got to re think this...SB vs BB
#2625953
02/25/19 05:51 PM
02/25/19 05:51 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,696 On the parachute mount
n20mstr
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,696
On the parachute mount
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Hmmmmm, with these new bests being thrown out there by NA smallblocks...im starting to rethink it....\
Congrats guys, got to respect doing a lot with a little !! Im starting to get nervous !\
....BAD A$$ STREET CAR.....
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Re: got to re think this...SB vs BB
[Re: n20mstr]
#2626060
02/25/19 09:16 PM
02/25/19 09:16 PM
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 3,036 bean town ....Ca
WHITEDART
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 3,036
bean town ....Ca
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Hmmmmm, with these new bests being thrown out there by NA smallblocks...im starting to rethink it....\
Congrats guys, got to respect doing a lot with a little !! Im starting to get nervous !\
. Hold on not so quick.. in my opinion we are still lacking a Quality Block... I hear there's an aftermarket block that is getting better.. but I think there's a lot to be proven and verified with that
In the 8s N/A.with Brett miller W8's 5.07 at 133 at 2700lb
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Re: got to re think this...SB vs BB
[Re: WHITEDART]
#2626065
02/25/19 09:22 PM
02/25/19 09:22 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,197 PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
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"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,197
PA.
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Although we have to congratulate those with new bests keep in mind track and weather conditions. I hear the conditions were great
1970 Duster Edelbrock headed 408 5.984@112.52 422 Indy headed small block 5.982@112.56 mph 9.42@138.27
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
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Re: got to re think this...SB vs BB
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#2626071
02/25/19 09:32 PM
02/25/19 09:32 PM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,082 St. Paul , Mn.
tubtar
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,082
St. Paul , Mn.
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Although we have to congratulate those with new bests keep in mind track and weather conditions. I hear the conditions were great You say that like it was a bad thing. LOL
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Re: got to re think this...SB vs BB
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#2626072
02/25/19 09:38 PM
02/25/19 09:38 PM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,685 W. Kentucky
justinp61
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,685
W. Kentucky
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Although we have to congratulate those with new bests keep in mind track and weather conditions. I hear the conditions were great I like running in good air and track conditions.
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Re: got to re think this...SB vs BB
[Re: n20mstr]
#2626075
02/25/19 09:53 PM
02/25/19 09:53 PM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,540 Milwaukee WI
TRENDZ
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,540
Milwaukee WI
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No doubt that the results being seen are impressive. I just don’t see why anyone would wait around for a questionable block for either big or small block when you can get a new, real MOPAR r5p7 block any day of the week for $1500. Cheap heads capable of 400 cfm, 60 mm cam, deep skirt cross bolted mains, and 6 bolt head retention. Get an 800 hp n/a 358” running engine with a belt drive, jesel rockers, dry sump, billet crank, etc... for $15000. Put a stroked crank in it and see what happens!
"use it 'till it breaks, replace as needed"
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Re: got to re think this...SB vs BB
[Re: tubtar]
#2626077
02/25/19 09:55 PM
02/25/19 09:55 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,197 PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
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"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,197
PA.
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Although we have to congratulate those with new bests keep in mind track and weather conditions. I hear the conditions were great You say that like it was a bad thing. LOL Not at all but when comparing apples to apples you can’t compare an apple from the desert to one raised in Pa.
1970 Duster Edelbrock headed 408 5.984@112.52 422 Indy headed small block 5.982@112.56 mph 9.42@138.27
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
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Re: got to re think this...SB vs BB
[Re: TRENDZ]
#2626082
02/25/19 10:11 PM
02/25/19 10:11 PM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,082 St. Paul , Mn.
tubtar
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,082
St. Paul , Mn.
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No doubt that the results being seen are impressive. I just don’t see why anyone would wait around for a questionable block for either big or small block when you can get a new, real MOPAR r5p7 block any day of the week for $1500. Cheap heads capable of 400 cfm, 60 mm cam, deep skirt cross bolted mains, and 6 bolt head retention. Get an 800 hp n/a 358” running engine with a belt drive, jesel rockers, dry sump, billet crank, etc... for $15000. Put a stroked crank in it and see what happens! They are a decent value for what they are , but you are really limited by the architecture of the engines too. Big strokes are not possible. And changes to the package as finished for NASCAR are not cheap. I would think they would be a good package for Comp. eliminator , and you don't see them there either........I sure haven't.
