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But Barry says there are WSS T/A's.

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If you mean this Barry, I know better than that.

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This brings up a good question. A 70 model year JS23(RT) with A63, does the one pc. rear/tail Panel Astrotone Moulding remain textured Argent or is it blacked out? If it does remain textured argent, then does the grill remain textured argent to match the rear panel or black like a regular RT with out A63? Seen them restored both ways. Which is correct?

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I believee tail panel piece is always textured argent regardless of whether the car is an R/T or not. Only the grille comes argent(non R/T) or black(R/T and T/A).

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That's what I've always seen and believed. And IIRC, the parts book only has one p/n for it. If it came argent and black there would be two p/n's.

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In 1970, the challenger R/T cars did Not have a blacked out tailpanel, so there was no reason to offer a blacked out A63 trim piece. A 1970 Challenger R/T with A63 will use an astrotone panel. There has been some discussion about different shades of astrotone, but I believe this to be a production variation, not something that was done intentionaly. astrotone doesn't really match the grill argent, it's a bit darker.

Tav

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So is A63 called out as N/A on T/A literature?

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It is listed as not available.

http://www.challengertaregistry.com/photos/bulletins/tsb_d3_pg2.jpg

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This brings up a good question. A 70 model year JS23(RT) with A63, does the one pc. rear/tail Panel Astrotone Moulding remain textured Argent or is it blacked out? If it does remain textured argent, then does the grill remain textured argent to match the rear panel or black like a regular RT with out A63? Seen them restored both ways. Which is correct?

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I believee tail panel piece is always textured argent regardless of whether the car is an R/T or not. Only the grille comes argent(non R/T) or black(R/T and T/A).

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That's what I've always seen and believed. And IIRC, the parts book only has one p/n for it. If it came argent and black there would be two p/n's.

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In 1970, the challenger R/T cars did Not have a blacked out tailpanel, so there was no reason to offer a blacked out A63 trim piece. A 1970 Challenger R/T with A63 will use an astrotone panel. There has been some discussion about different shades of astrotone, but I believe this to be a production variation, not something that was done intentionaly. astrotone doesn't really match the grill argent, it's a bit darker.

Tav

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So regardless of the rear panel all RT/SE and RT/A63 had black grills?

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In 1970, the challenger R/T cars did Not have a blacked out tailpanel, so there was no reason to offer a blacked out A63 trim piece. A 1970 Challenger R/T with A63 will use an astrotone panel. There has been some discussion about different shades of astrotone, but I believe this to be a production variation, not something that was done intentionaly. astrotone doesn't really match the grill argent, it's a bit darker.

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Sorry guys, I know it's not the popular opinion but my first Challenger which I bought in 1974 was an R/T SE & the tail panel was black... Can I prove the original owner didn't paint it? No.. But my uncle was the original owner of another R/T SE & it too had a black rear panel.... The rear panel on my challenger was hammered when I bought the car in 74 so I pulled the panel & replaced it... Tossed the original in the rafters of the garage... It was still there when I first saw this question was posted back around 04 & I pulled it down & checked it out.. Definately black but textured not like the astrotone but more like organisol.... I offered to send it to Ken but he had no interest because he had already made up his mind & didn't want evidence that he could be wrong..Oh when that thread was running there were probably six or seven posters who had owned R/T S.E's that said their cars had black panels dating back to at least the early eighties..I've seen the there's no part number argument before & there are dozens of other parts with out special numbers... Do they not exsist too? Anyone ever fine a part number for the molded brake booster vacuum hose? Or don't those exsist?

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I don't think A63 was availible on 70 T/A's or cars with N94 fiberglass hoods. The dealer literature I see pre dates T/A and N94 release dates.

Now for 1971 the similar A46 molding package was not availible for N94 cars. http://www.hamtramck-historical.com/imag...hallenger_4.jpg So, I would think that would apply to the 1970 A63 package also?? It's because the rear hood molding (unmodified) will not clip onto the thicker fiberglass hood.

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I also used to think that the rear hood molding wouldn't fit on the fiberglass hood, but further investigation revealed that the rear hood molding WILL fit on Original T/A hoods, but there is some difficulty installing it on a Reproduction hood. I think the reason the rear hood molding was not available with the T/A hood is simply a styling choice, similar to how some color combinations are not reccomended, they didn't want bright trim all around the blacked out hood. Dayclona has the rear hood molding installed on an original T/A hood on his 71 T/A creation.
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I wonder if Dayclona had to trim the molding to get it to fit?? Interesting...

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I know its not common. But I have a factory R/T SE that has a argent grille. I have pictures from 1970 to verify. Sometimes they just put in what they had at the time.....

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This brings up a good question. A 70 model year JS23(RT) with A63, does the one pc. rear/tail Panel Astrotone Moulding remain textured Argent or is it blacked out? If it does remain textured argent, then does the grill remain textured argent to match the rear panel or black like a regular RT with out A63? Seen them restored both ways. Which is correct?

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I believee tail panel piece is always textured argent regardless of whether the car is an R/T or not. Only the grille comes argent(non R/T) or black(R/T and T/A).

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That's what I've always seen and believed. And IIRC, the parts book only has one p/n for it. If it came argent and black there would be two p/n's.

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In 1970, the challenger R/T cars did Not have a blacked out tailpanel, so there was no reason to offer a blacked out A63 trim piece. A 1970 Challenger R/T with A63 will use an astrotone panel. There has been some discussion about different shades of astrotone, but I believe this to be a production variation, not something that was done intentionaly. astrotone doesn't really match the grill argent, it's a bit darker.

Tav

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Sorry guys, I know it's not the popular opinion but my first Challenger which I bought in 1974 was an R/T SE & the tail panel was black... Can I prove the original owner didn't paint it? No.. But my uncle was the original owner of another R/T SE & it too had a black rear panel.... The rear panel on my challenger was hammered when I bought the car in 74 so I pulled the panel & replaced it... Tossed the original in the rafters of the garage... It was still there when I first saw this question was posted back around 04 & I pulled it down & checked it out.. Definately black but textured not like the astrotone but more like orginsol (sp).... I offered to send it to Ken but he had no interest because he had already made up his mind & didn't want evidence that he could be wrong..Oh when that thread was running there were probably six or seven posters who had owned R/T S.E's that said their cars had black panels dating back to at least the early eighties..I've seen the there's no part number argument before & there are dozens of other parts with out special numbers... Do they not exsist too? Anyone ever fine a part number for the molded brake booster vacuum hose? Or don't those exsist?

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I know its not common. But I have a factory R/T SE that has a argent grille. I have pictures from 1970 to verify. Sometimes they just put in what they had at the time.....

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What color is the car?

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I wonder if Dayclona had to trim the molding to get it to fit?? Interesting...

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When I talked with him about it, he said that he didn't have to modify the hood or the trim. Tight fit, but it went right on.

I happened to have an ASC&P reproduction hood & original rear hood trim laying around back then, so I checked the fit myself. It's real close to fitting on the reproduction hood, but won't quite go without thinning the repro hood in just a couple spots.

Tav

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