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Trans cooler in series? #1489813 08/24/13 06:58 AM 08/24/13 06:58 AM
Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 2,356 Kentucky D dfsmopars OP top fuel
dfsmopars OP top fuel D Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 2,356 Kentucky	I bought a 3/4" thick Permanent-cool trans cooler. The instructions say it must be installed in series with the radiator. They do not want the radiator by-passed. I bought a 15 x 7 cooler and planned on installing it between the A/C condensor and the radiator. I would think the size and location of the cooler would work better by-passing the radiator. So, why do they want the fluid running through the radiator and cooler? ‘72 Charger, 5.9 Magnum, Tremec 5 spd., Pro-Touring ‘14 Big Horn, Quad Cab, 4x4, 1500

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: dfsmopars] #1489814 08/24/13 08:04 AM 08/24/13 08:04 AM
Joined: Aug 2011 Posts: 1,083 SE PA Yellow Fever super stock
Yellow Fever super stock Joined: Aug 2011 Posts: 1,083 SE PA	The radiator will cool it down first then get it even cooler going through the external one. With a cooler that size it should work fine. Do you have a deep pan? Check with a trans temp gauge.

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: dfsmopars] #1489815 08/24/13 09:42 AM 08/24/13 09:42 AM
Joined: Nov 2003 Posts: 36,040 Lincoln Nebraska R RapidRobert Circle Track
RapidRobert Circle Track R Joined: Nov 2003 Posts: 36,040 Lincoln Nebraska	Quote: So, why do they want the fluid running through the radiator and cooler? either for more cooling or I've heard something about the rad coolant warming the initial cold trans fluid which I dont buy as I've never had a trans issue from cold fluid (converter drainback excepted) plus I've had some bottom rad coolers leak antifreeze into the trans lines. I keep em seperate & on a side note the hot line coming from the front of the trans I plumb that to the top of the cooler so the hot fluid is coming in at the top just like the rad. Not a dealbreaker but one of my anal idiosynchrosies. With that much area you'll have no problem. It would be interesting to call or email the company & ask them why they want it that way as they are the pro's regarding their product. live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: Yellow Fever] #1489816 08/24/13 09:42 AM 08/24/13 09:42 AM
Joined: Aug 2004 Posts: 8,087 Elk Grove, Calif. B bigblock340power master
bigblock340power master B Joined: Aug 2004 Posts: 8,087 Elk Grove, Calif.	It will do a better job running through the rad. and the cooler. My truck has two coolers and runs through the rad. too. I also have a deep trans. pan (also a good idea).

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: RapidRobert] #1489817 08/24/13 01:27 PM 08/24/13 01:27 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,791 Rio Linda, CA John_Kunkel Too Many Posts
John_Kunkel Too Many Posts Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,791 Rio Linda, CA	Quote: I've heard something about the rad coolant warming the initial cold trans fluid which I dont buy as I've never had a trans issue from cold fluid How would you know if you did? The INTERNET, the MISinformation superhighway

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: Yellow Fever] #1489818 08/24/13 07:56 PM 08/24/13 07:56 PM
Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 2,356 Kentucky D dfsmopars OP top fuel
dfsmopars OP top fuel D Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 2,356 Kentucky	Quote: The radiator will cool it down first then get it even cooler going through the external one. With a cooler that size it should work fine. Do you have a deep pan? Check with a trans temp gauge. The trans does have a deep pan. Where do I install a sensor for a gauge? This is an A500 in a third gen b body. Just asking- If an engine is runnIng 180* what is the temp of the fluid going through the bottom of the radiator? How much does it drop the temp of the trans fluid in a normal situation? The reason for the questions is because I am installing a small stall converter so I know it is going to generate a little more heat. ‘72 Charger, 5.9 Magnum, Tremec 5 spd., Pro-Touring ‘14 Big Horn, Quad Cab, 4x4, 1500

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: dfsmopars] #1489819 08/24/13 09:08 PM 08/24/13 09:08 PM
Joined: Feb 2009 Posts: 1,274 Ontario.Canada C can.al pro stock
can.al pro stock C Joined: Feb 2009 Posts: 1,274 Ontario.Canada	..isn't the trans cooler in the rad really a "heater"? passing trans fluid through a 180 degree rad will warm it for cool weather operation and the experts i have talked to want your trans operating 170 - 190 degrees. a big cooler not plumbed through the rad might keep the transmission t too cool? i have a dynamic 9 1/2 converter and a 5 x 11 trans cooler and have a hard time keeping the trans above 160. ...i should have run mine through the rad.

