Just thought I would share my latest on going saga to get rediculously good MPG in my dakota. It is a 318 magnum right now with a deep dull thud going on inside the engine at start up so digging around the shop I am formulateing a plan

KB107 pistons 4.030 bore
5.9 block, tq plate honed, thinking about square decking (if the 318 holds out till I get enought $$) to get a tighter quench.
318 magnum cam, again this will be updated if I get some $$$ together before the 318 blows. I may send one out and get the exhaust duration reduced and tighten the LSA a couple degrees for a little more burn down time before the ex opens and get perhaps, less overlap and .050 more intake lift and keep the duration about where it is.
Beer barrel intake with minor clean up in the port entry, still trying to figure out a really good way to insulate the steel plate and space it 1/4 to 1/2 inch down to allow the ports more air flow, that plate is real close to the port opening and can only contribute to the lack of RPMs. Thinking about grinding out the entire water passage in the front, drilling and tapping holes in the head for a pipe fitting and running a remote thermostat (what is a good one and where to get it?) to keep the heat out of the intake, that front port runs about 30* hotter than the rear one.
Ford yellow fuel injectors, maybe someday upgrade to the accel cone spray pattern ones later.
Stock magnum heads with a quality VJ and minor port clean up of ski jumps, casting flash...
I have a nice pair of the early big magnum manifolds, need to get them ceramic coated to keep heat out of the engine compartment to help reduce detonation.
Gonna shoot for about .030 quench at the tightest spots and near 10.5 compression.
Ignition I will probably get some firecore wires and a blaster coil and call it good, the stock ignition works pretty good.
I already have a K&N CAI (didn't do much on the stock engine).
Ported stock throttle body, thinned shafts...
3.55 gears, I would like a 3.23 or 2.94 even but I can't find anything higher than what I already have for the front difff.
I have the sway bars and torsion bars from an R/T durango so I don't got to slow down around the corners as much.
I will get a custom mandrel bent single exhaust and probably a diesel muffler as I need it real quiet for hunting.
Electric fan.
I already run 0W20 synthetic as well as thin weight synthetic gear oil.

Best I have been able to milk out of it is just a hair under 20 mpg, hopeing to get a couple more MPG since I need to swap engines soon anyhow. Keeping the RPMs low, giving myself plenty of stopping distance and useing the engine to brake (the computer shuts off the injectors when doing this) I can get about the same city and highway MPG.

Any thoughts?

Sounds like a plan! I've always wanted to follow a tight quench Magnum build.

A few comments... I think square decking it could be pretty important to help get quench dialed in consistently from cylinder to cylinder. Even then, .030" is pretty tight. 10.5 CR with iron heads, stockish cam and hyper pistons is really pushing also. It may require premium fuel and/or retarded timing. I would think 9.5 would be safe and high 9's probably OK. I don't think stock is much over 9:1 if that. As far as water mods to the intake, that sounds like a lot of work and $$... maybe keep that one as backup.

I ran 10.00 compression in a 318 mag with .037 quench and it was fine on 87 octane. Even if I have to run premium but get 20% better MPG than I can get more miles per tank and more HP and TQ.

Dave, if I ever get anywhere close to Kalispell I'm going to look you up.

R.

Feel free to stop by the shop

http://www.blacktailmotors.com/contact/

I should have put this in the engine section, any way it can get moved?

My first thought is that you are going to have considerably more cubic inches,
So how much power and torque
Would be adequate for this 4wd Dakota?

Stock late model obd-ii 1998+
5.9v8 is in the ballpark of
245 hp at 4000
335 ft-lbs at 2900 to 3600 rpm
300 ft lbs at 2000 rpm

With you already planned higher static compression (true 8.7 to true 10.5)
and slightly longer duration 318 cam
guess you will be at least 12% above these.

If you go
Lean Burn air fuel
Or
Atkinson Cycle
You can trade off some power for higher fuel efficiency.

Would you be willing to offset bore and swap piston offset,
For less friction and better rod to crank power transfer angle?
There will be piston slap noise.

Would you be willing to fit Honda low friction bearings like NASCAR?

Any budget for ceramic coatings (3% gains)

Would you consider Mahle steel pistons since you will be buying 4.030 ?

Any budget for aluminum MP heads with their 53 cc combustion chambers?

What aero tweaks to the Dakota body could you tolerate?

I am gonna try the 5.9 because I have a nice set fresh bored block in a bag in the back room.

I already have the KB pistons.

Unless someone wants to trade me a set of KB167 pistons and a fresh bored 5.2 block those are kind of set in stone. I would prefer the 5.2 for this truck but got to go with what I got and I don't figure it will be a big loss with everything else I am gonna do.

Even if I could find some of the mopar magnum aluminum heads they cost a lot to get useable and the swirl and velocity are no where near what the iron heads are.

The honda bearings are fine by me but I worry a little about the cast crank going that small with a manual trans (got to think about 100,000 reliability here and I do tow cars on my 16ft open trailer with it from time to time). I could do a chevy 2.1 journal and see if I can find some 350 cheby pistons and use my 6.25 rods but then I am doing machine work and a re-balance. I actually have some an awesome set of NASCAR carillo rods 6.25 I think length(acutally they are 1.85 journal) I could use but then I got to find a crank shop capable of it and buy expensive custom pistons... maybe I can find a set of SCAT I beams for real cheap and try to scrounge up money for rebalancing.

