Re: Bad Block News Today
[Re: WO23Coronet]
#2621084
02/14/19 01:33 AM
02/14/19 01:33 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,317 Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,317
Bend,OR USA
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I think Mopar Action did one back in the day (It was on 440 blocks but probably still applicable to 400's) and they found the later blocks were cast thicker and more consistent, but were of a slightly softer grade of cast iron. I'd look for a later block and try your luck there All 440 block, regardless of the year cast, are no where near as good as a decent 400 block for building, trust me on that You need to remember that not all magazine writers are real hot rod guys with hands on experiences that know something about what there writing about, I've seen that personally time and time again
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: Bad Block News Today
[Re: HDNMOPERS]
#2621087
02/14/19 01:49 AM
02/14/19 01:49 AM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,203 PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
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"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,203
PA.
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I’ve ran 440 blocks for years without concrete or sonic checking them. One 440 block (Stroker) cracked up thru the mains after 275 eight second passes and was found when I tore it down for rebuild. Sometimes you don’t want to know how bad things are. Lol 😂
1970 Duster Edelbrock headed 408 5.984@112.52 422 Indy headed small block 5.982@112.56 mph 9.42@138.27
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
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Re: Bad Block News Today
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#2621125
02/14/19 03:21 AM
02/14/19 03:21 AM
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 4,256 Canada
WO23Coronet
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 4,256
Canada
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I think Mopar Action did one back in the day (It was on 440 blocks but probably still applicable to 400's) and they found the later blocks were cast thicker and more consistent, but were of a slightly softer grade of cast iron. I'd look for a later block and try your luck there All 440 block, regardless of the year cast, are no where near as good as a decent 400 block for building, trust me on that You need to remember that not all magazine writers are real hot rod guys with hands on experiences that know something about what there writing about, I've seen that personally time and time again Cab, I wasn't espousing the benefits of a 440 block over a 400 block (there are none, the 400 is a better foundation to build on for sure). I was merely pointing out Mopar Actions experience, in an article written by Ehrenberg (sp?), that the later blocks were thicker and more consistent. Yes they were 440 blocks but I imagine it transfers over to the 400's as well. If I remember correctly they tested around 20 blocks. Love him or hate him Ehrenberg seems to be at least a legit car guy who gets his hands dirty
Last edited by WO23Coronet; 02/14/19 03:23 AM.
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Re: Bad Block News Today
[Re: HDNMOPERS]
#2621533
02/15/19 03:10 AM
02/15/19 03:10 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,278 Mission BC
10sec440
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,278
Mission BC
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I'll tell you my block story. I've ran 570ish HP 440's for years (10.20's 3400lbs) and had a lot of luck with them. I'd split a cylinder or a main web once in a while and machine up another old block and use all my guts. After 18 seasons of this,(3500+ passes) I got the urge to go faster finally.
I thought about going Gen3 and did all the math. The engine build is about the same if you're starting from scratch,but the Gen3 you have to change the trans,buy headers,oil pan, trans sheild,a thousand dollar intake, the MSD box etc and it all adds up.
I went with the low deck 511 stroker since I had one of the good 230 blocks with the thick webbing I had been holding onto for 20 some years.You could see the core shift in the front cam tunnel bore. The block was good and thick, except right near one of the upper head bolt holes it was under .100" so I decided not to use it.Went through 3 other blocks before we found one that was suitable,the thinnest spot we could find was just over .200" thick.
Pump gas motor, no fill, Indy -1 heads and it ran good, 9.70's but it didn't last the full season and it split #1 cylinder down low on the thrust side.I finally found another usable block recently after checking 3 more. This one is getting a half fill and going together using all the same parts.
I kind of regret going low deck, the stock block has it's limits and the aftermarket block situation is not good. I think it's possible there might be some more choices coming up for the RB, but not the low deck.Looking back, if I had it to do over again I would probably go Gen3. The stock block is pretty stout, and there are so many around it's like 440's were in the 80's, dime a dozen.
Last edited by 10sec440; 02/15/19 03:12 AM.
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Re: Bad Block News Today
[Re: 10sec440]
#2621801
02/15/19 07:26 PM
02/15/19 07:26 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,094 central texas
krautrock
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,094
central texas
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I'll tell you my block story. I've ran 570ish HP 440's for years (10.20's 3400lbs) and had a lot of luck with them. I'd split a cylinder or a main web once in a while and machine up another old block and use all my guts. After 18 seasons of this,(3500+ passes) I got the urge to go faster finally.
I thought about going Gen3 and did all the math. The engine build is about the same if you're starting from scratch,but the Gen3 you have to change the trans,buy headers,oil pan, trans sheild,a thousand dollar intake, the MSD box etc and it all adds up.
I went with the low deck 511 stroker since I had one of the good 230 blocks with the thick webbing I had been holding onto for 20 some years.You could see the core shift in the front cam tunnel bore. The block was good and thick, except right near one of the upper head bolt holes it was under .100" so I decided not to use it.Went through 3 other blocks before we found one that was suitable,the thinnest spot we could find was just over .200" thick.
