Questions About My First Engine Break-In
#2346948
08/01/17 10:13 PM
08/01/17 10:13 PM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 10,951
Spokane Valley, WA
Big Bad Bee
OP
I Live Here
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OP
I Live Here
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 10,951
Spokane Valley, WA
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Hey guys, I broke in my Superbee's 440 a couple days ago. I didn't get a full 20 minutes in. I hope some of you engine builders and racers etc. will read this and reply with your thoughts. 440ci, Comp Cams 274 cam Specifications Keith Black Hyperutectic pistons 9.5:1 LY rods Stock forged crank Edelbrock RPM intake Holley Street Avenger 770 carb TTI 1 7/8" headers 2.5" mandrel bent exhaust to rear bumper with chambered mufflers 180 degree thermostat Evans coolant 3 row Champion radiator It's in the 90's here. We got it to run 9 minutes before reaching 210 degrees and shut her down. 2 successive runs have netted about 5 minutes before she's gotten too hot. Each time she cooled I added more Evans. After letting her cool to about 100 degrees and sealing the water and oil leaks today, I got another 4-5 minutes in. I left the radiator cap off to try to burp the system when the thermostat opened. I never saw the flow go down before she reached 210. I did top her off while she was running. I left a wide-mouth funnel in the radiator spout with a little excess in it. When I stopped the engine, the radiator back flowed into the funnel about a quart. I've backed the timing down a bit because it was dieseling. So, given that the outside temp is 93 degrees today, is this typical for a new engine break in? I'd like to get another 10 minutes of break in time before I call it good. Any thoughts on the cooling system and the way it back flushed about a quart? Does that mean the thermostat was opening? What can I do to keep the engine from overheating? Thanks!
I’m listening.
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Re: Questions About My First Engine Break-In
[Re: Big Bad Bee]
#2346957
08/01/17 10:37 PM
08/01/17 10:37 PM
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crabman173
Unregistered
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crabman173
Unregistered
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OK
I always shut them down as they approach the 200 degree mark--let them cool get a beer etc--keep it up run until it is near 190 and shut down --cool repeat--that is no problem and the way to go
after thermostat opens --and it will--top off an you are ready to go--The Evans is a race car deal and a waste --water and antifreeze 50-50 is all you ever need You are fine--the MAIN deal is get enough timing in it as fast as possible--rev to whenever your mechanical is all in --hold it there--set to about 35-36 degree at that rpm lock her down--timing too low creates HEAT like a MF and ruins header coating etc and is HARD on everything--sounds like you are AOK
Sounds like you made it!
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Re: Questions About My First Engine Break-In
[Re: Big Bad Bee]
#2346958
08/01/17 10:38 PM
08/01/17 10:38 PM
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Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,457
Washington
madscientist
master
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master
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,457
Washington
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Hey guys, I broke in my Superbee's 440 a couple days ago. I didn't get a full 20 minutes in. I hope some of you engine builders and racers etc. will read this and reply with your thoughts. 440ci, Comp Cams 274 cam Specifications Keith Black Hyperutectic pistons 9.5:1 LY rods Stock forged crank Edelbrock RPM intake Holley Street Avenger 770 carb TTI 1 7/8" headers 2.5" mandrel bent exhaust to rear bumper with chambered mufflers 180 degree thermostat Evans coolant 3 row Champion radiator It's in the 90's here. We got it to run 9 minutes before reaching 210 degrees and shut her down. 2 successive runs have netted about 5 minutes before she's gotten too hot. Each time she cooled I added more Evans. After letting her cool to about 100 degrees and sealing the water and oil leaks today, I got another 4-5 minutes in. I left the radiator cap off to try to burp the system when the thermostat opened. I never saw the flow go down before she reached 210. I did top her off while she was running. I left a wide-mouth funnel in the radiator spout with a little excess in it. When I stopped the engine, the radiator back flowed into the funnel about a quart. I've backed the timing down a bit because it was dieseling. So, given that the outside temp is 93 degrees today, is this typical for a new engine break in? I'd like to get another 10 minutes of break in time before I call it good. Any thoughts on the cooling system and the way it back flushed about a quart? Does that mean the thermostat was opening? What can I do to keep the engine from overheating? Thanks! Fix your cooling issues. That thing should run with no load for hours on 100 degree days and never get much above thermostat operating temp.
