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Actually did you ever read what Petty said after he drove the 426 Hemi for the first time in 63 or early 64? It was so much stronger than the wedges (like 10 or 15 MPH faster) he figured it had to be illegal.

Sheldon

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I'm quite sure that "The King" , knew he was headed to major success, after running that first
race HEMI in NASCAR. But.. the wedges did "pave" the way for the HEMI.

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From I understand when the 426 Hemi first came out in 64 it did dominate NASCAR but in drag racing it was no faster then the wedge cars at first. So they did not drag race it right away as the Ramchargers worked with the Hemi and changed cams I believe to really wake it up for drag racing. The wedge really did not do to bad in NASCAR as I think Petty finished 3rd in points in 63 running the wedge. But the higher up wanted a guarantee to win Daytona in 64 and they did not feel the wedge could guarantee a win. So of course they adapted the Hemi heads to the reworked wedge block and did guarantee a win. It would have been cool if they had kept the Max Wedge in production also and update it over the years. I could see it now that along with the 383 , 440-6pk and Hemi you can also get a Max Wedge in the Roadrunner. Ron

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The first HEMIS in 64' did have tuning problems, not so much as the components they had, but getting them to work right. To tune a 426 Hemi like the 426
Max-Wedge would NOT work, simply because of each engines different "breathing" characteristics. It
took the talented hands and minds of Tom Hoover and other Ramcharger members and notable racers to bring the HEMI to a "user-friendly" status. AS they have done with the Max-Wedge engines. Yes Ron, it DEFINITELY would have been a very good option in the later years, if time and money allowed!!

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Mr. Petty went to the General because of the beginning of the 'Chrysler doldrums'...

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That could be putting things mildly, as Chryslers' rear-wheel drive cars were phased out by approx. 82', and the front-wheelers were coming by the truckload!

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A wedge will work but a hemi is prettier. Hemi's used to be expensive so I understand why people drove wedges but today if you are building from new parts the cost is the same nearly to the penny. (If you want to go thru the price list item by item we will.) I will never figure out why someone would drive a wedge.

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really? crank, rods, pistons, cam maybe but blocks, heads and valve train? no way. Hemi headers and intake are also more expensive. You'll spend 2x as much (maybe more) building a 600hp hemi vs wedge.

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I have built both the 542ci 440-1/indy 542ci hemi/indy head. every part on both motors new. everything. And neither are 600hp closer to 900hp. the Hemi maby $1600. more. the wedge is a great way to go. but for me that little extra $1600, its HEMI all the way. I actually paid more for a set of headman hustlers for the 440-1' that I did for a set of tti' for the hemi.

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The initial problem in 64 was carburetion on the cross ram. The initial runs were with the same AFB's the wedge cars ran, and for some reason the AFB's did not work well on the Hemi. The mid 64 switch to the Holleys is what woke them up.

We've tried for years to make AFB's work on a Hemi crossram, and we never could. I don't know if it's the extremely big plenum or what it is, but we found the same thing. When Gary Conditt of the Ramchargers told me they never could, either, and that is why the mid year switch to Holleys, I didn't feel quite so stupid.

We run both Indy headed wedges, and a couple of Hemi cars. There ain't nothin' like a Hemi.

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A wedge will work but a hemi is prettier. Hemi's used to be expensive so I understand why people drove wedges but today if you are building from new parts the cost is the same nearly to the penny. (If you want to go thru the price list item by item we will.) I will never figure out why someone would drive a wedge.

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really? crank, rods, pistons, cam maybe but blocks, heads and valve train? no way. Hemi headers and intake are also more expensive. You'll spend 2x as much (maybe more) building a 600hp hemi vs wedge.

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I have built both the 542ci 440-1/indy 542ci hemi/indy head. every part on both motors new. everything. And neither are 600hp closer to 900hp. the Hemi maby $1600. more. the wedge is a great way to go. but for me that little extra $1600, its HEMI all the way. I actually paid more for a set of headman hustlers for the 440-1' that I did for a set of tti' for the hemi.

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If the Hemi had been produced with 440 inches under it then no one would have ever accused it of haveing less TQ than the 440 wedge. Just like how the 426 wedge or max wedge is no comparison for the 426 hemi.

