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Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: ccdave] #2425195
12/29/17 01:03 AM
12/29/17 01:03 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
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Romeo MI
Originally Posted By ccdave
Originally Posted By Dragula
I did back to back quick fuel vs. FAST TBI self learning years ago...It actually took me a while to get the FAST system to the same ET as the carb. Got to pick the right WOT AFR and get the squirter shot right.

When I was done, they were within .03 of each other.



.03 does not seem like a lot when you consider the extra dollars and parts required for EFI.


But it could be the last time you have to mess
with it.. I've been real happy with my Holley
EFI multi point after I made some wiring changes
and I do love the aspect that if I want to change
something its just a few clicks on the lap top
wave

Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: MR_P_BODY] #2425198
12/29/17 01:10 AM
12/29/17 01:10 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,243
Charlotte, North Carolina
sgcuda Offline
master
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Originally Posted By MR_P_BODY

But it could be the last time you have to mess
with it.. I've been real happy with my Holley
EFI multi point after I made some wiring changes
and I do love the aspect that if I want to change
something its just a few clicks on the lap top
wave


On a carb, there is no wiring to change. And whatever happened to the guy on this site that was running EFI and the system crapped out? Never heard what the problem or the fix was. At least, if a carb goes bad (and I doubt it will go bad enough, fast enough that it will quit running), you just borrow your buddies carb and keep going. Who keeps extra injectors, TPS, MAP, Temp, O2 sensors with them?

Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: sgcuda] #2425202
12/29/17 01:23 AM
12/29/17 01:23 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
Master
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Romeo MI
Originally Posted By sgcuda
Originally Posted By MR_P_BODY

But it could be the last time you have to mess
with it.. I've been real happy with my Holley
EFI multi point after I made some wiring changes
and I do love the aspect that if I want to change
something its just a few clicks on the lap top
wave


On a carb, there is no wiring to change. And whatever happened to the guy on this site that was running EFI and the system crapped out? Never heard what the problem or the fix was. At least, if a carb goes bad (and I doubt it will go bad enough, fast enough that it will quit running), you just borrow your buddies carb and keep going. Who keeps extra injectors, TPS, MAP, Temp, O2 sensors with them?


It was one wire that was routed wrong... very
happy now and I wouldnt go back to a carb.. and I
have a few of them in the shop.. will probably
sell all or most of them.. the nice thing about
EFI is if I want to change to E-85 today its just
a couple of clicks and its done.. not like when I
first swapped over to E-85 and I can go back and
forth if I want to in a few moments
wave

Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: MR_P_BODY] #2425209
12/29/17 01:38 AM
12/29/17 01:38 AM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
GoodysGotaCuda Offline
5.7L Hemi, 6spd
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
Originally Posted By MR_P_BODY
Originally Posted By sgcuda
Originally Posted By MR_P_BODY

But it could be the last time you have to mess
with it.. I've been real happy with my Holley
EFI multi point after I made some wiring changes
and I do love the aspect that if I want to change
something its just a few clicks on the lap top
wave


On a carb, there is no wiring to change. And whatever happened to the guy on this site that was running EFI and the system crapped out? Never heard what the problem or the fix was. At least, if a carb goes bad (and I doubt it will go bad enough, fast enough that it will quit running), you just borrow your buddies carb and keep going. Who keeps extra injectors, TPS, MAP, Temp, O2 sensors with them?



It was one wire that was routed wrong... very
happy now and I wouldnt go back to a carb.. and I
have a few of them in the shop.. will probably
sell all or most of them.. the nice thing about
EFI is if I want to change to E-85 today its just
a couple of clicks and its done.. not like when I
first swapped over to E-85 and I can go back and
forth if I want to in a few moments
wave


...with the right setup [Ethanol sensor], you don't even have to click a button to switch. Pretty slick!


1972 Barracuda - 5.7L Hemi, T56 Magnum 6spd - https://www.facebook.com/GoodysGotaHemi
2020 RAM 1500
[img]https://i.imgur.com/v9yezP9.jpg[/img]
Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: GoodysGotaCuda] #2425210
12/29/17 01:44 AM
12/29/17 01:44 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
Master
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Romeo MI
True but I dont have it so its a couple of
clicks to change over
wave

Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: Dadodgekid] #2425234
12/29/17 03:40 AM
12/29/17 03:40 AM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,005
Central US
grancuda Offline
super stock
grancuda  Offline
super stock

Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,005
Central US
Originally Posted By Dadodgekid
...but gasoline all over my intake is not exactly ideal when changing jets


I just use a cut up little Comp Cams break in oil can & take the front bottom, drivers or rear passenger, lower bowl bolt out first & drain it into the bottle. It keeps the intake free or fuel.

...but on the Chinese built fuel injection systems, I can't help, I like carburetors & the ease of operation and the simplicity they give.

