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Turbos? #1569505
01/27/14 03:24 PM
01/27/14 03:24 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,770
Moved to N.E. Tennessee
GomangoCuda Offline OP
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GomangoCuda  Offline OP
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Recently a friend called me and asked about turbocharging a 383 for street/strip use. I'm glad he called instead of asking in person, that way he didn't get to see my deer in the headlights expression. I told him I probably don't know any more than he does. He gave me a book he got somewhere and it is useless. It only tells the history of turbos and then goes on to describe and picture turbos on 4 cyl engines and exotics. No information what so ever on what to use were, when and why. Are there any good books or websites that describe how to design a system for our V8 engines? What parts to use? Blowthrough carbs? Single or twins? Wastegates, blowoff valves, & intercoolers Ohh My. Camshafts, compression, pumpgas, E85?

Budjet? Can it be done for a reasonable cost or is it going to actually cost many thousands of dollars? I see inexpensive Chinese turbos on ebay. Are they usable or junk? Are they big enough for a single? Small enough for twins? Are there viable junk yard parts? Are there any cookbook combos that I could use?

He is not looking for huge horsepower. A safe, modest boost is more what he is interested in. Call it entry level boosting.

Last edited by GomangoCuda; 01/27/14 03:50 PM.
Re: Turbos? [Re: GomangoCuda] #1569506
01/27/14 03:46 PM
01/27/14 03:46 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,635
Oakland, MI
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dizuster Offline
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I have to say from building one over the last few years, that there are a few books out there that can help. But nothing competes with the up to date info on the internet.

www.theturboforums.com is a great place to start.

Turbo mopars are few and far between, but the same principals apply to all engines. Just read, read, read...

Assuming you have an engine already (that has somewhat low compression), and you can fabricate yourself... you'll need

Turbo - Most chinese stuff has a small exhaust (turbine), so you'll need two if you go that route. Or you can use the popular Borg Warner S475 for about $700. Those seem to be the two most cost effective routes.

Waste Gate - China to Germany... you're looking at $150 to $700 here. I just have the cheap chinese knock off, but it siezed once already and I had to put a bronze valve guide in it)

Blow off Valve - Same as above. Less critical then the WG though, so you can probably skimp here more then anywhere. $100~$400.

Carb - If you're going the E85 route, I highly recommend Eric at Horsepower Innovations. CSU and C&S can also do them. $800

Carb hat - $200

Misc - Silicon couplers, clamps, tube for headers, hot side flange, ect... This part can be pricy. If you can use manifolds you'll save yourself a lot of money here. I have about $1000 into my misc material, but I used manifolds.

So you're looking at $2,500 minimum to put a system together. That being said... a S475 turbo on E85 will make a lot of power. Good heads and cam will get it to 1000hp. Junk parts will still make over 700hp with enough boost.

What are your goals. What is your budget? Those are the two most important things to know before you get started. Once you know that, people can help suggest parts to get you there.

Re: Turbos? [Re: GomangoCuda] #1569507
01/27/14 04:20 PM
01/27/14 04:20 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
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Romeo MI
Like your seeing... the biggest part and maybe the
hardest part is getting the sizing right... when I
started planning out a turbo build I did a flow chart
on my engine to see what the flow was at 100 rpm
intervals to determain the turbo size(to make sure
it fell within the island for efficiency) once that
is done then its looking at the turbo maps for different
size turbos...heat is a killer on the turbo life and
its efficiency... if its too small of a turbo you
will be way off the efficiency island.. if its too
big of a turbo then its slow to spool up and get on
the efficiency island.... also will a inter cooler
be used... they help make power but like anything
else on a turbo build it costs... I think the turbo
forum Scott showed above will be your biggest help...
dont just jump in with both feet without doing your
home work first

Re: Turbos? [Re: MR_P_BODY] #1569508
01/27/14 05:20 PM
01/27/14 05:20 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,763
Hot Rod Ridge
FastmOp Offline
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Turbomustangs .com is the best place to research.
Precision is a great place to call and talk to a tech as well.

Re: Turbos? [Re: GomangoCuda] #1569509
01/27/14 06:36 PM
01/27/14 06:36 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,022
Andrews,In. U.S.of A.
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67_Satellite Offline
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Andrews,In. U.S.of A.
If you still want a book,get "maximum boost" by Corky Bell.It will get you most of the big pieces of the puzzle.As mentioned, lots of good info on turbo mustang site too.

Re: Turbos? [Re: 67_Satellite] #1569510
01/27/14 06:48 PM
01/27/14 06:48 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
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Quote:

If you still want a book,get "maximum boost" by Corky Bell.It will get you most of the big pieces of the puzzle.As mentioned, lots of good info on turbo mustang site too.




