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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: Al_Alguire]
#1230326
05/14/12 05:32 PM
05/14/12 05:32 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 11,725
Portage,michigan
B3422W5
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 11,725
Portage,michigan
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Never having had the reputation as the bashfull sort, and actually kind of proud of myself for calling a spade a spade, i will quickly relate an issue i had with SDSS.
Few years back i had a set of w5 heads ported by sdss.
I had them sent to Best Machine and a whole engine put together( which i might add i never had any issues with, beat on it for years, and the current owner after a Best freshen up/upgrade continues to do..to this day.
I got a call from Chuck at Best and drove down to Detroit to see for myself his concern with the heads. 3 or 4 of the spring pockets were so thin that Chuck easily took a pencil and pushed holes all the way through them....not good when planning to run a roller with some associated spring pressure.
Chuck repaired them, and thought we should pressure test them...they were sprinklers, again, were fixed and made to be usuable.
I was quite surprised they were sent out of SDSS in that way, had someone not looked them over good...well i shudder to think..
Just a couple of issues that come to mind from my own personal first hand experience.
To SdSS credit, that was i believe the first set the shop had done, but still sending that junk out was unpardonable.
Having had several excellent experiences with Best Machine, and earlier along, Hensley, i would have no problems recommending either shop, particularly Best Machine.
Owning a business myself, i am well used to never hearing when you we do things great( occasional pleasant surprise though), pretty much always hearing when you dont.
This above fact leads me to believe most here that think not airing expensive/costly screwup issues in public isnt right, probably dont have a business where the buck stops with them.
You choose to enter the shark tank, you can get bit, its just flat how things work.
69 Dart GTS A4 Silver All steel, flat factory hood, 3360race weight
418 BPE factory replacement headed stroker, 565 lift solid cam
Best so far, low 10.30’s 1/4
1.41 best 60 foot
6.56 at 104.17
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: dartman366]
#1230327
05/14/12 05:33 PM
05/14/12 05:33 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,396
Pa
Hot 340
master
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master
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,396
Pa
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Quote:
After 1 season and had to repair 4 guides in 1 head(cannot remember how many in the other) because they decided to slide towards the valve head because they were not machined correctly,,are you kidding me!,that was not a parts failure, that was in the machining, you do not want to know what my present machinist/builder had to say about that mess that he ended up fixing,, 
Are you sure that wasnt the fault of the low quality mopar performance head you used? They always seemed to have machining issues and bad metallugy from the get go..You dont need to remove valve guides to do most heads... unless you got them without guides in them.
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: B3422W5]
#1230328
05/14/12 05:59 PM
05/14/12 05:59 PM
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 252
St.Louis, Mo.
mokid
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 252
St.Louis, Mo.
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Quote:
Never having had the reputation as the bashfull sort, and actually kind of proud of myself for calling a spade a spade, i will quickly relate an issue i had with SDSS.
Few years back i had a set of w5 heads ported by sdss.
I had them sent to Best Machine and a whole engine put together( which i might add i never had any issues with, beat on it for years, and the current owner after a Best freshen up/upgrade continues to do..to this day.
I got a call from Chuck at Best and drove down to Detroit to see for myself his concern with the heads. 3 or 4 of the spring pockets were so thin that Chuck easily took a pencil and pushed holes all the way through them....not good when planning to run a roller with some associated spring pressure.
Chuck repaired them, and thought we should pressure test them...they were sprinklers, again, were fixed and made to be usuable.
I was quite surprised they were sent out of SDSS in that way, had someone not looked them over good...well i shudder to think..
Just a couple of issues that come to mind from my own personal first hand experience.
To SdSS credit, that was i believe the first set the shop had done, but still sending that junk out was unpardonable.
Having had several excellent experiences with Best Machine, and earlier along, Hensley, i would have no problems recommending either shop, particularly Best Machine.
Owning a business myself, i am well used to never hearing when you we do things great( occasional pleasant surprise though), pretty much always hearing when you dont.
This above fact leads me to believe most here that think not airing expensive/costly screwup issues in public isnt right, probably dont have a business where the buck stops with them.
You choose to enter the shark tank, you can get bit, its just flat how things work.
They almost got away with another F up its funny how supposed engine builder can get away with this crap, I also own a business and surley could not get away with it. I would be sued. I have voiced my opion many times on this shop.
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: mokid]
#1230329
05/14/12 09:14 PM
05/14/12 09:14 PM
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 419
NY
F1Scamp
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 419
NY
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I'll make my experience short and sweet... 402 stroker FAST motor. Sent to Ryan to have a freshen up and be switched to a 71 Duster configuration (Different intake, and exhaust manifold), Put the car together and it was a pig, Low 12's is all it would do. Talked to Ryan immediatly, he told me to change everything else. After changing everything under the sun (intakes, carbs, ignition systems, exhaust systems, etc.) and spending 6months and at least 15 track sessions, found he never degree'd the cam. He threw it in at 101.5 instead of 108.5. Said he must have bumped the tdc pointer. Offered a free dyno session. 
