Ign Timing weirdness - 318
#1463654
07/06/13 07:16 PM
07/06/13 07:16 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,798 Lyons, CO
MileHighDart
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So I havent driven the dart much in the last couple years, been doing bodywork, paint, and re-assembly.
Anyway, its all back together and i've been driving it a bit, and it just seems gutless, no power. So I went to check the timing just for the heck of it. Did it like the book said, pull the vacuum line and plug it then check timing. Hooked up the timing light and the marks were showing about 10 degrees after tdc. Also weird, the book says when you pull the vacume line and plug it, there shoudn't be any change in idle speed. When I pull mine and plug it, the idle drops significantly and it runs a little rough. Anyway, I set the marks to about 2 degrees before tdc. Book says 0, but at 5000 ft altitude we always go a couple degrees advanced. So shut it off tighten everything down hook the vacume line back up, Start it up and it runs like crap, very rough idle, like of like it had a big cam or something, and it does not. So I move the dist back to were it was before I started (approx.) and take it for a drive, was pinging slightly under a load, so adjusted just till pinging wasn't present under load. Runs pretty good, Idles well, car just still feels very sluggish. So get back home put the light back on to see what it reads with the dist in this "road tested" setting. With the vacume hooked up, it reads about 5 degrees after. With the vacume disconnected and plugged it reads about 20 degrees after ? WTH? Am I doing something wrong? Or is it possible that the outer ring of my vibration damper has spun and the mark is no longer were it should be?
Heres my setup 68 dart 2-door 71 318, bored 30 over, 9:1 compression pistons, Edelbrock performer manifold Edelbrock 600cfm carb 340 auto camshaft early 340 exhaust manifolds dual 2.25" exhaust all the way with walker quietflow muffs mopar perf electronic ign 904 automatic 3:23 Gears. Car just feels like a slug, especially off the line.
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Re: Ign Timing weirdness - 318
[Re: MileHighDart]
#1463655
07/06/13 09:03 PM
07/06/13 09:03 PM
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 5,746 Ontario, Canada
Dodgem
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Vacuum advance sounds like you have it plugged into manifold vacuum and not the timed ported where it should be?
Last edited by Dodgem; 07/06/13 09:08 PM.
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Re: Ign Timing weirdness - 318
[Re: MileHighDart]
#1463657
07/06/13 09:21 PM
07/06/13 09:21 PM
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 5,746 Ontario, Canada
Dodgem
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I assume you don't have a dial back timing light or marks on the harmonic. Unhook and plug vacuum advance again. Set it to about 5 before TDC and go for a drive forget the vacuum advance for now if it pings back it off till it stops if it don't maybe try 2 more degrees. if it's still fine go home set the in gear idle the way you want it helper in the car is a must. "Now" plug the vacuum advance into the timed port (the one to the left) should make no change in idle drive around and see if it pings at cruise under light acceleration. If it does tune vacuum advance back with 3/32 allen key in through the port on the vacuum canaster on the dizzy turning counter clockwise a turn or two at a time till any ping under light cruise load is gone and you should be good to go.
Last edited by Dodgem; 07/06/13 09:22 PM.
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Re: Ign Timing weirdness - 318
[Re: MileHighDart]
#1463660
07/07/13 03:09 AM
07/07/13 03:09 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,798 Lyons, CO
MileHighDart
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Dodgem,,, your totally right about my vac advance hose. I've got it connected to the manifold vacume port on the carb and not the timed port. Cant wait to try your other suggestions and see if I can get this thing running better. Thanks
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Re: Ign Timing weirdness - 318
[Re: MileHighDart]
#1463661
07/07/13 04:17 AM
07/07/13 04:17 AM
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,161 CT
GTX MATT
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The car should still run fine with it hooked to manifold vacuum unless its way overadvanced. That aside it will run identical once on the road because the ported vacuum comes into play once the throttle blades are open enough to expose the ported vacuum slot, I.e once it's off the idle circuit. I'd suspect that your damner has slipped or is in accurately marked, or maybe the light is faulty.