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Questions About My First Engine Break-In
[Re: madscientist]
#2346979
08/01/17 10:55 PM
08/01/17 10:55 PM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 10,951
Spokane Valley, WA
Big Bad Bee
OP
I Live Here
|
OP
I Live Here
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 10,951
Spokane Valley, WA
|
Hey guys, I broke in my Superbee's 440 a couple days ago. I didn't get a full 20 minutes in. I hope some of you engine builders and racers etc. will read this and reply with your thoughts. 440ci, Comp Cams 274 cam Specifications Keith Black Hyperutectic pistons 9.5:1 LY rods Stock forged crank Edelbrock RPM intake Holley Street Avenger 770 carb TTI 1 7/8" headers 2.5" mandrel bent exhaust to rear bumper with chambered mufflers 180 degree thermostat Evans coolant 3 row Champion radiator It's in the 90's here. We got it to run 9 minutes before reaching 210 degrees and shut her down. 2 successive runs have netted about 5 minutes before she's gotten too hot. Each time she cooled I added more Evans. After letting her cool to about 100 degrees and sealing the water and oil leaks today, I got another 4-5 minutes in. I left the radiator cap off to try to burp the system when the thermostat opened. I never saw the flow go down before she reached 210. I did top her off while she was running. I left a wide-mouth funnel in the radiator spout with a little excess in it. When I stopped the engine, the radiator back flowed into the funnel about a quart. I've backed the timing down a bit because it was dieseling. So, given that the outside temp is 93 degrees today, is this typical for a new engine break in? I'd like to get another 10 minutes of break in time before I call it good. Any thoughts on the cooling system and the way it back flushed about a quart? Does that mean the thermostat was opening? What can I do to keep the engine from overheating? Thanks! Fix your cooling issues. That thing should run with no load for hours on 100 degree days and never get much above thermostat operating temp. Sorry you didn't get the base of my question. What do I do differently?
I’m listening.
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Re: Questions About My First Engine Break-In
[Re: ]
#2346984
08/01/17 11:00 PM
08/01/17 11:00 PM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 10,951
Spokane Valley, WA
Big Bad Bee
OP
I Live Here
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OP
I Live Here
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 10,951
Spokane Valley, WA
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OK
I always shut them down as they approach the 200 degree mark--let them cool get a beer etc--keep it up run until it is near 190 and shut down --cool repeat--that is no problem and the way to go
after thermostat opens --and it will--top off an you are ready to go--The Evans is a race car deal and a waste --water and antifreeze 50-50 is all you ever need You are fine--the MAIN deal is get enough timing in it as fast as possible--rev to whenever your mechanical is all in --hold it there--set to about 35-36 degree at that rpm lock her down--timing too low creates HEAT like a MF and ruins header coating etc and is HARD on everything--sounds like you are AOK
Sounds like you made it! Thanks for the advice. I'll be driving her around the block soon. I'll run her one more time tonight and call the break-in a success. Hopefully a little wind in the fins will cool her down better. Can I assume that once the engine has some miles on it, things will run more loosely (less friction) and will stay cool in traffic in hot weather? I really hate changing out water pumps and overheating. I wasted big bucks on that Evans. Some people worship the stuff. Now I'm strapped to keeping a jug of it with me in case of a leak because nobody carries it. I feel more than stupid for getting on that boat. Wish I could dump it out and sell the stuff.
I’m listening.
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Re: Questions About My First Engine Break-In
[Re: Big Bad Bee]
#2347046
08/02/17 12:23 AM
08/02/17 12:23 AM
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Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,457
Washington
madscientist
master
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master
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,457
Washington
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OK
I always shut them down as they approach the 200 degree mark--let them cool get a beer etc--keep it up run until it is near 190 and shut down --cool repeat--that is no problem and the way to go
after thermostat opens --and it will--top off an you are ready to go--The Evans is a race car deal and a waste --water and antifreeze 50-50 is all you ever need You are fine--the MAIN deal is get enough timing in it as fast as possible--rev to whenever your mechanical is all in --hold it there--set to about 35-36 degree at that rpm lock her down--timing too low creates HEAT like a MF and ruins header coating etc and is HARD on everything--sounds like you are AOK
Sounds like you made it! Thanks for the advice. I'll be driving her around the block soon. I'll run her one more time tonight and call the break-in a success. Hopefully a little wind in the fins will cool her down better. Can I assume that once the engine has some miles on it, things will run more loosely (less friction) and will stay cool in traffic in hot weather? I really hate changing out water pumps and overheating. I wasted big bucks on that Evans. Some people worship the stuff. Now I'm strapped to keeping a jug of it with me in case of a leak because nobody carries it. I feel more than stupid for getting on that boat. Wish I could dump it out and sell the stuff. The Evans isn't your issue. I run it and would never go back to conventional coolant. I run a 180* Stewart thermostat, Evans, a Milodon high flow water pump and a 2 core radiator with 1.25 cores. If you have all that, most likely you are turning the water pump too slow. I'm turning mine 6% faster than crank speed. If I could get more without a custom pulley I'd have it. Like I say, that thing should sit there with no load on it and never get hot. You aren't making enough heat with no load to get it hot.
Last edited by madscientist; 08/02/17 12:24 AM.