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Re: got to re think this...SB vs BB
[Re: n20mstr]
#2626121
02/25/19 11:57 PM
02/25/19 11:57 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,016 Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
gregsdart
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,016
Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
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If i ever were to build another race motor, i would take a hard look at a stroked 6.4 gen3 hemi alky injected. With parts drying up for sb bb, it might be the best option unless you have deep pockets and want over 800 hp.
8..603 156 mph best, 2905 lbs 549, indy 572-13, alky
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Re: got to re think this...SB vs BB
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#2626143
02/26/19 12:35 AM
02/26/19 12:35 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,696 On the parachute mount
n20mstr
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,696
On the parachute mount
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Although we have to congratulate those with new bests keep in mind track and weather conditions. I hear the conditions were great Time slips don't lie...the results are impressive who cares about the conditions. Lol I'm impressed !
....BAD A$$ STREET CAR.....
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Re: got to re think this...SB vs BB
[Re: tubtar]
#2626198
02/26/19 03:37 AM
02/26/19 03:37 AM
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 13,202 aZLiViN
J_BODY
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 13,202
aZLiViN
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I wasn't comparing...........I was admiring. That's all. We might see mine shaft air in Mn. a couple times a season. I hope I am there for it. Top End Dragway in the fall....
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Re: got to re think this...SB vs BB
[Re: J_BODY]
#2626205
02/26/19 04:43 AM
02/26/19 04:43 AM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,454 Glendora Ca.
Just-a-dart
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,454
Glendora Ca.
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I had my weather station at Irwindale MRM Sat. 2/23
12:44pm 68.5* 29.85"bar 26.8%hum 1065'da 2.10pm 70.3* 29.80" 22.3% 1207' 4.12pm 69.9 29.79" 27.6% 1247'
For us this is good.
"Just a Bracket car dressed up like a streetcar"
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Re: got to re think this...SB vs BB
[Re: tubtar]
#2626208
02/26/19 05:12 AM
02/26/19 05:12 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,149 Melbourne , Australia
LA360
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,149
Melbourne , Australia
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No doubt that the results being seen are impressive. I just don’t see why anyone would wait around for a questionable block for either big or small block when you can get a new, real MOPAR r5p7 block any day of the week for $1500. Cheap heads capable of 400 cfm, 60 mm cam, deep skirt cross bolted mains, and 6 bolt head retention. Get an 800 hp n/a 358” running engine with a belt drive, jesel rockers, dry sump, billet crank, etc... for $15000. Put a stroked crank in it and see what happens! They are a decent value for what they are , but you are really limited by the architecture of the engines too. Big strokes are not possible. And changes to the package as finished for NASCAR are not cheap. I would think they would be a good package for Comp. eliminator , and you don't see them there either........I sure haven't. The bargains with that platform have dried up. There are some really cheap R6/P8 deals out there, but no one is jumping on them. A friend looked at doing a A/EA engine based on the R5/P7 platform, but no one was really interested. He sold the parts off, I've got the camshaft sitting here for one of my engines.
Alan Jones
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Re: got to re think this...SB vs BB
[Re: tubtar]
#2626211
02/26/19 08:39 AM
02/26/19 08:39 AM
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,400 Trumbauersville PA
ric3xrt
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,400
Trumbauersville PA
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No doubt that the results being seen are impressive. I just don’t see why anyone would wait around for a questionable block for either big or small block when you can get a new, real MOPAR r5p7 block any day of the week for $1500. Cheap heads capable of 400 cfm, 60 mm cam, deep skirt cross bolted mains, and 6 bolt head retention. Get an 800 hp n/a 358” running engine with a belt drive, jesel rockers, dry sump, billet crank, etc... for $15000. Put a stroked crank in it and see what happens! They are a decent value for what they are , but you are really limited by the architecture of the engines too. Big strokes are not possible. And changes to the package as finished for NASCAR are not cheap. I would think they would be a good package for Comp. eliminator , and you don't see them there either........I sure haven't. They work best in the 390-420 inch displacement, unreliable grenades over 420 , bellhousing can be an issue, there is a Quick time bellhousing for them(8082) which is designed for use a Jerico type bolt pattern , some work and you can get a TKO bolted up...parts are out there, but like the SBM, good blocks are starting to dry up.
Last edited by ric3xrt; 02/26/19 08:39 AM.
