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Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: csk] #2005755
02/04/16 10:06 PM
02/04/16 10:06 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,969
Chandler, AZ
Duner Offline
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Thanks.
I'm not sure what I was entering wrong... but it said I have a 12-second truck. LOL

Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: BradH] #2005777
02/04/16 10:30 PM
02/04/16 10:30 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
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Prospect, PA
BSB67 Offline
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I don't think the Moroso Calc is RWHP. I think it is net actual flywheel hp. Of course, no one really talks actual hp numbers, it is always corrected to standard conditions. I think people get what looks like logical RWHP numbers from the Moroso Calculator, but they fail to take into account atmospheric conditions. Therefore it is more of a coincidence the hp number look like RWHP. You need to correct the mph to standard conditions before you plug the numbers into the calc.

Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: mcat4321] #2005801
02/04/16 10:49 PM
02/04/16 10:49 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,267
North, Alabama
D-50 Offline
pro stock
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North, Alabama
I shift my D50 at 6800 but cross the finish line at 63-6400 and the Wallace calculator says that I am making 638 hp with my ET and weight. My dyno sheet says I am making 638 hp at 6800. That sounds pretty close. But the dyno said my motor makes 662 hp at 7300.


1.33 60 ft,6.21 at 110.59 in the 1/8, pump gas small block,2950lbs,drag radials,mufflers and driven to track ...
Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: D-50] #2005810
02/04/16 11:08 PM
02/04/16 11:08 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,634
Pattison Texas
csk Offline
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Pattison Texas
Originally Posted By D-50
I shift my D50 at 6800 but cross the finish line at 63-6400 and the Wallace calculator says that I am making 638 hp with my ET and weight. My dyno sheet says I am making 638 hp at 6800. That sounds pretty close. But the dyno said my motor makes 662 hp at 7300.


use the mph


1968 Charger COLD A/C Hilborn EFI
512ci 9.7 compression, Stealth heads, 4.10 gear A518 ODtrans 4100lb,10.93 full street car trim
2020 T/A 392

Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: mcat4321] #2005815
02/04/16 11:15 PM
02/04/16 11:15 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,225
Charleston
S
sixpackgut Offline
Drag Week Mod Champion
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S

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Posts: 9,225
Charleston
540 rwhp on my challenger 3600lbs or so got me around a 6.70 1/8th


Gen 3 power 6.22@110, 9.85@135
Follow @g3hemiswap on instagram

performance only racing, CRT, ultimate converter, superior design concepts, ThumperCarbs
Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: mcat4321] #2005819
02/04/16 11:23 PM
02/04/16 11:23 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421
Balt. Md
3
383man Offline
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Balt. Md
It seems to me that most of the time I hear someone throwing their HP numbers around and bragging about it they have never raced their car. Many just like to bench race with their HP numbers as I see it a good bit. I always ask them what does the car run since to me HP means little if you dont know how to use it and get it to the ground. Its funny when I see a hotrod with a blower and making over 1000 HP and yet they never race it. Ron

Last edited by 383man; 02/04/16 11:24 PM.
Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: mcat4321] #2005828
02/04/16 11:31 PM
02/04/16 11:31 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,969
Chandler, AZ
Duner Offline
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Chandler, AZ
When my buddy whips out his Moroso calculator and tells me what I'm making.... I always ask him what would it be making if I put the drivetrain in his way more aero Corvette? His answer is always - "Oh, about 75 hp more." LOL

Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: mcat4321] #2005872
02/05/16 12:15 AM
02/05/16 12:15 AM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,890
North Alabama
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Monte_Smith Offline
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North Alabama
Impressive dyno numbers and sheets seem to be like.......well you know, everybody has one. But mph numbers from a time slip to back up those HP claims is pretty rare. This is usually the place where some want to talk about proper converters, gearing and any number of other things. Many times it appears, some of those arguments from guys who's numbers don't match...........LOL!!!

We don't race dynos

Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: D-50] #2005980
02/05/16 08:22 AM
02/05/16 08:22 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,264
Prospect, PA
BSB67 Offline
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Prospect, PA
One thing is for sure, whether you want to believe the Calculator is RWHP or something else, if you are not correcting your track mph for atmospheric conditions before you use the calculator, the number you get will be an actual hp number, which is not what people use when talking chassis and engine dynos numbers. They are always using corrected numbers. And that little piece of cardboard and most on line calculators have no idea if you are in Colorado on a 90°F day or Maryland on a 42°F day.

Last edited by BSB67; 02/05/16 08:24 AM.
Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: mcat4321] #2005982
02/05/16 08:46 AM
02/05/16 08:46 AM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,969
Chandler, AZ
Duner Offline
top fuel
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On my tech card - I always say mine has 250hp.

Same thing when somebody asks.
It's WAY easier than hearing somebody tell me their brother's neighbor's uncle's brother had one JUST like it that made 400 hp stock - that went 9.00s off the showroom floor. Then they start into that whole "$100 bill on the dash story"........

Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: mcat4321] #2006008
02/05/16 10:29 AM
02/05/16 10:29 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 12,843
Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda Offline
I Live Here
an8sec70cuda  Offline
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Marion, South Carolina [><]
508 rwhp at 3700 lbs. ran 10.40 at 129.1 mph
636 rwhp at 3800 lbs. ran 9.54 at 140.4 mph

Same car, 2 different engines, same DynoJet chassis dyno.


CHIP
'70 hemicuda...8 sec street car
'69 road runner 440 w/ Indy SRs
'69 road runner 440-6, 4 speed
'71 Demon 340
'73 Chrysler New Yorker
'90 Chevy 454SS Silverado
'06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax...toy hauler
Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: Duner] #2006034
02/05/16 12:00 PM
02/05/16 12:00 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421
Balt. Md
3
383man Offline
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421
Balt. Md
Originally Posted By Duner
On my tech card - I always say mine has 250hp.

Same thing when somebody asks.
It's WAY easier than hearing somebody tell me their brother's neighbor's uncle's brother had one JUST like it that made 400 hp stock - that went 9.00s off the showroom floor. Then they start into that whole "$100 bill on the dash story"........



Yea that $100 dollar bill on the dash has been around a long time as I cant even remember how many times I have heard that. I had a guy tell me his basically stock 340 Demon ran low 12's so I asked him his mph in the 1/4 ? He told me about 135 ! shock laugh2 I told him I could run high 9's with that mph. grin Ron

Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: an8sec70cuda] #2006053
02/05/16 12:42 PM
02/05/16 12:42 PM
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 561
UK
rb446 Offline
mopar
rb446  Offline
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Posts: 561
UK
Originally Posted By an8sec70cuda
508 rwhp at 3700 lbs. ran 10.40 at 129.1 mph
636 rwhp at 3800 lbs. ran 9.54 at 140.4 mph

Same car, 2 different engines, same DynoJet chassis dyno.


Thats quite interesting in the % drivetrain loss dept actually....

636rwhp/3800 = 864fly to run the no's
60 Foot E.T. : 1.33
1/8 Mile E.T. : 6.02
1/8 Mile Trap Speed : 112.88
1/4 Mile E.T. : 9.54
1/4 Mile Trap Speed : 140
36% loss on the day at the track to rwhp dyno figs

508rwhp/3700 = 650fly to run the no's.
60 Foot E.T. : 1.45
1/8 Mile E.T. : 6.56
1/8 Mile Trap Speed : 103.58
1/4 Mile E.T. : 10.40
1/4 Mile Trap Speed : 129
28% loss per rwhp dyno figs
thats a bit excessive in the loss dept!
perhaps weight is the answer if drivetrain the same?

As I said before I'm not saying my calcs are 100% as only a tool but its worked out pretty much spot on for everything I've ever inputed, but then it would cos I'm after hp no's for the cars I ran and know about all the spec of the motors which matches up with hp produced/weights and timeslips + I ran at the same track every time, Santa Pod. 0 elevation....so you just keep changing the hp no. till you get the Actual ET/mph run....working in reverse if you like.

Last edited by rb446; 02/05/16 01:03 PM.

1969 'Cuda 446ci, best 9.96@133.9 in 1990
1971 340 'Cuda, best 11.01@122.8 in 1987
Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: rb446] #2006063
02/05/16 01:00 PM
02/05/16 01:00 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 12,843
Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda Offline
I Live Here
an8sec70cuda  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 12,843
Marion, South Carolina [><]
Originally Posted By rb446
Originally Posted By an8sec70cuda
508 rwhp at 3700 lbs. ran 10.40 at 129.1 mph
636 rwhp at 3800 lbs. ran 9.54 at 140.4 mph

Same car, 2 different engines, same DynoJet chassis dyno.


Thats quite interesting in the % drivetrain loss dept actually....

636rwhp/3800 = 864fly to run the no's
60 Foot E.T. : 1.33
1/8 Mile E.T. : 6.02
1/8 Mile Trap Speed : 112.88
1/4 Mile E.T. : 9.54
1/4 Mile Trap Speed : 140
36% loss on the day at the track to rwhp dyno figs

508rwhp/3700 = 650fly to run the no's.
60 Foot E.T. : 1.45
1/8 Mile E.T. : 6.56
1/8 Mile Trap Speed : 103.58
1/4 Mile E.T. : 10.40
1/4 Mile Trap Speed : 129
28% loss per rwhp dyno figs
thats a bit excessive in the loss dept!
perhaps weight is the answer if drivetrain the same?