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Questions About My First Engine Break-In
[Re: Big Bad Bee]
#2347069
08/02/17 12:54 AM
08/02/17 12:54 AM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,041
Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
Circle Track
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Circle Track
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,041
Lincoln Nebraska
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take the stat OUT (for the breakin). bump the timing to 45 (make a mark 2.487" CW from the TDC slit). put a tornado fan in front of the rad. If the rad still geysers it may have a head gasket leak. goose the throttle many times to load (seat) the rings. You have ONE chance to get an excellent ring seal that will produce excellent leakdown numbers as opposed to good or mediocre numbers. Holler how it goes.
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Questions About My First Engine Break-In
[Re: Big Bad Bee]
#2347088
08/02/17 01:36 AM
08/02/17 01:36 AM
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,173
CT
GTX MATT
master
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master
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,173
CT
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Did you set the timing? Its probably too retarded. If you have a vacuum advance, is it hooked up?
Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat
Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street
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Re: Questions About My First Engine Break-In
[Re: Big Bad Bee]
#2347238
08/02/17 12:48 PM
08/02/17 12:48 PM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,219
New York
polyspheric
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,219
New York
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What fan?
What shroud?
How much initial advance?
Boffin Emeritus
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Re: Questions About My First Engine Break-In
[Re: Big Bad Bee]
#2347262
08/02/17 01:32 PM
08/02/17 01:32 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,819
Sobieski Wi
bee1971
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,819
Sobieski Wi
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Air pocket with the new radiator
1971 Dodge Charger Superbee
2011 Ram Sport 1500 Quad Cab Deep Water Blue Loaded
Siberian Huskies
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Re: Questions About My First Engine Break-In
[Re: krautrock]
#2347479
08/02/17 08:51 PM
08/02/17 08:51 PM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 10,951
Spokane Valley, WA
Big Bad Bee
OP
I Live Here
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OP
I Live Here
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 10,951
Spokane Valley, WA
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To answer a few questions.
- I am running an aluminum water pump, don't know which brand. Think it's the one 440 Source sells
-This is an AC car and I am running the pulley system out of an early '70s Monaco
-No shroud
-We set TDC and the timing mark to zero when we started it up
-The vacuum advance hose is installed
Sounds like I need to advance the timing? Once I'm done running it in, do I leave it advanced? I thought that dieseling meant too much timing (along with overheating). I've backed off the distributor and it's dieseling less. I'm still trying to get the back header bolt on the #8 cylinder to quit leaking and it's out of alignment so I can't drive her until we get the front end close which will be soon. I will run the engine up as soon as I get that and the leak. I'm using pipe dope to seal the header bolts and can't get it to seal for crap. Further suggestions there would be greatly appreciated.
I’m listening.
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Re: Questions About My First Engine Break-In
[Re: Big Bad Bee]
#2347495
08/02/17 09:55 PM
08/02/17 09:55 PM
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Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,457
Washington
madscientist
master
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master
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 4,457
Washington
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To answer a few questions.
- I am running an aluminum water pump, don't know which brand. Think it's the one 440 Source sells
-This is an AC car and I am running the pulley system out of an early '70s Monaco
-No shroud
-We set TDC and the timing mark to zero when we started it up
-The vacuum advance hose is installed
Sounds like I need to advance the timing? Once I'm done running it in, do I leave it advanced? I thought that dieseling meant too much timing (along with overheating). I've backed off the distributor and it's dieseling less. I'm still trying to get the back header bolt on the #8 cylinder to quit leaking and it's out of alignment so I can't drive her until we get the front end close which will be soon. I will run the engine up as soon as I get that and the leak. I'm using pipe dope to seal the header bolts and can't get it to seal for crap. Further suggestions there would be greatly appreciated. I'd rather see 45 total timing than what you have now. Slow timing makes them hot and can stick exhaust valves. Get some timing in it. Not sure about the water pump. If it's not a high flow pump, I'd look at a flow kooler or similar. Definitely measure the pulleys. You need to be 1:1 at the least.
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Questions About My First Engine Break-In
[Re: Big Bad Bee]
#2347539
08/02/17 10:49 PM
08/02/17 10:49 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,041
Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
Circle Track
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Circle Track
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,041
Lincoln Nebraska
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I'm using pipe dope to seal the header bolts and can't get it to seal for crap. Further suggestions there would be greatly appreciated. You might go with the OE type studs with the shoulder inbetween the thread ends. You can shorten the outer fine threaded length to ease fitment as only enough threads are needed to end up flush to the end of the nut when tightened keeping mind gasket thickness when you are doing the trimming. as far as bolts there might be a different "class" of threads that fit tighter in the bolt hole threads (not my area) & some good viscous sealer like permatex #1 in the toothpaste like tube.
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Questions About My First Engine Break-In
[Re: Big Bad Bee]
#2347584
08/02/17 11:31 PM
08/02/17 11:31 PM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 4,848
Memphis
HemiRick
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 4,848
Memphis
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If you dont have a timing light stop until you get one.....then use it.
Take care,
Rick
68 Coronet R/T 440 & 68 Charger 528 Hemi,and 5 Challengers! 6 cyl, 318, 360, 383, 451
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