who rules 4speeds or automatic .....!!!!!?????

Posted By: RAY1969CARS

who rules 4speeds or automatic .....!!!!!????? - 04/29/12 02:36 AM

have at it boys !!!!! witch one will win ??? witch is the best kick ass trany ?? let the games begin get ready to rumble big blocks small block get in your corns! mopar or no car

which one rules

Posted By: fourgearsavoy

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/29/12 03:00 AM

I prefer a 5-speed

Gus

Posted By: mloboda

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/29/12 03:20 AM

Clutch-assisted Jerico 4 speed

Posted By: mike67net

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/29/12 03:30 AM

Quote:

Clutch-assisted Jerico 4 speed

I second that Jerico (cept I don't have a picture)

Posted By: cheapstreetdustr

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/29/12 03:43 AM

some day im gonna build a serious effort manual shifted race car..

Posted By: rowin4

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/29/12 04:44 AM

Who rules? are you asking manufacturer or driver? I would say I do on shifting , most people don't know at the track mine is a stick. Liberty pro shifted Doug Nash.

Posted By: RAY1969CARS

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/29/12 05:00 AM

Quote:

Who rules? are you asking manufacturer or driver? I would say I do on shifting , most people don't know at the track mine is a stick. Liberty pro shifted Doug Nash.

witch tranny kicks ass 4speeds or automatics witch one do real racer use ????!!!! lolololo

Posted By: deaks

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/29/12 10:53 AM

I run a low 10 sec auto now but originally raced the car with the factory 340 with 4 spd running 12's and i've got to admit, it was a lot of fun and i would like to go back to it one day.
From what i've observed, most of the man trans cars over here in England, are reasonably good speed wise but slow on et and i personally wouldn't want to go backwards. Judging by some of the man cars on here, the right combination is as quick as an auto. So i would do my research and buy the best set up i could possibly afford.
Mick

Posted By: mafo

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/29/12 12:32 PM

Posted By: Gt383

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/29/12 03:02 PM

I'm gonna try a Abody 3spd behind my 383 duster. I have no less than 3 of them to greneade lol. I'm thinking the wide ratio will work well.

Posted By: Rich970

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/29/12 04:36 PM

Quote:

can i ask what is that set up ?

Posted By: HPMike

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/29/12 04:40 PM

Gotta throw a plug in for Ed Cook's kid James...

-Full bodied A12 RR. approx 3800# w/driver.
-FAST Sixpack wedge.
-Stock exhaust manifolds and 2.5" full exhaust.
-All stock suspension
-CF dual friction clutch.
-833 hemi box with Liberty pro shift/face plate gears.
-Bias ply redline tires G60-15.

Currently the quickest/fastest 4 speed car to run in FAST competition.

Best 10.80@ 129MPH.

Consistent and reliable,too!

MB

Attached picture 7184371-jamesreda12(Medium).jpg

Attached picture 7184371-jamesreda12(Medium).jpg

Posted By: 383man

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/29/12 04:50 PM

I bracket raced a 340 Dart 4-speed back in the late 70's and early 80's. I loved racing that stick car as it ran a best of 11.90's but I found out 2 things. One is the stick breaks alot more parts then an auto car and two is there really is not many good stick drivers out there. Yea they all think they are Ronnie Sox but I see many cars going faster when they put an auto in it. The stick cars can be very fast but you need to be a good driver to make it fast. I see many stick cars with the speed to go alot faster then they are. There are some really good stick drivers out there but many think they are better then they really are. When I built my street/strip car back in the mid 90's I went auto as I knew I could not afford to break parts and still be able to keep racing. And I found out that the auto's are usually faster then the stick cars unless the stick car has a good stick driver. Its amazing how modern technology has made the torque converter work so good and launch auto cars as hard as stick cars. Its a tuff call since the auto trans work so well now a days in shifting and launching. Ron

Posted By: mafo

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/29/12 04:52 PM

Quote:

Quote:

can i ask what is that set up ?