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That may be a VERY GOOD observation, Dave! But, history does serve well, since Michigan bred "street racer/class racer" Jimmy Addison has proven that
theory with the famed "Silver Bullet" (67' 480+ cube HEMI powered GTX). And as for a comparision between the two types of 426 cube motors, again it depends on how quick you want to run. On the street, wedge motors are cheap to build and they do RUN HARD. But for the "upper" brackets and
class racing ("for the money"), the HEMI will get you the green and the respect ...all for a small
investment though. IMO, a BIG CUBE Maxie Wedge would be far MORE FUN to drive on the street and race at the track. Best of both worlds, and can do it on "pump gas"!! That is my

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A wedge will work but a hemi is prettier. Hemi's used to be expensive so I understand why people drove wedges but today if you are building from new parts the cost is the same nearly to the penny. (If you want to go thru the price list item by item we will.) I will never figure out why someone would drive a wedge.

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really? crank, rods, pistons, cam maybe but blocks, heads and valve train? no way. Hemi headers and intake are also more expensive. You'll spend 2x as much (maybe more) building a 600hp hemi vs wedge.

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I have built both the 542ci 440-1/indy 542ci hemi/indy head. every part on both motors new. everything. And neither are 600hp closer to 900hp. the Hemi maby $1600. more. the wedge is a great way to go. but for me that little extra $1600, its HEMI all the way. I actually paid more for a set of headman hustlers for the 440-1' that I did for a set of tti' for the hemi.

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I'm not talking about a 900hp motor. I'm talking 6-700 local track bracket motor. Of course when you get up there w/ the wedge (or any motor) the cost jumps a ton.

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From approx. 650-700 hp (RB motor) and up the induction/heads are good part of your money spent. Stronger bottom end components and race balanced rotating assembilies, drive up the cost, adding to the above, with a stock 440 block. For the ultimate strength and longevity, a aftermarket block is the way to go, maybe a little cheaper. Gets pretty pricey as you "dial in more "HP". But still cheaper than a HEMI, in the long run.

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From my understanding, computer designed modifications, completed on a state of the art CNC head porting machine, are able to port a 906 cast iron head to flow similar to a stock 2780559/2468016 cast iron hemi head. 49 years ago, Chrysler achieved what is now achieveable with computers on a 906 head by adopting the Hemi head. No wonder they went the Hemi route.....

Sure, you can put free flowing aluminum heads on that wedge, but again, you can't compare aluminum heads on a wedge to aluminum heads on a Gen II Hemi.

The wedge is a great motor, but it's no Hemi. We may as well be debating a 383 Magnum vs. a 440 Magnum.....

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You're right about the differences - "Wedge a great motor, but it's no HEMI". A Wedge is a wedge-headed motor and a HEMI is a Hemispherical-headed (meaning half-ball, or half-moon shaped chambers) motor. Nothing special between the two except the "top-end" pieces (carbs, heads valvetrain and camshaft). The blocks are different because of the HEMIS' hi-rpm, high torque output range, versus the WEDGES low to mid rpm, high torque output range. Just pick what range you want to run in - a HIGH-RPM screamer, or
a low-end "stump-pulling" super torque monster. Both EQUALLY run hard in their effective "ranges".

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From my understanding, computer designed modifications, completed on a state of the art CNC head porting machine, are able to port a 906 cast iron head to flow similar to a stock 2780559/2468016 cast iron hemi head. 49 years ago, Chrysler achieved what is now achieveable with computers on a 906 head by adopting the Hemi head. No wonder they went the Hemi route.....

Sure, you can put free flowing aluminum heads on that wedge, but again, you can't compare aluminum heads on a wedge to aluminum heads on a Gen II Hemi.

The wedge is a great motor, but it's no Hemi. We may as well be debating a 383 Magnum vs. a 440 Magnum.....

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You're right about the differences - "Wedge a great motor, but it's no HEMI". A Wedge is a wedge-headed motor and a HEMI is a Hemispherical-headed (meaning half-ball, or half-moon shaped chambers) motor. Nothing special between the two except the "top-end" pieces (carbs, heads valvetrain and camshaft). The blocks are different because of the HEMIS' hi-rpm, high torque output range, versus the WEDGES low to mid rpm, high torque output range. Just pick what range you want to run in - a HIGH-RPM screamer, or
a low-end "stump-pulling" super torque monster. Both EQUALLY run hard in their effective "ranges".

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Go back a few pages and read my dyno figures on my 89.5 octane pumpgas Hemi. 818ftlbs.@4800. 852hp@ under 5900rpm. You can have your cake and eat it too.Dave

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Can't believe people are still "debating" this topic. The Hemi is better...Period...And its not even close..

MB

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This debate may indeed go on forever,
Mike!! The HEMI may be the better engine in YOUR eyesight, BUT there are a LOT of WEDGE motor racers who say different. And they aren't backing off!! In fact, this thead may "eclipse" the ol' "413 vs. 440" thread.