Need Advice, freshening an old engine.
#1671865
09/16/14 01:16 AM
09/16/14 01:16 AM
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 364 Houston, Texas
Slant6pak
OP
enthusiast
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OP
enthusiast
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 364
Houston, Texas
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Hey guys,
I have a '66 383 4-barrel that was given to me as part of package deal. I was told the engine was pulled from a rotten '66 Chrysler before it went to the demo derby.
The engine appears to have never been apart, it turns over fine, had clean coolant in it, and 6 of the 8 plugs seemed pretty happy. The other two had some fluffy black fouling but were not wet with oil.
The rear main and crank snout seals don't appear to have been leaking, however the engine had been gushing oil from valvecovers for years.
I've gotten the outside of the engine pretty clean and I'm about ready to take a closer look inside.
My question is: how far would you go, and how much money would you invest, in a "free" engine?
I want to install it in my '68 Coronet to replace the missing original. It doesn't have to be a earth-shaker I just want a decent engine that will give me a couple years of cruise nights and Friday drives to work while I invest my funds in other areas of the car.
I've already ordered replacement gaskets for the oil pan, valvecovers, timing cover, new timing chain, etc. I was also planning on ordering a new oil pump.
The prudent thing to do is check the rod and main bearings, I was planing on doing one at a time?
Should I do the rear main seal? Read lots of horror stories about the new seals.
Should I pull the heads? Can replace the steel shim gaskets with a thicker comp gasket without having the heads surfaced?
Valve seals?
Should I pull the pistons one at a time to clean, inspect?
What about the cam? Peeking in the distributor hole the came lobes have a pretty good vanish coating on them, and the front lobe doesn't look like the wear is an consistent as the others.
Need some guidance... I have no problem buying the parts needed to ensure the engine lives... and I don't have a problem stabbing in a new cam as long as things don't snowball... new springs, etc.
I just worry about the constant threads I see about crappy replacement parts, and I don't want to open pandora's box and go full rebuild right now.
2016 Challenger Scat Pack Shaker 1000 ci Brass Era Speedster project
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Re: Need Advice, freshening an old engine.
[Re: Triggerfish]
#1671870
09/16/14 12:23 PM
09/16/14 12:23 PM
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 5,102 Western Md.
skicker
"The Champ"
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"The Champ"
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 5,102
Western Md.
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I did a complete freshen of my 383 when I built the Satellite. Mine was a good running motor that was removed about 2 years before I got it. As for the block we cleaned everything inside and out. We did not hot tank it and used the existing cam bearings. Cylinders still showed some crosshatch as the engine only had 52K on it. We ball honed the cylinders and reinstalled the factory pistons with new rings. I had the crank turned 10/10 and installed all new bearings. Rods are stock. We used a small Lunati Hyd cam shaft. I had a set of 452 heads laying around so we used them to pick up the hardened exhaust seats rather than spending the money to have them installed in the original heads. New parts included the timing chain, oil pump, bearings, rings, gaskets, fuel pump, water pump, distributor and carb. If you do the work you can do yourself you should be able to do it for about $1200.00 depending on how many accessories you buy new. A buddy of mine went the other route and just pulled a 383 out of a derby car and installed it in a daily driver. The only thing he did was clean the pan and p/u screen and install a new oil pump. 2 years or so on it with no issues other than it smokes a little on start-up and does burn some oil. It's your call, condition of the current engine will dictate what you need to do.
...FAFO...
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Re: Need Advice, freshening an old engine.
[Re: dogdays]
#1671872
09/16/14 03:33 PM
09/16/14 03:33 PM
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Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 5,183
Porter67
master
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master
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 5,183
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The "might as well" disease is delt with very well by your family Dr. Then possibly you can get one project done. That's called ADHD. Life can be a balancing act for any adult, but if you find yourself constantly late, disorganized, forgetful, and overwhelmed by your responsibilities, you may have ADD/ADHD.
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Re: Need Advice, freshening an old engine.
[Re: Porter67]
#1671873
09/17/14 12:56 PM
09/17/14 12:56 PM
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 364 Houston, Texas
Slant6pak
OP
enthusiast
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OP
enthusiast
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 364
Houston, Texas
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Thanks for the replies guys,
As I said before I really don't want to go full rebuild, and if do a ring and bearing job thats what I might as well do.
I also don't have a local engine shop that I trust...
So for now I'm just going to pull the pan and check the bearings. But will removing and and retorquing the main caps one at a time disturb the rear main seal?
What about the replacing the head gaskets?
2016 Challenger Scat Pack Shaker 1000 ci Brass Era Speedster project
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Re: Need Advice, freshening an old engine.
[Re: dogdays]
#1671875
09/17/14 11:53 PM
09/17/14 11:53 PM
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 641 Monroe NC
Luvcars69
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 641
Monroe NC
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At the very least while you are installing new valve cover gaskets put valve seals in it! Also check the timing chain for wear & the dreaded plastic upper gear.
Last edited by luvcars69; 09/17/14 11:55 PM.
Making cars faster one at a time!
