Re: Roll cage welding
[Re: rpagan]
#2146045
09/02/16 11:59 AM
09/02/16 11:59 AM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Not that we'd ever do it do you know what the percentage is? Just for me to store some more useless information. lol... I dont know for fact but I think its 75%-80% but I agree.. I drop the cage and fully weld them.. you would have to ask a chassis inspector for the answer
Last edited by MR_P_BODY; 09/02/16 12:06 PM.
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Re: Roll cage welding
[Re: rpagan]
#2146103
09/02/16 01:12 PM
09/02/16 01:12 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,874 Smyrna, South Carolina
STEFF
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Smyrna, South Carolina
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Mike is right.
Per the SFI 25.5 Specs. Section 2, point 5,
Where it is not practical to fully weld the windshield/roof bar (#12A & 12 B) and or the main hoop (#10) to their adjacent structure (ie: where the weld is in close proximity to the OEM roof), the use of two 1.75 x 1.75 x .110 plate gussets per affected joint is allowed to replace up to 25% of the weld. Each plate gusset must be fully welded on one side. Two fully welded tube gussets per affected joint, 3/4 x .049 moly or 3/4 x .108 mild steel, a minimum of 4" long may also be used. This option is applicable, only to welds in the OEM roof area.
I'm sure if it's good for a 25.5 cert, it would be good for any random 12 point cage of a lesser spec.
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Re: Roll cage welding
[Re: rpagan]
#2146116
09/02/16 01:24 PM
09/02/16 01:24 PM
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 11,705 Fulton County, PA
CMcAllister
Mr. Helpful
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Mr. Helpful
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 11,705
Fulton County, PA
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Rulebook says:
two 1.75 x 1.75 x .110" or .75 x 4"min. x .049 CM gussets may be used to replace up to 25% of the weld.
That's for 8.50 and slower. The SFI specs may allow something similar but I couldn't find it in a quick search of the book. Regardless, I would NOT do one like this. Nor would I touch something that the design of was not safe and proper IMO. That's just me and the OP is within his rights to not compromise his standards to satisfy a customer who's standards are not as strict. It's your name on it.
ETA, boy, I'm a slow typist.
Last edited by CMcAllister; 09/02/16 01:39 PM.
If the results don't match the theory, change the theory.
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Re: Roll cage welding
[Re: rpagan]
#2146148
09/02/16 02:03 PM
09/02/16 02:03 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,874 Smyrna, South Carolina
STEFF
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Smyrna, South Carolina
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He's well in his right, if he's not confortable. The way I look at it is, If the NHRA and SFI Foundation accept it as a rule, I do not see a problem with. And, I'd have to think there's been plenty of destructive testing by the governing bodies, to come to the rules as written. I'm going to have to do it on my own car in the near future, as I will be finishing a cage from an existing roll bar and I want the roof bars tight to the OEM roof.
Last edited by STEFF; 09/02/16 02:03 PM.
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Re: Roll cage welding
[Re: rpagan]
#2146157
09/02/16 02:18 PM
09/02/16 02:18 PM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,319 Puyallup, WA
StealthWedge67
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Posts: 4,319
Puyallup, WA
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I was talking with a guy in the staging lanes a couple of weeks ago that I noted had recently added a bar to his car, a Dart, that has a real nice interior. I specifically asked about the upper welds and the headliner. His answer was simple, yet brilliant. He cut holes in the floor where the plates were to be welded in, dropped the bar through the holes to give room to weld the upper section of the rear supports to the main hoop, then raised it back up and slid in the mounting plates and made those welds. He then replaced the holes in the floor under the plates, tacking them and filling with seamseal adhesive.
This may be an old trick, but I hadn't thought of it nor ever heard of anyone using it; and it allowed him to get the bar tight to the roof and fully welded without even removing the headliner.
LemonWedge - Street heavy / Strip ready - 11.07 @ 120
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Re: Roll cage welding
[Re: rpagan]
#2146696
09/03/16 10:56 AM
09/03/16 10:56 AM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,243 Charlotte, North Carolina
sgcuda
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Posts: 4,243
Charlotte, North Carolina
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I remember reading something about welds not being complete and adding gussets, just can't remember where. I just went through my 25.4 book, and there is absolutely nothing that says anything about that. I guess that means that it is NOT acceptable in the faster classes. If I had a full interior car and there was an option to fully weld the cage without gutting the car, I would pay the extra for it.
[image][/image]
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Re: Roll cage welding
[Re: rpagan]
#2146709
09/03/16 11:35 AM
09/03/16 11:35 AM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
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Master
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Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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4 holes in the floor(where you would be welding the plates in) is the easiest way to do it.. no clue why he didnt want to
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Re: Roll cage welding
[Re: rpagan]
#2146796
09/03/16 02:09 PM
09/03/16 02:09 PM
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 11,705 Fulton County, PA
CMcAllister
Mr. Helpful
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Mr. Helpful
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 11,705
Fulton County, PA
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Holes in the floor under the plates, and even if they're not, can be welded, ground up and made invisible. I cut a pie shaped area on two sides, fold it down, and when finished on top, fold it back up against the plate, weld and grind it. Dust it with primer. Can't tell it was done.
25.x cages with a lot of bars and a funny car cage? Just take the roof off.
If the results don't match the theory, change the theory.
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