Truth has no agenda, but those with an agenda make their own truth. Some of us are so open minded they only see their View
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Re: got to re think this...SB vs BB
[Re: gregsdart]
#2626216
02/26/19 09:03 AM
02/26/19 09:03 AM
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,400 Trumbauersville PA
ric3xrt
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,400
Trumbauersville PA
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If i ever were to build another race motor, i would take a hard look at a stroked 6.4 gen3 hemi alky injected. With parts drying up for sb bb, it might be the best option unless you have deep pockets and want over 800 hp. FWIW , Best approach (in my opinion) to the G3 is get a short block (68226133AA-truck,68223196AB-SRT) for roughly 2900-3300 depending on dealer and what they want for core,the 392SRT short block from Rockauto is $2,910+$500.00 core so total of $3,405.79 with out core FWIW Summit is 4200ish. Another 3-5k for heads and odds and ends for about 10K you can have a 550/650hp G3 Hemi , all NEW PARTS bracket/street engine obviously it can be done cheaper with used parts ...are there better cost option out there for the other Mopar engine platforms...yes there is but only your pocket book can answer what is the best long/short term option for you, Big HP #s from the G3 NA are out there , it's costly at this point , the development and money investment is about 20 years behind the other engine platforms
Last edited by ric3xrt; 02/26/19 09:10 AM.
Truth has no agenda, but those with an agenda make their own truth. Some of us are so open minded they only see their View
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Re: got to re think this...SB vs BB
[Re: ric3xrt]
#2626255
02/26/19 12:00 PM
02/26/19 12:00 PM
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 4,255 Canada
WO23Coronet
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 4,255
Canada
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If i ever were to build another race motor, i would take a hard look at a stroked 6.4 gen3 hemi alky injected. With parts drying up for sb bb, it might be the best option unless you have deep pockets and want over 800 hp. FWIW , Best approach (in my opinion) to the G3 is get a short block (68226133AA-truck,68223196AB-SRT) for roughly 2900-3300 depending on dealer and what they want for core,the 392SRT short block from Rockauto is $2,910+$500.00 core so total of $3,405.79 with out core FWIW Summit is 4200ish. Another 3-5k for heads and odds and ends for about 10K you can have a 550/650hp G3 Hemi , all NEW PARTS bracket/street engine obviously it can be done cheaper with used parts ...are there better cost option out there for the other Mopar engine platforms...yes there is but only your pocket book can answer what is the best long/short term option for you, Big HP #s from the G3 NA are out there , it's costly at this point , the development and money investment is about 20 years behind the other engine platforms Could you give a recipe for a high end G3 and what kind of hp it would put out? 800hp?
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Re: got to re think this...SB vs BB
[Re: n20mstr]
#2626264
02/26/19 12:24 PM
02/26/19 12:24 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,544 Syracuse,NY
CompWedgeEngines
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,544
Syracuse,NY
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I love seeing these NA small blocks fly. They sound nasty, and are totally impressive. What Brett has done with these heads and intakes is just incredible.HOWEVER, how many of these cars race weekly, have 250 runs on them ? ( i truely dont know, it seems to me only a handful are really out there making passes tho) I have a pretty fair idea, but, what is the REAL cost of building one of these ? Whitedart,( and maybe Brett, Andy and????) if you had to put a number to what it cost you, what would be fair and reasonable to throw out there, to ACTUALLY build one of these engines? Lets assume, that someone had to pay for all the block work ( assuming its a Ritter), heads, intake, modifications,pistons,coatings,cams, valvetrain,making parts that WILL fit, hand machining,( not deals with this guy or that gut either, straight up have to pay for stuff) and so on and so forth? Lets throw a real number out there. I am not on here enough to know who else runs one of these combos,other than what I see Brett working on, I kinda watch from another viewpoint so to speak.
Let me be VERY VERY clear, I love this stuff, I am not playing negative nelly here. I simply want to be 100% honest about what one of these would cost, and how much cost for maintenance and repairs, if it was raced in a weekly series, or weekly " quick something" or "index" series. I hope we see 10 more of these combos this year, my point is, its probably way out of line for most. To those that can and do, its great.Its a huge commitment, that only a few can and will make I think.Look forward to the guys who have done this, with real world numbers , time and experience, Congrats to the guys running these numbers, its impressive.Thanks.
RIP Monte Smith
Your work is a reflection of yourself, autograph it with quality.
WD for Diamond Pistons,Sidewinder cylinder heads, Wiseco, K1 rods and cranks,BAM lifters, Morel lifters, Molnar Technologies, Harland Sharp, Pro Gear, Cometic, King Engine Bearings and many others.
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