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Moog offset bushings #2273367
03/20/17 11:40 PM
03/20/17 11:40 PM
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Millinocket, Maine
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JonC Offline OP
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10 years ago I installed all new bushings and joints in my 72 Cuda. I had the alignment done and the shop said could not get to specs. I don't remember what the numbers were at that time. I have just purchased the MOOG k7103 kit. My car does not return to center after turning a corner and is hard to control at speed.

I'm not sure what I need to do, more caster or camber and which way to install to them correct my problem.

Also, specs do I need to tell the shop?


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Re: Moog offset bushings [Re: JonC] #2273373
03/20/17 11:47 PM
03/20/17 11:47 PM
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Las Vegas, NV
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chargerbr549 Offline
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I would shoot for these figures on a street car;
3/8 to 1/2 degrees negative camber
3 to 4 degrees positive caster
around 1/16 to 1/8 toe in

On my 69 Charger I have, if i remember correctly;
3/8 negative camber
3.5 degrees positive caster
1/16 toe in

It handles very and enjoyable to drive.

Re: Moog offset bushings [Re: JonC] #2273378
03/20/17 11:57 PM
03/20/17 11:57 PM
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New Mexico
UCUDANT Offline
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Ehrenbergs suggested settings from Mopar Action

front end specs Ehrenberg.png
Re: Moog offset bushings [Re: JonC] #2273393
03/21/17 12:26 AM
03/21/17 12:26 AM
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Lincoln Nebraska
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RapidRobert Offline
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do you still have the sheet from when it was aligned way back? its been this way for 10 yrs?


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Re: Moog offset bushings [Re: RapidRobert] #2273402
03/21/17 12:33 AM
03/21/17 12:33 AM
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JonC Offline OP
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I don't have the sheet and yes it's been since 10 years. I'm tired of it and need to fix it.


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Re: Moog offset bushings [Re: JonC] #2273410
03/21/17 12:43 AM
03/21/17 12:43 AM
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Lincoln Nebraska
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RapidRobert Offline
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Alright, it sounds like the question is whether to install the offset bushings before you take it in again. I've used em & would again. EDIT On my 65 dart I insisted on zero camber and a 1/16-18 toe in (iirc) & as much positive caster as they could get with those offset bushings. for them to get my specs one side (likely bent frame) they had to go with way less positive caster than the other side. it floated down the road (manual steering) perfectly. If desired in the meantime you might get the car level in a parking lot & rough measure the tire toe in with the steering straight ahead & check rough check camber with a carpenters' 2 ft bubble level and a pair of sockets inbetween the rim and the level (digital would be much better). I'm assuming your tires are the same size in the front. post what setting it ends up being was way off

Last edited by RapidRobert; 03/21/17 01:08 AM. Reason: bored/more info

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Re: Moog offset bushings [Re: RapidRobert] #2273423
03/21/17 12:55 AM
03/21/17 12:55 AM
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Millinocket, Maine
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JonC Offline OP
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Having given my symptoms, am I looking for increased caster or camber. And which way to install them.


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Re: Moog offset bushings [Re: JonC] #2273437
03/21/17 01:13 AM
03/21/17 01:13 AM
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Lincoln Nebraska
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RapidRobert Offline
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they (& the instructings/pics with em) are for to increase positive camber (bringing the UCA further outward), you want reverse the rear one (from the directions) so it tilts it in further and & the front one as directed so it tilts the front half of the UCA outward so the top of the spindle is tilted a bit further rearward (more positive caster). Not a caster problem, likely toe or camber. #1 get the ride height where the front wheels look good to YOU & instruct them not to change the RH (put your weight in barbells in the dr seat & bounce it/let it settle) & talk to the man & ask if his machine compensates for dr weight & I moved the weights over to the pass seat & drove it there & pulled the weights back over as I exited the vehicle & informed him of what I did & slipped him a twenty to accomodate my special requests (sure rode nice when done even with the uneven caster).


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Re: Moog offset bushings [Re: RapidRobert] #2273442
03/21/17 01:16 AM
03/21/17 01:16 AM
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JonC Offline OP
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So, install them both pointing
towards the tire?


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Re: Moog offset bushings [Re: JonC] #2273443
03/21/17 01:16 AM
03/21/17 01:16 AM
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Florida
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Re: Moog offset bushings [Re: JonC] #2273446
03/21/17 01:20 AM
03/21/17 01:20 AM
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Granite Bay CA
Kern Dog Offline
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That reprint from Mopar Action seems like they made a mistake.

The Camber shows +/Positive for track day and autocross ???
Uhh...No. The specs should be negative there. You wouldn't want to run 3 degrees of positive camber anywhere for any reason.

Re: Moog offset bushings [Re: BDW] #2273447
03/21/17 01:21 AM
03/21/17 01:21 AM
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Lincoln Nebraska
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RapidRobert Offline
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CNXT is the man! EDIT visualize the bushings as jello & imagine pulling the top of the UCA rearward & get a picture in your head of which bushing side on each end will get thinner and which bushing side will get thicker (the direction the center metal sleeve moves closer or further away from center). MORE EDIT Just me I dont see a problem with 3 positive caster (for street)

Last edited by RapidRobert; 03/21/17 01:30 AM.

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Re: Moog offset bushings [Re: RapidRobert] #2273481
03/21/17 02:27 AM
03/21/17 02:27 AM
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Granite Bay CA
Kern Dog Offline
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Originally Posted By RapidRobert
CNXT is the man! EDIT visualize the bushings as jello & imagine pulling the top of the UCA rearward & get a picture in your head of which bushing side on each end will get thinner and which bushing side will get thicker (the direction the center metal sleeve moves closer or further away from center). MORE EDIT Just me I dont see a problem with 3 positive caster (for street)


Me neither. 3 degrees of positive camber isn't good anywhere though.

Re: Moog offset bushings [Re: RapidRobert] #2273484
03/21/17 02:40 AM
03/21/17 02:40 AM
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Cumberland, MD
Moparguy383 Offline
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Here is a diagram I found helpful.

moog_offset_bushings.gif
Re: Moog offset bushings [Re: JonC] #2273509
03/21/17 07:21 AM
03/21/17 07:21 AM
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MI, usa
dvw Offline
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I agrre positive caster is good, but. The wheel should return even without positive caster. Sounds like something is bound up. Has the steering box sector shaft been over tightened?
Doug

Re: Moog offset bushings [Re: JonC] #2273511
03/21/17 07:38 AM
03/21/17 07:38 AM
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Granite Bay CA
Kern Dog Offline
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The wheel will NOT want to return without some positive caster. It defies the principle. Look at the wheels on a shopping cart. Have you ever seen one roll with the forks pointing forward? No.

Re: Moog offset bushings [Re: Kern Dog] #2273618
03/21/17 12:54 PM
03/21/17 12:54 PM
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Lincoln Nebraska
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RapidRobert Offline
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First you might jack up the front end to get the wheels off of the ground & center the wheels and reach around (not thru!) the steering wheel & start it & see if it pulls then turn it left and right & see if it feels "normal".


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