I could rob a little atkins cycle theory and run the compression up by milling the heads .030 and then retard the cam to reduce the cranking compression and allow a longer push on the crank before exhaust opens as well as the benifit of a higher expansion ratio. It would not be exactly a true atkinson cycle but I don't even know if there is a defined intake closing point where it becomes atkinsons.

Again on the offset boring, the block is done, even if it was not I don't trust my local shops to pull it off and it would scare me on a magnum block to move it more than .030 anyhow and I doubt that would make any messurable difference.

I did not know there were any steel pistons available for an aplication like this but I think they would make detonation worse as they would not transfer heat away from the hot spots as fast, kind of like how AL heads can tolerate more compression I would think the same would apply to pistons.

Aero mods are kind of limited use for me, I can't give up much ground clearance (air dams and lowering is out)for when I am out gathering meat in the woods, most of my other driving is in town so not much to gain there but I don't think it would hurt to block off some of the grill area. Anyone got any other ideas I am willing to listen.


I am kind of on a budget (I have done all of these experimental engines on my own $$$ and honestly don't have much, if someone wants to chip in parts or $$$ send me a PM with what want to do and I will see if I can work it in) and under some un-know time constraint with the other engine starting to take a dump, I do have a few plain jain magnum engines sitting here I could throw in temporary while I build this but the 4x4 dakota is a pain to stick engines in and out of so it may become permanant if I did that.

What are your thoughts on the air gap design intake manifolds as a way to lower the intake air temperature of number 1?

http://www.hughesengines.com/Tools/Popup...itle=HUG%205409

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dodge-MOPAR-Plymouth-340-360-Magnum-Air-Gap-Dual-Plane-Aluminum-Intake-Manifold-/391078610751?hash=item5b0e1a073f:g:0XUAAOSwGvhUB4jL&vxp=mtr

It does have a much shorter runner length, but at part throttle cruise that will not have a measureable effect on fuel economy. Because the throttle will have to open a bit more to produce the same torque at lower rpms, it might even improve part throttle fuel economy, although it would be expected to worsen full throttle fuel efficiency in the 2800 to 3600 rpm range where the beer barrel 15.5 inch runners resonate.

I have tested both the m1 4bbl and hughes air-gap and they do dramatically reduce IAT and pinging (as a result of low IAT and no low RPM ram filling the cylinders at low RPM) but the lower RPM where I usually run this truck(500-2000 RPM) TQ is very noticably gone. That would make me need to shift higher and frictional losses would go up with the RPM. They both made very good gains starting around 2500 or so, at that point they would run away from the beer barrel but you can not run them as low in RPM, I am putting the m1 on my 410 stroker in my other dakota to kill some low end and add some top end, I sold the air-gap. There is nothing anywhere close to what the resonant tuning in the beer barrel can do at low RPM. This is why I am stuck on keeping the kegger, I just need to figure out how to manage the heat soaking desighn.

I don't want to give the impression I don't like the hughes... If you have an automatic and 3.92 gears the hughes is an awesome intake. The m1 I only like with strokers and more RPM.

Nothing to add, I just wanted to subscribe

Something like this is what I'd love to build for my W200 one of these years.

I wonder if the ceramic heat rejection coatings
could be applied to the INSIDE
of the coolant passages of the
Magnum V8 beer barrel intake manifold?

At the top of the priority list should be a coating that would not flake off and plug coolant passages or jam thermostats.

Maybe extra thick anodizing?

Thats a good idea! Sure would be easier than grinding all that out and putting a remote thermostat in. I could go ahead and coat the inside the plenum area of the intake also as long as I was positive none was gonna flake off.

I could sand blast it first to give extra grip to hold the coating on.

Isn't anodizing basically oxidizing the aluminum surface so dye can be made to stick? If thats what it is then it is basically microscopic saphires, how good of an insulation would that provide?

What about an alcohol injection system? You could build higher compression and still run it on 87 octane, plus the cooling affect should compensate for the heat absorbed by the intake. Also the mix would keep your valves, pistons and chambers clean, further extending detonation resistance.

Yes the coating is a form of Al2O3, like carborundum grinding stones or Sapphire.

Normally you would not want to coat a cooling passage but the beer barrel intake does not need heating since the fuel injectors spray onto the back side of the intake valve.

I haven't examined it closely.
Could the thermostat housing section in front
be cut away from the rest of the intake,
then rejoined using a thick insulating gasket?
That might isolate heat from soaking the aluminum runners.

There are now alot of magnesium engine parts.
Too bad the beer barrel intake was not magnesium.

I am glad it was not 1992-1994 era plastic,
because i remember Ford had a lot of complex plastic intakes crack.

Easy to check: Thermal conductivities measured in Watts per (meter x degree Kelvin)

Aluminum oxide - 30
Aluminum - 205

So anodizing would help some, but not a major amount because the layer is thin compared to the thickness of the aluminum. But every bit helps, right?


R.

Any reason you are choosing manifolds over headers?

No alchohol injection, don't want another tank to fill or something corroding up my stuff.

If I tried to cut a slot between the coolant and intake there would be nothing to seal, it is a very thin devider.

Maybe I could find someone locally to put on a thick anodizing layer.

I have the manifolds, I don't think shortys gain enough to be worth the bother, long tubes would be nice but got to keep it quiet and last a long time, long lasting ceramic coated headers are expensive and still not as quiet as manifolds.

Any good insulating material that don't cost a fortune I can make intake gaskets with?