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: John_Kunkel] #1489820 08/25/13 09:33 AM 08/25/13 09:33 AM
Joined: Nov 2003 Posts: 36,040 Lincoln Nebraska R RapidRobert Circle Track
RapidRobert Circle Track R Joined: Nov 2003 Posts: 36,040 Lincoln Nebraska	Quote: Quote: I've heard something about the rad coolant warming the initial cold trans fluid which I dont buy as I've never had a trans issue from cold fluid How would you know if you did? If the trans was acting up when cold & straightened out when hot or if I became convinced that cold fluid was shortening its life over the long run but if using the rad cooler for the heat benefit is the way to go I will go with that as you are the man live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: RapidRobert] #1489821 08/25/13 10:08 AM 08/25/13 10:08 AM
Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 14,889 up yours Supercuda About to go away
Supercuda About to go away Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 14,889 up yours	Quote: If the trans was acting up when cold & straightened out when hot or if I became convinced that cold fluid was shortening its life over the long run but if using the rad cooler for the heat benefit is the way to go I will go with that as you are the man I cannot think of one OEM manufacturer that agrees with your theory. But you know best. You do not want a cold transmission, you want a transmission with a stable temperature of 175 to 200 degrees. Too cold or too hot are both bad. They say there are no such thing as a stupid question. They say there is always the exception that proves the rule. Don't be the exception.

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: Supercuda] #1489822 08/25/13 11:06 AM 08/25/13 11:06 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 28,067 Irving, TX feets Senior Management
feets Senior Management Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 28,067 Irving, TX	Quote: Quote: If the trans was acting up when cold & straightened out when hot or if I became convinced that cold fluid was shortening its life over the long run but if using the rad cooler for the heat benefit is the way to go I will go with that as you are the man I cannot think of one OEM manufacturer that agrees with your theory. But you know best. You do not want a cold transmission, you want a transmission with a stable temperature of 175 to 200 degrees. Too cold or too hot are both bad. The factory service manual for my 92 D250 says the overdrive will not engage until the transmission has reached a specified temperature. That tells me they don't want the transmission too cool. We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind. - Stu Harmon

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: feets] #1489823 08/25/13 11:37 AM 08/25/13 11:37 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 12,076 Benton, IL. D DaveRS23 Special needs idiot
DaveRS23 Special needs idiot D Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 12,076 Benton, IL.	Anytime I have ran a large tranny cooler, I have thought that the tranny took a long time to come up to temp and ran a little cool unless I was flogging it. I even picked up an engine oil thermostat to plumb in the lines, but the bypass was so large that the cooler got full flow all the time. So, I just run a smaller tranny cooler now. But it is slow to bring the temps down when I am beating on the car. Other than the tranny coolers with fans and temp switches to trigger the fan, is there any such thing as a thermostat for our tranny cooler lines? Seems that would make sense. Bring the temp down quick or not let it get too high to begin with, while not running the tranny too cool under light loads. Would bring it up to temp quicker, too. Obviously a street/strip application. Master, again and still

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: DaveRS23] #1489824 08/25/13 11:52 AM 08/25/13 11:52 AM
Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 14,889 up yours Supercuda About to go away
Supercuda About to go away Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 14,889 up yours	A temperature bypass http://www.amazon.com/dp/B008BTJFJ4/ref=...mp;linkCode=asn They say there are no such thing as a stupid question. They say there is always the exception that proves the rule. Don't be the exception.

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: Supercuda] #1489825 08/25/13 12:12 PM 08/25/13 12:12 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 12,076 Benton, IL. D DaveRS23 Special needs idiot
DaveRS23 Special needs idiot D Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 12,076 Benton, IL.	Exactly what I have been looking for. Thank you! Has anyone ran this? Worth the trouble? Master, again and still

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: DaveRS23] #1489826 08/25/13 03:15 PM 08/25/13 03:15 PM
Joined: Dec 2003 Posts: 22,696 Bitopia J jcc If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
jcc If you can't dazzle em with diamonds.. J Joined: Dec 2003 Posts: 22,696 Bitopia	The friction characteristics of trans oil are temp dependent, and I suspect there is an optimum preferred temp range, and by running thru the rad, the aftermarket cooler vendor also escapes some liability of over cooling the trans fluid. Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: dfsmopars] #1489827 08/25/13 03:52 PM 08/25/13 03:52 PM
Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 2,356 Kentucky D dfsmopars OP top fuel
dfsmopars OP top fuel D Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 2,356 Kentucky	OK, I think the first bit of business is to buy a B&M gauge kit from Summit and just see where the trans is right now, what happens when the converter is in and go from there. ‘72 Charger, 5.9 Magnum, Tremec 5 spd., Pro-Touring ‘14 Big Horn, Quad Cab, 4x4, 1500