For what it's worth my old 273 with a 340 cam liked 15 initial, and about 35 total.
Not to be a wise guy but you're sure you're reading before and after tdc correctly, right? Before tdc is further counter clockwise from 0.
Last edited by GTX MATT; 07/07/13 04:21 AM.
Now I need to pin those needles, got to feel that heat Hear my motor screamin while I'm tearin up the street
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Re: Ign Timing weirdness - 318
[Re: MileHighDart]
#1463663
07/07/13 01:24 PM
07/07/13 01:24 PM
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Anonymous
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Anonymous
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Are you just used to driving the daily mustang?
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Re: Ign Timing weirdness - 318
[Re: ]
#1463664
07/07/13 05:28 PM
07/07/13 05:28 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,798 Lyons, CO
MileHighDart
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Quote:
Are you just used to driving the daily mustang?
Well thats part of the problem i'm sure. Dart hasn't been driven much the last 2-3 years. I drive my foxbody mustang every day. With its 5.0 and 5-speed its a blast to drive, and now the dart just seems slow and boring by comparison. Dang mustang Now I'm gonna have to get a bigger engine for the Dart
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Re: Ign Timing weirdness - 318
[Re: Dodgem]
#1463666
07/07/13 08:48 PM
07/07/13 08:48 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,798 Lyons, CO
MileHighDart
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Quote:
I assume you don't have a dial back timing light or marks on the harmonic. Unhook and plug vacuum advance again. Set it to about 5 before TDC and go for a drive forget the vacuum advance for now if it pings back it off till it stops if it don't maybe try 2 more degrees. if it's still fine go home set the in gear idle the way you want it helper in the car is a must.
"Now" plug the vacuum advance into the timed port (the one to the left) should make no change in idle drive around and see if it pings at cruise under light acceleration. If it does tune vacuum advance back with 3/32 allen key in through the port on the vacuum canaster on the dizzy turning counter clockwise a turn or two at a time till any ping under light cruise load is gone and you should be good to go.
Well I had some time this afternoon, so I followed these instructions carefully all the way through. Was kinda surprised when I started adjusting the allen head screw in the dizzy, it was screwed all the way in clockwise so backing it out was the only way to go (which is what you suggested anyway). Got it adjust out probably a few complete turns before the ping was totally gone. But anyway, the car seems to be running good and no ping so i'm happy. Only weird thing is, after adjusting with the vac line disconnected and plugged, when I finally got the dist adjusted to where I had no ping, I stuck the timing light back on it cause I wanted to see what it showed. It was reading about 15 degrees after. I guessing that the outer ring of my damper has slipped, cause theres no way that that reading could be correct, and it's running good like it is. Anyway, good to have it adjusted, and have the vac advance adjusted too. Never knew about that adjustment before. Thanks
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Re: Ign Timing weirdness - 318
[Re: MileHighDart]
#1463667
07/07/13 09:01 PM
07/07/13 09:01 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 829 Orland Park, IL
kdcarman
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super stock
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Orland Park, IL
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I just got my 340 six pack running ok - the timing mark is way off - so I assume the balancer has spun. I just sent a 340 balancer in to the damper doctor to rebuild, which I will install when i get it back. I am thinking if the balancer has spun - it is not good thing to keep it running in the car.
KD
1970 Cuda 4406
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Re: Ign Timing weirdness - 318
[Re: MileHighDart]
#1463671
07/07/13 09:48 PM
07/07/13 09:48 PM
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 5,746 Ontario, Canada
Dodgem
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15 degrees clockwise (to the left) from the 0 mark would make sense 15 Counter clockwise (to the right) does not but could be the ring or timing cover. will it pull the wheels now???
Last edited by Dodgem; 07/07/13 09:49 PM.
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