IMG_3722.JPGIMG_3723.JPG

1967 Barracuda Formula S 383
1967 Chevy C10 Short Stepper
1980 Macho Power Wagon LWB 318
2021 Toyota Supra
Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: Dadodgekid] #2425237
12/29/17 03:45 AM
12/29/17 03:45 AM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 6,257
gulfport, ms, west mi
rowin4 Offline
master
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gulfport, ms, west mi
Depending on what fuel you run, the FI TECH unit will support 1200 HP on gas, not so on alcohol. My buddy has a 588 BB chevy that runs alcohol . The car slowed down .3 from 8.70 to 9.0 but it fires right off with the 15-1 compression and idles like a fairly stock car. If fi-teck would come out with a larger cfm body like a 1250 size I think the injection set up would run with the carbs. His thought on getting more cfm is to add another fi-tech on a dual four Holley Sniper sheet aluminum fabricated short tunnel ram. We'll see how that works in the early spring.


it's ok to butt heads, just don't do it with a butthead
Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: sgcuda] #2425402
12/29/17 04:10 PM
12/29/17 04:10 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 21,318
Manitoba, Canada
DaytonaTurbo Offline
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts

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Posts: 21,318
Manitoba, Canada
Originally Posted By sgcuda
Originally Posted By MR_P_BODY

But it could be the last time you have to mess
with it.. I've been real happy with my Holley
EFI multi point after I made some wiring changes
and I do love the aspect that if I want to change
something its just a few clicks on the lap top
wave


On a carb, there is no wiring to change. And whatever happened to the guy on this site that was running EFI and the system crapped out? Never heard what the problem or the fix was. At least, if a carb goes bad (and I doubt it will go bad enough, fast enough that it will quit running), you just borrow your buddies carb and keep going. Who keeps extra injectors, TPS, MAP, Temp, O2 sensors with them?


Do you carry around extra injectors, tpc, map, temp and o2 sensors when you take your modern daily driver down the road?

Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: DaytonaTurbo] #2425432
12/29/17 05:27 PM
12/29/17 05:27 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
Master
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Romeo MI
Originally Posted By DaytonaTurbo
Originally Posted By sgcuda
Originally Posted By MR_P_BODY

But it could be the last time you have to mess
with it.. I've been real happy with my Holley
EFI multi point after I made some wiring changes
and I do love the aspect that if I want to change
something its just a few clicks on the lap top
wave


On a carb, there is no wiring to change. And whatever happened to the guy on this site that was running EFI and the system crapped out? Never heard what the problem or the fix was. At least, if a carb goes bad (and I doubt it will go bad enough, fast enough that it will quit running), you just borrow your buddies carb and keep going. Who keeps extra injectors, TPS, MAP, Temp, O2 sensors with them?


Do you carry around extra injectors, tpc, map, temp and o2 sensors when you take your modern daily
driver down the road?


Nope.. no need to.. if something crapped out I
can buy it at the parts store.. mainly all GM
stuff
wave

Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: Dadodgekid] #2425448
12/29/17 06:15 PM
12/29/17 06:15 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 30,998
Oregon
A
AndyF Offline
I Win
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Oregon
Originally Posted By Dadodgekid
Has anyone done a comparsion of the mean street 800HP capable FItech vs a well tuned carb for that particular combo?


I have not done a back to back with the FI Tech but I've done back to back with the Holley EFI setup. No real power difference between carb and EFI but EFI allows you to "find" power much quicker. It can take a long time to figure out the correct jetting and ignition tune for an engine with a carb and distributor but EFI allows you to very quickly test different tunes.

On the dyno we are able to test a bunch of tunes in just minutes on the EFI engines. With an old school carb and distributor it can take all day to dial in an engine. Even with a distributor machine it is painful to try different timing curves. Also, if you need stuff like start retard, high speed retard, two step, nitrous control, etc. you have to add a bunch of modules if you have a carb and distributor. If you have a good EFI system that stuff is all built in. The good EFI systems also have built in data logger so that is even more stuff that you don't need to buy and wire in.

Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: Dadodgekid] #2425578
12/30/17 12:11 AM
12/30/17 12:11 AM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 1,238
Nevada
D
dezduster Offline
pro stock
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D

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Nevada
If its JUST a drag car yeah a carb would be fine and yep it'll work.
I'm sure the carb will change for temp, elevation, and density.
Actually won a "street class" truck pull event that I drove to against some big block Chevys Fords and a sweet little mercury/ford FE stroker truck in Gardnerville NV this year because of my EFI. It was hot 102 degrees and just before the pulls started it rained hard dropped temperature into mid sixties. Track was supper wet they bladed and let us go all the boys who were carbed and came from California's lower elevation ran like [censored]. The sweet little Mercury/Ford came from 4500 elevation as do I and his ran good but I'm sure it wasn't running as good as it could. I am into my Fitech around 1500 I'm going to build a custom tank and go intank pump soon, may try a single plane as well. I will do back to back wheel dyno tests to check results. Good luck and enjoy!

Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: Dadodgekid] #2425880
12/30/17 04:00 PM
12/30/17 04:00 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,918
Akron, Ohio
ProSport Offline
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Akron, Ohio
I'm a diehard carburetor guy and enjoy tuning them but I really like some of the positives about these new EFI systems.

One thing I've wondered about with EFI, can you set what RPM you want the motor to idle at in park and in gear? With a carb it can be quite a challenge to dial this in for us average tuners.


1970 Challenger, all aluminum 528 Hemi, HDK suspension, Tremec 5 speed manual
Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: ProSport] #2425899
12/30/17 04:13 PM
12/30/17 04:13 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 30,998
Oregon
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AndyF Offline
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Oregon
Yes you can set the idle speed and then the EFI system holds that speed by opening or closing the IAC (idle air port). Some systems will also adjust timing to control idle speed.

Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: Dadodgekid] #2425915
12/30/17 04:38 PM
12/30/17 04:38 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,918
Akron, Ohio
ProSport Offline
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Akron, Ohio
Nice. Thanks Andy.


1970 Challenger, all aluminum 528 Hemi, HDK suspension, Tremec 5 speed manual
Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: ProSport] #2425954
12/30/17 05:45 PM
12/30/17 05:45 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
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Romeo MI
Originally Posted By ProSport
Nice. Thanks Andy.


With the idle air it holds the RPM dead on...
with the engine I am building now I will be
going a fair amount bigger on the cam and it
should control it easy but it will have a fair
amount of lope to it
EDIT
I wanted to go back to a roller cam that was in
the race car so I am(.695 lift on a 106 LSA
wave

Last edited by MR_P_BODY; 12/30/17 05:49 PM.
Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: MR_P_BODY] #2425955
12/30/17 05:47 PM
12/30/17 05:47 PM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 69
Palm City, FL
D
Dadodgekid Offline OP
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Palm City, FL
Originally Posted By MR_P_BODY
Originally Posted By ProSport
Nice. Thanks Andy.


With the idle air it holds the RPM dead on...
with the engine I am building now I will be
going a fair amount bigger on the cam and it
should control it easy but it will have a fair
amount of lope to it
wave


What EFI system are you using?

Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: Dadodgekid] #2425960
12/30/17 05:54 PM
12/30/17 05:54 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
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Originally Posted By Dadodgekid
Originally Posted By MR_P_BODY
Originally Posted By ProSport
Nice. Thanks Andy.


With the idle air it holds the RPM dead on...
with the engine I am building now I will be
going a fair amount bigger on the cam and it
should control it easy but it will have a fair
amount of lope to it
wave


What EFI system are you using?


Holley HP.. its got all the stuff on it now..
its multi point and coil near plug.. I put the
coils on the valve covers
wave

Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: ProSport] #2426003
12/30/17 07:27 PM
12/30/17 07:27 PM
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Posts: 30,998
Oregon
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AndyF Offline
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Oregon
The Holley system will also increase the idle when the AC comes on. I think FAST might do that also. They have a sensor wire that connects to the AC and when it gets a voltage signal the idle speed will increase.

If you go to the Holley website and look over the features you'll be surprised at what the systems will do. They'll control the fans, control the nitrous system, control an automatic trans, allow you to use drive by wire, etc.

Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: AndyF] #2426363
12/31/17 03:26 PM
12/31/17 03:26 PM
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Posts: 4,243
Canada
Kam*Kuda Offline
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Originally Posted By AndyF
The Holley system will also increase the idle when the AC comes on. I think FAST might do that also. They have a sensor wire that connects to the AC and when it gets a voltage signal the idle speed will increase.

Yes the Fast system does that as well.

I lot of the power comes from the infinitely adjustable timing curve.
I run the fast xfi system and needs a laptop to tune.
Being able to see what is happening is a big advantage. My car is a procharged street strip so the EFI made a lot of sense, at least for me.

There are both advantages and disadvantages There is a learning curve for sure


1970 Barracuda Convertible
1968 Satellite Street Strip car
1654.5 Mustang
1955 Land Rover
Re: FI Tech VS Tuned Carb [Re: Kam*Kuda] #2426395
12/31/17 04:01 PM
12/31/17 04:01 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
Master
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Romeo MI
Originally Posted By Kam*Kuda
Originally Posted By AndyF
The Holley system will also increase the idle when the AC comes on. I think FAST might do that also. They have a sensor wire that connects to the AC and when it gets a voltage signal the idle speed will increase.

Yes the Fast system does that as well.

I lot of the power comes from the infinitely adjustable timing curve.
I run the fast xfi system and needs a laptop to tune.
Being able to see what is happening is a big advantage. My car is a procharged street strip so the EFI made a lot of sense, at least for me.

There are both advantages and disadvantages There is a learning curve for sure


Oh yeah there is a learning curve.. there is so
much data you can get you need to have that
learning curve.. when I started with the Holley
HP I was lost and needed some help with all of
the stuff on it.. way more than I figured.. hell
even working in the fuel lab and flowing injectors
for months I couldnt get a grasp of it .. love it
now and wouldnt change back
wave

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