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: RapidRobert] #1489828 08/25/13 04:40 PM 08/25/13 04:40 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,791 Rio Linda, CA John_Kunkel Too Many Posts
John_Kunkel Too Many Posts Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,791 Rio Linda, CA	Quote: If the trans was acting up when cold & straightened out when hot or if I became convinced that cold fluid was shortening its life over the long run but if using the rad cooler for the heat benefit is the way to go I will go with that as you are the man Ask any fluid supplier and they'll tell you that the ideal minimum fluid temperature is 160�F...there is zero benefit to running it any cooler. The INTERNET, the MISinformation superhighway

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: John_Kunkel] #1489829 08/25/13 04:56 PM 08/25/13 04:56 PM
Joined: Nov 2003 Posts: 36,040 Lincoln Nebraska R RapidRobert Circle Track
RapidRobert Circle Track R Joined: Nov 2003 Posts: 36,040 Lincoln Nebraska	Quote: Ask any fluid supplier and they'll tell you that the ideal minimum fluid temperature is 160�F...there is zero benefit to running it any cooler. JK Your sayso is good enough for me. Actually the only reason I dont run one is I had several of em (in a row) leak so I just started bypassing them & running a large external cooler & calling it good. Also I just figured that since I wouldn't be jumping on it till the eng was warmed up that the trans staying cold slightly longer without the OE cooler to warm it wouldn't be causing any damage to the trans live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: John_Kunkel] #1489830 08/25/13 06:44 PM 08/25/13 06:44 PM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,173 Bend,OR USA C Cab_Burge I Win
Cab_Burge I Win C Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,173 Bend,OR USA	Quote: Quote: If the trans was acting up when cold & straightened out when hot or if I became convinced that cold fluid was shortening its life over the long run but if using the rad cooler for the heat benefit is the way to go I will go with that as you are the man Ask any fluid supplier and they'll tell you that the ideal minimum fluid temperature is 160�F...there is zero benefit to running it any cooler. I had a Cyberdyne digital trans temperature guage on my 1998 CTD 2500 Ram with the towing package, the tranny temps. never exceeded 130 F, normally cooler than that , when not towing, summer or winter in the Mojave deserts It would get up to 220 F when towing up a long grade(18 mile long Baker grade going to Las Vegas) at 70 MPH with the enclosed car trailer loaded to 8200 Lbs with the race car in it, I would lock it out of overdrive at the bottom of the hill and unlocked once it went over the top of the grade The tranny temps would go back down to 160 F in around five miles of coasting down that hill or on the flats when towing in the summer heat, 117 F outside air temps at 3.00 PM in Baker,CA in July and August Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: Cab_Burge] #1489831 08/25/13 06:55 PM 08/25/13 06:55 PM
Joined: Dec 2003 Posts: 22,696 Bitopia J jcc If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
jcc If you can't dazzle em with diamonds.. J Joined: Dec 2003 Posts: 22,696 Bitopia	Quote: I had a Cyberdyne digital trans temperature guage on my 1998 CTD 2500 Ram with the towing package, the tranny temps. never exceeded 130 F, normally cooler than that , when not towing, summer or winter in the Mojave deserts I assume the truck had only an air to air trans cooler? Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.

Re: Trans cooler in series? [Re: Cab_Burge] #1489832 08/25/13 07:12 PM 08/25/13 07:12 PM
Joined: Feb 2006 Posts: 2,262 Groveland, MA SteveS top fuel
SteveS top fuel Joined: Feb 2006 Posts: 2,262 Groveland, MA	When Ford started separating all of their transmission coolers, and making them completely independent of engine cooling, they added thermostatic bypasses to them. Depending on the platform, they can be within the cooler, inside the transmission, or in a block in between. As an example, ALL '98-up Panther platform cars (Crown Vic, Grand Marquis, Town Car) had a separate cooler with a 180�F thermostat and a bypass within the cooler. The same cooler assembly also housed the power steering cooling circuit. The went to the added expense of the thermostatic control both for cold weather drivability and for transmission longevity. At any rate, they are great coolers, and there are a gazillion of them in junkyards everywhere. Steve Someday I'll have another C-body.

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