I bought the "Maximum Boost" book when I started out
and it had some good formulas and gave a good idea
of what you want

Re: Turbos? [Re: MR_P_BODY] #1569511
01/27/14 09:27 PM
01/27/14 09:27 PM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 928
NC
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SLOW67 Offline
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NC
I have a cheap chinese GT45 off ebay. It's been fine for over two years street and track. The wastegate is a $60 ebay unit to and other than being alittle too small it works well. All in all my whole setup was in the $1200 range including the piping, intercooler, and fuel system. Remember you will have to have a high pressure EFI style pump with a boost referenced fp regulator and a return line. In my opinion I wouldn't waste the money on buying a blowthru carb built by someone else. Google hanger 18 carb mods and follow his instructions and you can make a regular 650/750 work fine. The only part I had problems with was right on the hit but I got that taken care of, now I'm moving on to EFI (it's a street car)

Re: Turbos? [Re: dizuster] #1569512
01/29/14 12:34 PM
01/29/14 12:34 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,770
Moved to N.E. Tennessee
GomangoCuda Offline OP
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GomangoCuda  Offline OP
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Quote:

Or you can use the popular Borg Warner S475 for about $700. Those seem to be the two most cost effective routes.



Is this the S475 that you are talking about? ebay S475 I'll talk to my friend and find out what he was thinking to spend on this project. If his budjet is realistic then I'll buy the Corky Bell book and start planning.

What should we be looking at for compression? What about converter? He currently has a 9 1/2" PTC. Too loose?

When plumbing a single where do you run the crossover pipe? In front of the engine? Under the oilpan? Where do you run the huge single exhaust pipe?

Thanks everyone for the help. If this goes forward then I'm sure I will be back for more specific help LOL.

Last edited by GomangoCuda; 01/29/14 01:24 PM.

In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is.
Re: Turbos? [Re: GomangoCuda] #1569513
01/29/14 03:37 PM
01/29/14 03:37 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,635
Oakland, MI
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dizuster Offline
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Can't get to the link... but you're looking for a S475, 75mm compressor, 96mm exh/turbing, with a 1.32 A/R. Those are the cheap versions.

I run a 9.5" PTC, but you will probably need a stator/pump change to tighten it up. Mine stalls ~5200rpm on boost, but only 2200 on motor.

Here are some pics of mine... should give you an idea what you can do. Just need to plan ahead, and take advantage of the room you have.

Compression depends on fuel used and intercooler. Mine is 9.2:1, iron heads, E85 (carb), no intercooler.

http://www.theturboforums.com/threads/357669-Updated-Turbo-Sleeper-(updated-11-14-11-)

Re: Turbos? [Re: GomangoCuda] #1569514
01/29/14 04:05 PM
01/29/14 04:05 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,953
Houston, Texas
TheOtherDodge Offline
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Houston, Texas
What should we be looking at for compression? Shoot for 9:1 anywhere +/- .3 will be fine.

What about converter? He currently has a 9 1/2" PTC. Too loose? Will it have a transbrake? A tight converter works best and with a transbrake, you can drive through to any RPM anyway.

When plumbing a single where do you run the crossover pipe? In front of the engine? Under the oilpan? I ran mine to the front of the motor.

Where do you run the huge single exhaust pipe? I only run a 3" downpipe between the frame and transmission. I could probably squeeze a 3.5" one if I wanted. You can neck down the size from the exh of the turbo to fit where you need.

Re: Turbos? [Re: dizuster] #1569515
01/29/14 04:54 PM
01/29/14 04:54 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,770
Moved to N.E. Tennessee
GomangoCuda Offline OP
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Quote:

Can't get to the link...



Link should work now. If it doesn't here is the URL http://www.ebay.com/itm/BRAND-NEW-GENUIN...b28&vxp=mtr
Several people selling them for around $850. Saw a rebuilt one for $600. Would prefer to stay with new.

here's more
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Brand-New-Borg-W...321305045622%26

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-BorgWarner-S...037&vxp=mtr

Last edited by GomangoCuda; 01/29/14 05:07 PM.
Re: Turbos? [Re: GomangoCuda] #1569516
01/30/14 12:36 AM
01/30/14 12:36 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,635
Oakland, MI
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dizuster Offline
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Yup that's the one.

Check these guys out... They have a pretty good reputation, and have them listed for $649
http://www.forcedinductions.com/productsborgwarner.htm

Re: Turbos? [Re: GomangoCuda] #1569517
01/30/14 03:34 AM
01/30/14 03:34 AM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 77
Mentor, OH
doggs330 Offline
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Mentor, OH
I've found Car Craft Magazine's cheap turbo build to have some helpful info when starting out. Car Craft Turbo







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