46re trans surge / lock up problems??
#1596681
03/22/14 03:05 PM
03/22/14 03:05 PM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 1,728 ST clair shores MI
moretoys
OP
top fuel
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OP
top fuel
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 1,728
ST clair shores MI
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2000 dakota 5.9 ,4x4,3.91 gears.with 46 re trans. owned since new,trans service every 25,000 miles with mopar atf+4. has 100,000 miles on it now. Slight throttle from about 37 mph and up to about 70 The tach will jump up / down about about 200 rpms, feel slight lugging, If I let it continue to surge, it will set a code for tcc solenoid p1740? No other codes,I let off the throttle and hit it again,usually clears up. The light has not come on in over a year.but this problem is there almost everyday now., It used to do it only on certain inclines will pulling a snowmobile trailer. (was under warranty at the time, dealer had no clue). I think the lock up is coming on too early ( i am getting better fuel economy than usual, and my rpms are a touch lower) I've called a couple trans shops in the area,non have an idea. I did check for service bulletins and there is one for a boost plate,bigger hole. With a scan tool I watched the tps, nothing looked weird.but I know sometimes you don't see everything. This problem has been there randomly for 90,000 miles,But the past 8 months it is almost always here. all shifting is normal, alittle soft if anything,(always been)
If it ever gets above freezing,and the snow melts: This is what I'm thinking of doing. removing the valve body, replace boost plate/cover,replace ttc solenoid and check all the springs in the valve body. I am no trans guy, any other advise or tips??
I did disconnect the battery for a reboot,NO help, As of yesterday NO codes. fluid still clean.time for a change again anyway. It is NOT lock up shutter, I know what that feels like.
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Re: 46re trans surge / lock up problems??
[Re: moretoys]
#1596682
03/22/14 03:53 PM
03/22/14 03:53 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,225 Park Forest, IL
slantzilla
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Park Forest, IL
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This is a pretty well known problem with Dakotas. Replace the throttle position sensor.
"Everybody funny, now you funny too."
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Re: 46re trans surge / lock up problems??
[Re: 71yelladustr]
#1596684
03/22/14 07:47 PM
03/22/14 07:47 PM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 286 Catskill, NY
teflon
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 286
Catskill, NY
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Quote:
Drilling or replacing the boost valve plate will help with lock up apply pressure. I have done a lot of 46RE trans repairs and I have yet to replace a lock-up of OD solenoid. When you were monitoring the TPS, did you look at the lock-up request? If it is staying on (locked) and and not toggling its probably torque converter time. I would advise installing the new style inter-locking seals on the input shaft for the lock-up circuit if you decide to put a converter in it.
What he said and I will add use steel input shaft sealing rings.
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Re: 46re trans surge / lock up problems??
[Re: teflon]
#1596685
03/23/14 02:25 AM
03/23/14 02:25 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,225 Park Forest, IL
slantzilla
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When you get done pulling the trans and it still does it, replace the TPS.
My '00 R/T did it. Dealer wanted to replace all kinds of crap but would not guarantee it would fix the problem. I asked about it on the Dakota/Durango board and found out it is/was a well known problem that Chrysler refused to address.
Got a TPS from Otterzone and $32 later it was golden, and was still fine 150,000 miles later when I sold the truck.
I have personally seen 6 other V-6 and V-8 Dakota/Durangos fixed the same way. Dealers always act like they've never seen it before.
"Everybody funny, now you funny too."
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Re: 46re trans surge / lock up problems??
[Re: slantzilla]
#1596686
03/23/14 12:04 PM
03/23/14 12:04 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421 Balt. Md
383man
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Balt. Md
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I saw alot of Diesel trucks do this and I had to replace alot of TPS's for it but myself I did not get many Dakota's doing it seemed it was always a diesel truck with this problem. I also had some with a bad clockspring cause it as the 5 volt feed to the speed control switches on the steering wheel shared its 5 volt feed with the TPS 5 volt feed and it would throw the TPS reading off and the PCM would not always know where the throttle pedal was from the erattic TPS reading as the 5 volt feed went through the clockspring below the steering wheel and could short in the cloclspring. I would replace the TPS first if you dont have a scanner where you can moniter the TPS and the lock-up on signal. Its alot cheaper and easier to repalce the TPS first if you are going to guess and throw parts at it. Dont mean that as a smart comment as sometimes you almost have to do that to verify a problem. Course it could be the converter or the seals as I saw that a good bit also but as said its much easier to try the TPS first. Ron
Last edited by 383man; 03/23/14 12:08 PM.
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Re: 46re trans surge / lock up problems??
[Re: moretoys]
#1596688
03/23/14 05:29 PM
03/23/14 05:29 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,225 Park Forest, IL
slantzilla
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What is happening is the TPS is slow to respond. It will not set any codes.
When mine was doing it I was sure it was a lock-up problem. I bought the truck with 39K on it and the guy I bought it from said it had done it the whole time he had owned it too.
It can be incredibly annoying, especially when the cruise is set.
"Everybody funny, now you funny too."
