A friend of mine (Who has never been smart about money) bought a kit from Magnum Farce for his 64 Valiant. It was one that required he weld in reinforcement pipes that run from the firewall (Thin sheet metal) to the frame rail (Thicker sheet metal). It came with a tab to weld to the shock mount to add reinforcement/support since all the suspension load was now concentrated into the frame rails. He got the kit including a manual steering rack and 11" disc brakes for just under $5000 shipped. He already had 11" brakes from a 73 Dart but they could not be used since the kit uses a different spindle. He now has less suspension travel, a wider turning radius and $5000 less money to spend on hookers and blow.

As I said I like the stock torsion bar setup alot as does my brother but he don't want to trust it on this car. I wanted opinions because I have only ever run the stock front end and he has only had different front ends on race cars. I asked for opinions and I appreciate all the opinions both negative and positive. Thanks again for all the replys. Ron

Cut out the TB crossmember, install a new one, much easier. Plenty of donner cars if you want original.

You can insult me all you want , fact is my stuff always rides, drives, works retains great values win awards, end up in magazines ..


Dodges don't have coil over suspension ? maybe you should look into what they have built since 1962

I'm not opposed to tubular systems and coil overs. They offer some very distinct advantages over the stock stuff and if you can utilize those benefits, then they can be a great system that provides the user with numerous benefits. Its just that a lot of users seem to not know about or care for the benefits of these systems and buy them on simply on the perception of being "modern" and therefore better than something developed 60 years ago.

In all honesty, if you want to use them go for it. There is no practical reason to own a 707 hp intercooled, supercharged Hemi either, but we buy them. Being a hot-rodder isn't always about purely being logical. Sometimes passion is a factor too.

I think someone doesn't know the difference between coil over and MacPherson strut, which is probably a good reason to not pay attention to suspension advice from that person.

A strut is any suspension component with the ability to support sideways loads not along its axis of compression therefore eliminating any need for an upper control arm.


A coilover is when you combine a spring with a strut, making it a type of strut.

A McPherson is a type of coilover


Its kinda like asking what is the difference between a dog and a German Sheppard.

I have a AlterKation on my 70' Challenger. No complaints I love everything about it. I only went with it because it was free (long story) and to free up space for big tube Hemi Headers & so I could run a flat bottom 10 quart dragster type oil pan on the street & not the usual deep sump pans the hit everything..

So how many of these kits are actually designed to do anything more than go straight real fast on a smooth surface and then make a very reduced speed turn onto the return road?

Kevin

Don't forget all tubular K-members are illegal for road use. So as long as he doesn't want to drive it on the street, he's all good.

Please show me the statutes, I have never been able to find them...

Advantages are more clearance for headers, possibility of going with rack and pinion steering, and move engine back/larger oil pan. Downside is that the top of the shock tower needs to have some type of modification to bring loads down to frame rail. Either additional bars or, as I think I have seen in the past, plates that weld on to frame rails up to top of shock tower. I'd also triangulate the shock towers to the cowl to resist twist. I can't help with costs as I don't have one, but for simple street driving, I would replace torsion bar cross member. Add frame connectors, stiffen lower control arms, and maybe tubular upper to add some caster, along with all new bushings and call it a day. Just my

Yeah, don't give me that crap! They're not immoral or fattening either. It's easy to make a blanket statement having done no research.

OP, I understand your situation better now you have explained it. My earlier point was directed more to those who think they need to get rid of an outmoded system. That dog won't hunt. But your brother seems willing to spend the money and so more power to him. There were I believe at least three reliable companies named.

Now on to the "loading of the suspension" ridiculous argument. The entire force that pushes down on the wheel pushes up on the chassis AT THAT POINT. There's no way around this fact. The problem with coil sprung conversions is that some of them mount the top of the coilover to the inner fender, which was NOT designed to carry the load. So if the new suspension system has a loop or other fixture for the top of the coilover, this argument dies. Assuming the new K-frame mounts the same way as the old K-frame, the load is transmitted in exactly the same way as the original suspension.

I know some of you are not going to believe me but it isn't a matter of belief or how you "feel". It's just basic engineering.

The torsion bar crossmember is very important to the torsion bar car because it connects the moments exerted by the two bars, which cancel each other out as they are added.

My 1993 Chevy K2500 4WD Suburban has a torsion bar setup that is very much like the original Chrysler design. There are literally millions of trucks running around with this front end.

A MacPherson strut has the spindle rigidly attached to an extension of the shock absorber. It may be a coilover, but all coilovers are not MacPherson struts.
The MacPherson strut has one very serious design flaw. When the vehicle rolls, the strut and tire roll with it. This decreases the amount of grip the tire can have, in most cases. The only way around that is to have the tire set up with excessive negative camber so when the car rolls, the tire rotates into better contact with the road. This is impractical for the street because of tire wear.

The double A-arm or unequal length A-arm suspension is superior because it can be designed to compensate for the vehicle rolling. It can be suspended by coilovers, coil springs between the A-arms, torsion bars, or springs and shocks pressing down on the upper A-arm. That is mostly due to packaging.

R.

Here is an older AlterKtion on a 67 Barracuda that I currently have. The coil overs go where the round bar is between the lower control arm and the vertical member, the entire load on the coil overs is on the vertical member while the k-frame itself is bolted to the regular mounting spots on the frame rails. I don't see any issues with this design.

Says right in the instructions for all the tubular setups. "For Off-Road use only". That way when they fail, they aren't libel.

Well that in itself does not make them "illegal", that is just lawyer speak for CYA...

Stop with the BS! Alterkations says this:
"Disclaimer
Reilly MotorSports, Inc. cannot control how this product is installed or used. By purchasing this product, the buyer/end user assumes all risks associated with its use and agrees to having the proper skills for it's
installation. Reilly MotorSports Inc. and its suppliers will not be held responsible, liable or accountable for any injury, damage, loss, penalties, or fines that occur from using this product in any manner."

https://www.reillymotorsports.com/files/attachments/16247/AlterKtion_Instructions_2016.pdf

And any lawyer that just passed the bar could fight this and win. There isn't a disclaimer on the planet that can't be fought and won if negligence by the manufacturer can be proven.