4 speed liberty with my own converter drive, similar to a bruno , there was a few other manufacturers as well
this one is based around a powerslide oil pump and co2 operated transbrake, pretty simple really and works well, only problems we have had is oil temp, a bigger oil pan may help or maybe a cooler with a fan

Posted By: dannysbee

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/29/12 05:08 PM

If your car is mainly a test and tune toy the fun factor with a stick rules.

Posted By: Rich970

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/29/12 06:10 PM

G Force t101a

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Posted By: oldiron

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/29/12 06:24 PM

hard for me to say, I get taken out by both

Posted By: 68shifter

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/29/12 06:27 PM

Quote:

hard for me to say, I get taken out by both

Greg, you need to race me more often then.lol

Andre

Posted By: mshred

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/30/12 03:54 AM

Posted By: dustergirl340

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/30/12 03:21 PM

My 4-speed Dart is a hoot. It's slower than my Duster but more fun to drive.

Posted By: mike67net

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/30/12 04:05 PM

Manually shifted cars being inconsistant is a myth, perpetuated by those who don't know how to drive one.

The other myth is that stick shifted cars are slower. Is that why pro stock uses them, to be inconsistant and slower?

Posted By: LAR_414

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 04/30/12 04:51 PM

Crazy, this thread is all stick people!

I agree that playing with a stick car is WAY more fun. I also agree that if you want to have FUN DRIVING a car at the track, then a stick is it!.

My dart was always fun at the track when it was an auto, but got a heck of a lot more fun when I converted it to a stick.

As for consistency, I agree, it depends on the driver, but in my case, not much changed. I have been pretty close to the consistency of my automatic setup, with this stick.

And my stick setup relies on tire spin to keep from bogging. So track prep goes a long way to consistency in my particular setup. If you have a dead hook stick car with a slipper clutch and a crash box, I'm sure you can really dial it in tight for bracket racing.

Posted By: fourgearsavoy

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 05/02/12 01:49 AM

Quote:

Manually shifted cars being inconsistant is a myth, perpetuated by those who don't know how to drive one.

The other myth is that stick shifted cars are slower. Is that why pro stock uses them, to be inconsistant and slower?

When I first put my car together it was slower and easier to hook up I went 11 rounds to take the win in Pro years ago and went 11.54 slowest pass to 11.52 last pass of the day

I think that was fairly consistent for 11 rounds on a fall Ohio day

Gus

Posted By: Evil Spirit

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 05/02/12 03:00 AM

Quote:

The other myth is that stick shifted cars are slower. Is that why pro stock uses them, to be inconsistant and slower?

Could it be their narrow powerbands would not be able to recover fast enough - spending too much time out of their powerband - with only 3 speeds?

It's also hard to put the 40 year old technology of even a modified 833 into a direct comparison to the seamless power application of a planetary shifted modern 5 speed. Apples to oranges.

Posted By: jim sciortino

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 05/02/12 03:23 AM

Quote:

That's mighty nice.

Posted By: mafo

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 05/02/12 02:32 PM

Well, thank you, I like that smiley too...

Posted By: dustergirl340

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 05/02/12 02:48 PM

here come the egos! lol

Posted By: 572_HEMI_Cuda

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 05/02/12 03:30 PM

Mine could be either 3 or 4 speeds. Currently its a 3 speed with the front case empty.

Attached picture 7189083-hemi_cuda_107.jpg

Posted By: sixpackbee

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 05/02/12 03:44 PM

I race one of each in Stock Eliminator and I can tell you that all things being equal a stick will out run an automatic. They are both equally consistant too. The big difference with the 4 speed is I am diddling with the clutch at almost every race were the automatic is just get in and drive. The stick also has a slightly higher buy in price. Maintainance is quite a bit higher in the stick. A $900. clutch freshen only lasts 80-100 runs. The 4 speed is much more enjoyable to drive.

