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Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!?????
[Re: mloboda]
#1223843
04/28/12 11:30 PM
04/28/12 11:30 PM
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 726
ohio
mike67net
mopar addict
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mopar addict
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 726
ohio
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Quote:
Clutch-assisted Jerico 4 speed
I second that Jerico (cept I don't have a picture) 
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Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!?????
[Re: RAY1969CARS]
#1223847
04/29/12 06:53 AM
04/29/12 06:53 AM
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 3,210
robin hood country
deaks
master
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master
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 3,210
robin hood country
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I run a low 10 sec auto now but originally raced the car with the factory 340 with 4 spd running 12's and i've got to admit, it was a lot of fun and i would like to go back to it one day.
From what i've observed, most of the man trans cars over here in England, are reasonably good speed wise but slow on et and i personally wouldn't want to go backwards. Judging by some of the man cars on here, the right combination is as quick as an auto. So i would do my research and buy the best set up i could possibly afford.
Mick
69 Dart GTS 440 mopar .590 cam, Edelbrock heads, 3200#
best et 6.45, 106.78, 10.14, 132.88 mph, 1.47 60ft
best 60ft 1.36
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Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!?????
[Re: RAY1969CARS]
#1223849
04/29/12 11:02 AM
04/29/12 11:02 AM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 472
Downey, IA
Gt383
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 472
Downey, IA
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I'm gonna try a Abody 3spd behind my 383 duster. I have no less than 3 of them to greneade lol. I'm thinking the wide ratio will work well.
If I hafta come in and getchya.......I'm gonna getchya!
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Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!?????
[Re: mafo]
#1223850
04/29/12 12:36 PM
04/29/12 12:36 PM
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 151
ohio
Rich970
member
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member
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 151
ohio
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Quote:
can i ask what is that set up ?
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Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!?????
[Re: Rich970]
#1223852
04/29/12 12:50 PM
04/29/12 12:50 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421
Balt. Md
383man
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421
Balt. Md
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I bracket raced a 340 Dart 4-speed back in the late 70's and early 80's. I loved racing that stick car as it ran a best of 11.90's but I found out 2 things. One is the stick breaks alot more parts then an auto car and two is there really is not many good stick drivers out there. Yea they all think they are Ronnie Sox but I see many cars going faster when they put an auto in it. The stick cars can be very fast but you need to be a good driver to make it fast. I see many stick cars with the speed to go alot faster then they are. There are some really good stick drivers out there but many think they are better then they really are. When I built my street/strip car back in the mid 90's I went auto as I knew I could not afford to break parts and still be able to keep racing. And I found out that the auto's are usually faster then the stick cars unless the stick car has a good stick driver. Its amazing how modern technology has made the torque converter work so good and launch auto cars as hard as stick cars. Its a tuff call since the auto trans work so well now a days in shifting and launching. Ron
Last edited by 383man; 04/29/12 12:56 PM.
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Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!?????
[Re: Rich970]
#1223853
04/29/12 12:52 PM
04/29/12 12:52 PM
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,019
Finland
mafo
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,019
Finland
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Quote:
Quote:
can i ask what is that set up ?
4 speed liberty with my own converter drive, similar to a bruno , there was a few other manufacturers as well
this one is based around a powerslide oil pump and co2 operated transbrake, pretty simple really and works well, only problems we have had is oil temp, a bigger oil pan may help or maybe a cooler with a fan 
-65 Valiant,420", all motor,2700#, dot tires, 8,42 @ 160,2
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Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!?????
[Re: mafo]
#1223854
04/29/12 01:08 PM
04/29/12 01:08 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 5,160
Texas
dannysbee
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 5,160
Texas
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If your car is mainly a test and tune toy the fun factor with a stick rules.
Getting old just means you were smarter than some and luckier than others.
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Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!?????
[Re: RAY1969CARS]
#1223855
04/29/12 02:10 PM
04/29/12 02:10 PM
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 151
ohio
Rich970
member
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member
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 151
ohio
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Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!?????
[Re: mike67net]
#1223861
04/30/12 12:51 PM
04/30/12 12:51 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,573
...gently down the stream
LAR_414
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,573
...gently down the stream
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Crazy, this thread is all stick people!