19 Challenger Scat Pack white 16 Ram Sport SB Regular cab black 14 Charger Pursuit silver 78 Magnum 400 gray 69 SuperBee 512 Passion 4-speed 4:10
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Re: Need Advice, freshening an old engine.
[Re: Slant6pak]
#1671877
09/18/14 11:44 AM
09/18/14 11:44 AM
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Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,769 Holland MI Ottawa
2boltmain
master
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master
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,769
Holland MI Ottawa
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Oh my god how quickly a "Budget freshen up" turns into roller valvetrain, stroker, stealth heads ect. Since you pulled the pan might as well go new rod and main bearings. Definitely new valve seals. Keep it as is (were assuming it was a good engine) with a good ignition, carb and dual exhaust. Maybe some cheap headers? Save your dang $$$ for your FUTURE motor.
Keep old mopars alive.
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Re: Need Advice, freshening an old engine.
[Re: 2boltmain]
#1671878
09/18/14 01:36 PM
09/18/14 01:36 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,495 Oregon City, OR
Baxter61
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,495
Oregon City, OR
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Just as a point of reference, after attempting to purchase several "good" big blocks, I settled on a free smogger 440 from a buddy. I decided I wanted to do a cam and intake. After pulling the original cam (note this was a running motor that I personally rode in the car) the cam bearings were discovered as shot. Now I am doing a ring and bearing, cam, intake, and putting a set of stainless valve and hart seats in a set of 516 heads I got for free as well. So far my "free" motor that has now turned to a ring and bearing project is costing me in the neighborhood of $1600, and no, I am not even changing pistons and will still end up with an 8:1 motor.
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Re: Need Advice, freshening an old engine.
[Re: Slant6pak]
#1671879
09/18/14 05:19 PM
09/18/14 05:19 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,255 Columbus, GA
Michael Ecks
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,255
Columbus, GA
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Quote:
So for now I'm just going to pull the pan and check the bearings. But will removing and and retorquing the main caps one at a time disturb the rear main seal?
Don't check the bearings, replace them. Pulling the caps probably won't cause a problem for the rear main seal, BUT reusing bearings means you've lost the bearing crush that keeps them where they are supposed to be and in the shape they are supposed to be.
My ?? Gasket set, lifters, timing chain, rod and main bearings, oil pump.
Disassemble it down to the short block. Unless you see major problems with the heads like seriously gunked up valves don't fully disassemble them, just enough to hunt down the pieces of the valve stem seals and replace them. I've run un-hardened J heads for about a hundred thousand miles with major issue. If it has a solid cam, you might need to replace the valve springs, otherwise the lifters will have long since bled down relieving some of the pressure on the open valves.
Pull the lifters and check the lobes, if they all look good, drop a new set of lifters in and plan to break them in just like a new cam. The old oil left in the lifters is probably solidified by now, and replacing the lifters is probably cheaper than disassembling each one and cleaning the internals.
Unless there is major cylinder damage from sitting or indication of a broken ring or something, I wouldn't even pull the pistons. Change each bearing, main and rod, one at a time and look for any serious damage that might indicate need to have the crank polished.
Otherwise, throw it back together with the new gaskets and go.
"The happiness of your life depends upon the quality of your thoughts" ~ Roman Emperor Marcus Aurelius
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Re: Need Advice, freshening an old engine.
[Re: Michael Ecks]
#1671880
09/18/14 05:35 PM
09/18/14 05:35 PM
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 364 Houston, Texas
Slant6pak
OP
enthusiast
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OP
enthusiast
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 364
Houston, Texas
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How would I change the main bearings one at time?
2016 Challenger Scat Pack Shaker 1000 ci Brass Era Speedster project
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Re: Need Advice, freshening an old engine.
[Re: RapidRobert]
#1671882
09/20/14 11:23 AM
09/20/14 11:23 AM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 12,675 Columbia, CT
moper
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 12,675
Columbia, CT
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Quote:
People have a tendency to get too deep in their first project & spend months/years on a project reworking it from head to toe as opposed to getting it up & running & enjoying it. Good luck with it
x2. It was running, the plugs looked good. Clean it off, regasket the intake and valve covers (everyone sees the valley pan...), paint it, and run it. I would not "look" at anything. Odds are on an old used engine you'll find at least one thing you dont like. That will domino into a rebuild, etc etc etc. Run it. If it breaks, then look into it.
Well, art is art, isn't it? Still, on the other hand, water is water! And east is east and west is west and if you take cranberries and stew them like applesauce they taste much more like prunes than rhubarb does. Now, uh... Now you tell me what you know.
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Re: Need Advice, freshening an old engine.
[Re: Slant6pak]
#1671883
09/20/14 11:59 AM
09/20/14 11:59 AM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 8,020 Pangaea
B5 Bee
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 8,020
Pangaea
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Quote:
How would I change the main bearings one at time?
You roll them in. Place something in the oil hole like a nail, turn the crank so the nail catches the bearing and rolls it out. Install new one the same way.
I agree with RR and dogday.....seal it and run it.
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