Posted By: joelson6

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 05/03/12 04:38 AM

i've really only raced a stick car. it's what i had when i started racing. i still do it for the fun factor. i'm not the greatest at racing a stick, i'll admit that. but when i get to the starting line, what happens, happens. i don't care, i just get to rip through the gears. i just don't do it enough to be consistent at it. i think i'd get bored racing an auto, at least in the bracket i can afford (11.0-11.5).

Posted By: Evil Spirit

Re: who rules 4speeds or automatic .....!!!!!????? - 05/03/12 04:53 AM

I'm kinda suprised no turbo guys have been in on this one to defend the automatics honor. It is really amusing turbo cars trying to build boost with a 3 pedal. Ya know how they have scented race fuel? - I think they need scented clutch discs for the turbo cars

Posted By: fourgearsavoy

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 05/04/12 02:35 AM

Quote:

Quote:

The other myth is that stick shifted cars are slower. Is that why pro stock uses them, to be inconsistant and slower?

Could it be their narrow powerbands would not be able to recover fast enough - spending too much time out of their powerband - with only 3 speeds?

It's also hard to put the 40 year old technology of even a modified 833 into a direct comparison to the seamless power application of a planetary shifted modern 5 speed. Apples to oranges.

I think you may be wrong about a "planetary shifted" modern 5-speed...
Huh

did you get something twisted in the translation.If you mean "planetary transmission" like a Lenco they haven't used one of those for over ten years in Pro-Stock. They use a liberty 5-speed which is "non-planetary" with an inline shifter that could be described as an inline gate shifter that almost works like a ratchet shifter

It is a fairly primitive design but it works better than anything else they have available to them at this time.
You also don't need to have a Pro-Stock type engine to keep it in the "happy range" My engine likes the gear spread in my 5-speed better than the ratios in an 833

A stick car just lets you be an individual instead of just another one of the sheep following the heard with a glide or a 727 "bomb"

Gus

Posted By: Evil Spirit

Re: who rules 4speeds or 3speeds.....!!!!!????? - 05/04/12 03:33 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

The other myth is that stick shifted cars are slower. Is that why pro stock uses them, to be inconsistant and slower?

Could it be their narrow powerbands would not be able to recover fast enough - spending too much time out of their powerband - with only 3 speeds?

It's also hard to put the 40 year old technology of even a modified 833 into a direct comparison to the seamless power application of a planetary shifted modern 5 speed. Apples to oranges.

I think you may be wrong about a "planetary shifted" modern 5-speed...
Huh did you get something twisted in the translation.If you mean "planetary transmission" like a Lenco they haven't used one of those for over ten years in Pro-Stock. They use a liberty 5-speed which is "non-planetary" with an inline shifter that could be described as an inline gate shifter that almost works like a ratchet shifter It is a fairly primitive design but it works better than anything else they have available to them at this time.
You also don't need to have a Pro-Stock type engine to keep it in the "happy range" My engine likes the gear spread in my 5-speed better than the ratios in an 833
A stick car just lets you be an individual instead of just another one of the sheep following the heard with a glide or a 727 "bomb"
Gus

I was just using "planetary shifted" as an example of old school - newer school - there are also roller clutch setups or sequential style boxes that again offer seamless power application impossible with an 833. I say 833 as an "old school" example - pretty much covers T-10s, M21s, M22s, etc.

Dollar for dollar - I'll stick with my lowly low gearset 904 and a decent converter - dead reliable, streetable and totally consistant for the 500HP I put through it. To go any faster with a manual trans would be several times the cost with more upkeep. Try to drive a plate shifted TKO on the street - not my idea of fun. And yes, I've used enough different styles of dog rings, plate shifted, modified syncros, ect. to be familiar with "conventional" boxes and their pro and cons, and just haven't seen the need or the pot of gold to step up to the new Liberty "Pro Stock" twin countershaft or other peoples bulletproof stuff. I have Paul at Liberty on my speed dial and send any work his way I can.

I don't deny the shock and awe factor of the Liberty, Jerico, Lenco, etc. stuff - I wish my health would allow me to play more with the 3 pedal cars - it just isn't really a fair comparison to the old school stuff.