Pump gas motor, no fill, Indy -1 heads and it ran good, 9.70's but it didn't last the full season and it split #1 cylinder down low on the thrust side.I finally found another usable block recently after checking 3 more. This one is getting a half fill and going together using all the same parts.
I kind of regret going low deck, the stock block has it's limits and the aftermarket block situation is not good. I think it's possible there might be some more choices coming up for the RB, but not the low deck.Looking back, if I had it to do over again I would probably go Gen3. The stock block is pretty stout, and there are so many around it's like 440's were in the 80's, dime a dozen. you think the long stroke and shorter rods had more to do with the failure than the extra power? what rod length were you using?
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Re: Bad Block News Today
[Re: krautrock]
#2621861
02/15/19 09:37 PM
02/15/19 09:37 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,918 S.E. Michigan
ZIPPY
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,918
S.E. Michigan
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you think the long stroke and shorter rods had more to do with the failure than the extra power? what rod length were you using?
See, that's what I was thinking as well, but what do I know. (Personally never went over 3.75 until I got an aftermarket block, now I'm going way up to 4.500...but the reason for the 3.75 was much more about being broke, and much less about being smart)
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Re: Bad Block News Today
[Re: HDNMOPERS]
#2621979
02/16/19 01:58 AM
02/16/19 01:58 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,317 Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,317
Bend,OR USA
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My first pump gas 400 stroker 511 C.I. motor ended up needing four sleeves in it, two due to the block being blown out on the deck surface between # 4 and 6 and two on the other side(#1 and #7) due to bad pitting that boring it to 4.375 wouldn't clean out I already had the 6.800 long BB Chevy type H beam rods and custom forged Ross dished pistons along with the Ohio Crankshaft CO 4.25 stroke low deck crank and I couldn't find another good 400 block so I went with having four ductile iron sleeves installed and I never regretted doing that I also had a set of Mopar brand Ductile iron main caps installed with ARP main studs I beat on that motor from day one and it exceeded all my expectations and never let me down, Fast TOO One of the past members on here, R.I.P. Dan couldn't, wouldn't believe me when I posted the first dyno testing results when that motor had a set of ported with big valves BB 906 heads with 9.25 to 1 compression ratio and was 511 C.I. with a low deck eddy six pack set up on it. That combination made 612 HP at 5500 RPM and 644 Ft. Lbs. torque at 4500 RPM on CA 91 octane pump swill I ended up changing to four different sets of heads and ended up changing the crankshaft from the original 4.25 stroke to 4.300 stroke to raise the pistons up from -.025 down to zero deck to raise the compression from 9.25 to 1 to 10.29 to 1. I kept the same block,cam shaft, rods and pistons and I swapped the heads and intakes only after the crankshaft change the second year. It ended up with a set of Indy SR Max wedge port size heads and a Indy 400-3 intake with a 1050 CFM Holley 9375 non HP Dominator carb. on it which made 727 HP at 7000 RPM on a DTS engine dyno on 92 octane Oregon pump swill in Klamath Falls, OR which is at 4300 ft. altitude I now have several other 400 block stroker motors that I built and I'm looking forward to using on the street and at the track BTW, that motor had a custom ground Com Cams solid roller cam that liked to RPM, I have shifted that motor with the 440 type heads and six pack at 7800 RPM and it wasn't slowing down on the RPM gain per second in second gear I ended up trying to shift it between 7000 to 7300 RPM from then on That stupid motor didn't follow any of the normal rules for six pack motors, but it wasn't a normal six pack motor either Don't be afraid to experiment
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: Bad Block News Today
[Re: HDNMOPERS]
#2621989
02/16/19 02:17 AM
02/16/19 02:17 AM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,203 PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
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"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,203
PA.
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You guys can send me all these scrap blocks. I’ll find a use for them
1970 Duster Edelbrock headed 408 5.984@112.52 422 Indy headed small block 5.982@112.56 mph 9.42@138.27
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
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Re: Bad Block News Today
[Re: 71birdJ68]
#2622061
02/16/19 12:01 PM
02/16/19 12:01 PM
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Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 150 It's Complicated
HDNMOPERS
OP
member
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OP
member
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 150
It's Complicated
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Sent you a PM if you don't see it shoot me a call Im in Rogersville number is 423-921-4975 or send me your number
Last edited by HDNMOPERS; 02/16/19 12:07 PM.
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Re: Bad Block News Today
[Re: HDNMOPERS]
#2622583
02/17/19 04:39 PM
02/17/19 04:39 PM
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,422 Pittsburgh PA
Eric
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,422
Pittsburgh PA
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Got a line 2 blocks. Little bit of a road trip to look at them in the Carolinas. Guy from on here MSGd me he has one. But it's in Oregon. Nothing local. Which sucks because I passed on 2 a while back. In regards to my build. Pretty confident if I can just find a good block. I should be safe block wise. It should never see over 6000. Though component wise it could go over that easy. Basically this gonna be low rpm tractor like torque engine. 100% Street manners engine with OD. I do appreciate all the input and advice from everyone. Where is TN are you ? I’ll look and see if I can find one.
5.53 @ 125 1/8th on the launch control..more left in her!
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