm feel with stuff already installed on it.
like ball joints and bushings.
but most machine shops will do the press in and out for 10 bucks a bushing. Depending on if they have done it before.


All good stuff but those LCA bushings are pretty stupid to get out. The torsion bars are really simple and I have no problem getting them out of the way to replace a starter for instance. To the OP I think you should look at it as an opportunity to either get dirty with it, it is a filthy job, or upgrade the parts and take it to a pro to set up for you. Buy a factory service manual for the car or car line. They are the single best investment for keeping this old crud running.

Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: hemi71x] #2636503
03/24/19 04:09 PM
03/24/19 04:09 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,863
middle Tennessee
mopower440 Offline OP
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middle Tennessee
I like this idea! So they are literally ready to bolt back in the car besides painting them? Do they need primer first or is this coating on them ready to accept paint? These alone seem like they could help me a lot..Im not sure how hard the bushings would be to replace by our front end guy at work with our press so maybe have to do this.. Are they hard to replace even when you have a press?

Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: RUNCHARGER] #2636520
03/24/19 04:35 PM
03/24/19 04:35 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,405
Michigan
MarkZ Offline
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Michigan
When I did the front end on my car I pulled the control arms out and took them to a shop to have ball joints and bushing pressed in. You don't have to do that yourself if you don't want to.


1987 Fifth Avenue - 512/518/D60
Re: Cant drive my dart anymore [Re: MarkZ] #2636576
03/24/19 06:46 PM
03/24/19 06:46 PM
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
Supercuda Offline
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I sure hope you didn't get you ball joints pressed in. they are screw in types


They say there are no such thing as a stupid question.
They say there is always the exception that proves the rule.
Don't be the exception.
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