Work In Progress- 71' Duster F.A.S.T.- 10.36@130 Smallblock Record Holder.
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: F1Scamp]
#1230330
05/14/12 09:33 PM
05/14/12 09:33 PM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,978
Hilltown Pa
1967dartgt
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,978
Hilltown Pa
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Well I have had two shady dell motors, and have been nothing but happy with them. First was a 422 indy 360-1 motor that went 9.90s in my car and the current one that has been 9.55. Thats a 422 w-9 motor.
Brett Miller W9 cnc'd heads
STR Chassis fabraction
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: fishy340]
#1230333
05/15/12 12:30 AM
05/15/12 12:30 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,149
Melbourne , Australia
LA360
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,149
Melbourne , Australia
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2 issues you mention great shop is when issues arise,i'm pretty sure if this issue was done by phone or email rj probably would have made good,or said its not my fault,,we will never know,,,as far as to the issue of being close or far away,thats just bs Al...take a look in ryans shop for orders on things as far away as australia.im damn sure sure the effort for who ever you are is the same!
There are some unhappy customers down this way also, but quite frankly, I have seen alot of junk come out of the US.
I am of the opinion that if you are not 100% willing to stand by every part in an engine, new or s/h, then don't do the job, it's not worth the headache.
Alan Jones
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: rickraw]
#1230334
05/15/12 12:40 AM
05/15/12 12:40 AM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,456
Out West
408strokerdart
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,456
Out West
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Quote:
i have read all ur post. why was this RACE ENGINE just run in, instead of being dynoed? who's decision was that?? was $$$ a factor?? problem probably would have showed up on dyno. ryan did my heads on my sb, couldn't be happier. sucks u had problems.
Engine was running over my budget and time wasn't going to allow a dyno session as I drove from Texas to Pittsburgh Raceway Park to take delivery of it.
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: Hot 340]
#1230335
05/15/12 02:18 AM
05/15/12 02:18 AM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,247
Mt. Vernon, Ohio
dartman366
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,247
Mt. Vernon, Ohio
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Quote:
Quote:
After 1 season and had to repair 4 guides in 1 head(cannot remember how many in the other) because they decided to slide towards the valve head because they were not machined correctly,,are you kidding me!,that was not a parts failure, that was in the machining, you do not want to know what my present machinist/builder had to say about that mess that he ended up fixing,,
Are you sure that wasnt the fault of the low quality mopar performance head you used? They always seemed to have machining issues and bad metallugy from the get go..You dont need to remove valve guides to do most heads... unless you got them without guides in them.
No it wasn't the low quality Mopar Performance head's that I used, they came with 3/8" stem size guides and he replaced them with 11/32" guides,so Mopar had nothing to do with it,,,and the rest is history.
Light travels faster than the speed of sound,,,this is why some people seem bright untill you hear them speak.
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: racer_amx]
#1230337
05/15/12 03:48 AM
05/15/12 03:48 AM
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,019
Finland
mafo
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,019
Finland
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I assemble my own engines, so I have to trust myself but I often check and double check my own work  
-65 Valiant,420", all motor,2700#, dot tires, 8,42 @ 160,2
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: vc360]
#1230340
05/15/12 07:22 AM
05/15/12 07:22 AM
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 339
western PA
stevet340
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 339
western PA
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Quote:
Most of the small block guys on here are the ones who made him out to be the "small block guru" but he was learning as he went with all your stuff. Pays to do your research.
Is he trade qualified or just picked it up?
X2! Nothing compares to a trained, skilled tradesman who has went to school to learn and worked years at his craft! Just because someone can memorize/spout off part numbers for mopar performance parts does not make them qualified to machine/assemble engines. I personally have even less faith in the "gurus" who write books. While they are entertaining and sometimes informative/helpful reading, it has been my experience that the real engine builders who know how to make HP don't/won't tell you anything as they have spent years/decades learning what works and what doesn't. With the advancement of technology I also don't see how anyone could/would be happy with a 400 plus cubic inch W-9 headed "Race motor" that only runs mid to high 9's, maybe high 8's on spray, W-5 headed motors were doing that 15+ years ago... 
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: stevet340]
#1230341
05/15/12 08:55 AM
05/15/12 08:55 AM
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,978
Hilltown Pa
1967dartgt
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,978
Hilltown Pa
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Last edited by 1967DartGT; 05/15/12 09:25 AM.
Brett Miller W9 cnc'd heads
STR Chassis fabraction
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Re: Should you be able to trust your engine builder?
[Re: emarine01]
#1230343
05/15/12 09:58 AM
05/15/12 09:58 AM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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I had a engine blow up in its first 1/8 mile pass... that wasnt the builders fault ... that one had a lifter tie bar fail and cost me $3500 to fix... I also had a pro builder build my very first race engine and it never made it down the track... that one was the builders fault... a rod nut was laying in the pan... since that time I build my own junk 
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