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Re: 46re trans surge / lock up problems??
[Re: slantzilla]
#1596689
03/23/14 09:18 PM
03/23/14 09:18 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421 Balt. Md
383man
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Its tuff to pick up on a scanner but I could see it on the Co-Pilot tool I had a the Dealer some years back. I would record it when it happened and then download it to the shop computer and it would show up in a graph. Then I could see the bad ones as they had gagged lines jumping all over and a good one would be a nice solid line. It does it so fast the scanner wont usually show it. Ron
Last edited by 383man; 03/23/14 09:21 PM.
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Re: 46re trans surge / lock up problems??
[Re: 383man]
#1596690
03/23/14 11:02 PM
03/23/14 11:02 PM
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 276 Temecula, Ca.
zzyzxpat
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Temecula, Ca.
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If it is the TPS and it is being commanded to cycle the TCC, you will many times only see it on a scope. A scanner will not pick up the data quick enough. A scanner only samples a minority of data then averages it before it tells you what it sees. This is a common problem with the diesels, usually dirty battery connections,or an alternator making electrical noise. There are many aftermarket solutions to cure the problem. I have never heard of this in a Durango and I do this stuff for a living, but that is not to say it doesn't exist. The key is to find out whether it is being commanded or not. that will tell you if it is in the trans or not.
Pat
" The last official act of any goverment, is to loot the treasury" George Washington
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Re: 46re trans surge / lock up problems??
[Re: slantzilla]
#1596692
03/24/14 01:33 AM
03/24/14 01:33 AM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,168 Vancouver, WA
MoparMarq
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Sep 2003
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Vancouver, WA
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Quote:
When mine was doing it I was sure it was a lock-up problem. I bought the truck with 39K on it and the guy I bought it from said it had done it the whole time he had owned it too.
Sister's '04 Jeep GC did it for 3 years, the last year or so was real bad. Granted, 42RE, not 46RE, but even so, I thought it was the TC clutch lining or TC clutch. Dialed up the pressure just slightly (fresh fluid of course), but didn't help much. Two visits to dealer and they refused to address the problem. Tech even drove it and came back and said "Yeah, it's going in and out of lockup. But it's not setting a code, so we can't do anything." The TPS finally set a code after 3 years of this crap. Replaced the TPS and problem went away.
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Re: 46re trans surge / lock up problems??
[Re: MoparMarq]
#1596693
03/24/14 03:34 AM
03/24/14 03:34 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421 Balt. Md
383man
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Balt. Md
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Funny but we used to get the front wheel drive cars with the 604 trans come in sometimes on certain years complaining about a chattering about 25 to 40 mph. What happened was on that lock-up converter they would bring in in gradually and actually slip the clutch some for what they called ....Partial lock-up. But it would chatter like a clutch chatter in a stick car as this was the lock-up clutch chattering because if it did not wear in right it would do this. So we would first try to do what they called .....burnishing the lock-up clutch with the scann tool. Then when that did not fix it later we would flash the TCM controller which as far as I know just took the partial lock-up out of the opperation and then it worked like any other lock-up as it was either fully on or off after the flash and no more partial lock-up so no more chattering. Ron
Last edited by 383man; 03/24/14 03:36 AM.
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Re: 46re trans surge / lock up problems?? "update"
[Re: moretoys]
#1596695
03/31/14 09:09 PM
03/31/14 09:09 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421 Balt. Md
383man
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If it throws a......TCC solenoid error I found that is usually an electrical problem in the TCC circuit. Which means the solenoid , wireing or PCM. I appoligize as I must have missed the part about that code. But that code where it says ....solenoid error seemed to always be an electrical part of that circuit because for that code to set it sees a problem in the electrical part of the solenoid circuit when the PCM activates the TCC solenoid it does not see voltage spike it looks for. If it was something else like the converter clutch lining bad or something like that the code might be .....No RPM drop at lock-up. Ron
Last edited by 383man; 03/31/14 09:16 PM.
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Re: 46re trans surge / lock up problems?? "update"
[Re: 383man]
#1596696
04/01/14 03:28 AM
04/01/14 03:28 AM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,035 Missouri U.S.A.
71yelladustr
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super stock
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Missouri U.S.A.
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What is the exact P-code # its setting?
392 gen III hemi on E-85 727 trans Dana 60 10.02@134
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Re: 46re trans surge / lock up problems?? "update"
[Re: 71yelladustr]
#1596697
04/02/14 07:38 PM
04/02/14 07:38 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,616 Kissimmee Fl.
dusturbd340W5
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master
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Kissimmee Fl.
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in his first post it will set a code for tcc solenoid p1740? what you need to do is drive the vehicle with a scanner hooked up and watch what the TC rpm slippage is at when it is acting up, if the numbers are high than you most likely have a bad TC. A good TC the slippage numbers will be in the single digits.
70 duster full chassis super pro 416 CNC Indybrock heads 727 w/brake
best so far 1.212 60 6.219 in 1/8 at 110.88 9.768 at 137.81 1/4
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