I agree that playing with a stick car is WAY more fun. I also agree that if you want to have FUN DRIVING a car at the track, then a stick is it!.
My dart was always fun at the track when it was an auto, but got a heck of a lot more fun when I converted it to a stick.
As for consistency, I agree, it depends on the driver, but in my case, not much changed. I have been pretty close to the consistency of my automatic setup, with this stick.
And my stick setup relies on tire spin to keep from bogging. So track prep goes a long way to consistency in my particular setup. If you have a dead hook stick car with a slipper clutch and a crash box, I'm sure you can really dial it in tight for bracket racing.
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Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!?????
[Re: 572_HEMI_Cuda]
#1223868
05/02/12 11:44 AM
05/02/12 11:44 AM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,062
Western New York
sixpackbee
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,062
Western New York
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I race one of each in Stock Eliminator and I can tell you that all things being equal a stick will out run an automatic. They are both equally consistant too. The big difference with the 4 speed is I am diddling with the clutch at almost every race were the automatic is just get in and drive. The stick also has a slightly higher buy in price. Maintainance is quite a bit higher in the stick. A $900. clutch freshen only lasts 80-100 runs. The 4 speed is much more enjoyable to drive.
1959 Bugeye Sprite
1967 Charger Black L code
1967 Coronet R/T Convert Green 440 auto bought from original owner
1968 Charger R/T Bronze 440 4 spd console AM/FM
1969 Super Bee WM21H B5 A40 D21 N96
1969 Barracuda Formula S 340 Convert pilot car
1969 Hemi Road Runner RM23J D32 Omaha orange 4.10 Dana N96 N85
1970 Super Bee WM23N FE5 V1X 3.91 axle package, N96
1970 Road Runner RM21N B3 V1X D13
1971 MG Midget
1971 Road Runner RM23H GW3, A57
1972 Road Runner RM23P FY1, D21
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Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!?????
[Re: fourgearsavoy]
#1223872
05/03/12 11:33 PM
05/03/12 11:33 PM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,699
Newport, Mi
Evil Spirit
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,699
Newport, Mi
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
The other myth is that stick shifted cars are slower. Is that why pro stock uses them, to be inconsistant and slower? 
Could it be their narrow powerbands would not be able to recover fast enough - spending too much time out of their powerband - with only 3 speeds?
It's also hard to put the 40 year old technology of even a modified 833 into a direct comparison to the seamless power application of a planetary shifted modern 5 speed. Apples to oranges. 
I think you may be wrong about a "planetary shifted" modern 5-speed...
Huh did you get something twisted in the translation.If you mean "planetary transmission" like a Lenco they haven't used one of those for over ten years in Pro-Stock. They use a liberty 5-speed which is "non-planetary" with an inline shifter that could be described as an inline gate shifter that almost works like a ratchet shifter It is a fairly primitive design but it works better than anything else they have available to them at this time.
You also don't need to have a Pro-Stock type engine to keep it in the "happy range" My engine likes the gear spread in my 5-speed better than the ratios in an 833 
A stick car just lets you be an individual instead of just another one of the sheep following the heard with a glide or a 727 "bomb"
Gus 
I was just using "planetary shifted" as an example of old school - newer school - there are also roller clutch setups or sequential style boxes that again offer seamless power application impossible with an 833. I say 833 as an "old school" example - pretty much covers T-10s, M21s, M22s, etc.
Dollar for dollar - I'll stick with my lowly low gearset 904 and a decent converter - dead reliable, streetable and totally consistant for the 500HP I put through it. To go any faster with a manual trans would be several times the cost with more upkeep. Try to drive a plate shifted TKO on the street - not my idea of fun. And yes, I've used enough different styles of dog rings, plate shifted, modified syncros, ect. to be familiar with "conventional" boxes and their pro and cons, and just haven't seen the need or the pot of gold to step up to the new Liberty "Pro Stock" twin countershaft or other peoples bulletproof stuff. I have Paul at Liberty on my speed dial and send any work his way I can.
I don't deny the shock and awe factor of the Liberty, Jerico, Lenco, etc. stuff - I wish my health would allow me to play more with the 3 pedal cars - it just isn't really a fair comparison to the old school stuff.
Free advice and worth every penny...
Factory trained Slinky rewinder.........
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