As I said before I'm not saying my calcs are 100% as only a tool but its worked out pretty much spot on for everything I've ever inputed, but then it would cos I'm after hp no's for the cars I ran and know about all the spec of the motors+ I ran at the same track every time, Santa Pod. 0 elevation....so you just keep changing the hp no. till you get the Actual ET/mph run....working in reverse if you like.

The actual timeslips were...
1.49, 6.62 at 104.1 mph, 10.40 at 129.1 mph
1.32, 6.05 at 112.9 mph, 9.54 at 140.4 mph

The torque converters were different for each motor, but the rest of the driveline is identical. The car gained weight w/ the bigger motor due to adding a rollcage.
The 60' is slow on the 10.40 pass NOT due to spinning...that combo just didn't leave real hard.


CHIP
'70 hemicuda...8 sec street car
'69 road runner 440 w/ Indy SRs
'69 road runner 440-6, 4 speed
'71 Demon 340
'73 Chrysler New Yorker
'90 Chevy 454SS Silverado
'06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax...toy hauler
Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: an8sec70cuda] #2006065
02/05/16 01:17 PM
02/05/16 01:17 PM
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 561
UK
rb446 Offline
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UK
I think thats pretty close for the big hp motor, so I think I've been using a pretty good system.
The one thing I did manage to do was beat the short time numbers given by a small amount on a few occasions with the 440 car I ran.

Last edited by rb446; 02/05/16 01:23 PM.

1969 'Cuda 446ci, best 9.96@133.9 in 1990
1971 340 'Cuda, best 11.01@122.8 in 1987
Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: mcat4321] #2006067
02/05/16 01:19 PM
02/05/16 01:19 PM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 235
Gilbert AZ
tsanchez Offline
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Gilbert AZ
Drivetrain loss is not a fixed value, as hp goes up so does loss

Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: mcat4321] #2006075
02/05/16 01:28 PM
02/05/16 01:28 PM
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 561
UK
rb446 Offline
mopar
rb446  Offline
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Posts: 561
UK
Yes thats correct, and weight of car, drivetrain design and and......I personally am not interested in rwhp, its fly hp for exactly that reason, but it was interesting to see how much was in theory actually lost with those rw dyno no's when most say 10>20% and Wallace says 10%

Last edited by rb446; 02/05/16 03:55 PM.

1969 'Cuda 446ci, best 9.96@133.9 in 1990
1971 340 'Cuda, best 11.01@122.8 in 1987
Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: mcat4321] #2006310
02/05/16 08:14 PM
02/05/16 08:14 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,969
Chandler, AZ
Duner Offline
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Chandler, AZ
Another thing I found that wasn't a constant between dyno and track was fuel requirements....
I worked at dialing my hooptie in on the dyno, only to find out that it required quite a bit more fuel when it had to work against the wind resistance at the top end of the track.

Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: Duner] #2006358
02/05/16 10:04 PM
02/05/16 10:04 PM
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 561
UK
rb446 Offline
mopar
rb446  Offline
mopar

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Posts: 561
UK
Originally Posted By Duner
I have dyno charts showing RWHP - but the numbers are overly optimistic / false when compared to actual timeslips. Since all dynos are different, I assume the one I was on would be considered "happy" or "not stingy". LOL It worked well for a tuning tool, but that's about it.

With that said:
705rwhp only produced 10.51 @ 130.13 mph at 4190# in my truck.


Actually using my numbers I think your 705rwhp quoted is actually closer to fly hp!....and as you say "optimistic" by a long way I reckon, as this is what I got for your timeslip>
Power to Weight Ratio: 5.87
60 Foot E.T. : 1.46
1/8 Mile E.T. : 6.63
1/8 Mile Trap Speed : 102.53
1/4 Mile E.T. : 10.51
1/4 Mile Trap Speed : 128
thats with a hp input of 714/4190lbs

what is probably more correct is if put in 748fly hp you get>
60 Foot E.T. : 1.44
1/8 Mile E.T. : 6.53
1/8 Mile Trap Speed : 104.14
1/4 Mile E.T. : 10.34
1/4 Mile Trap Speed : 130
thats probably more in line with a heavy as trying to get 4000+ to move ain't easy, your gonna lose some ET, set aside aero issues, thats a hard one!

I just got too much time on my hands and don't race anymore frown ..and I'm stuck in front of my computer mostly with my work.

Last edited by rb446; 02/05/16 10:33 PM.

1969 'Cuda 446ci, best 9.96@133.9 in 1990
1971 340 'Cuda, best 11.01@122.8 in 1987
Re: wheel horsepower vs. ET [Re: rb446] #2006385
02/05/16 10:39 PM
02/05/16 10:39 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,969
Chandler, AZ
Duner Offline
top fuel
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Posts: 1,969
Chandler, AZ
Thanks!

What kind of numbers does it spit out for this timeslip?

60' 1.73
330' 4.5917
1/8 6.9227
1/8 mph 105.51
1000' 8.8714
1/4 10.6167
1/4 mph 133.65

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