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Re: R3 sonic results, need help [Re: Performance Only] #1130835
12/11/11 12:42 PM
12/11/11 12:42 PM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 128
Finland
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mopster Offline OP
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mopster  Offline OP
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Finland
Good info Performance Only. I did some measuring with a simple angle finder and every cylinder seem to be in 45 degree angle. I know itīs not accurate, but I measured many times and Iīm pretty sure I would have noticed if it had been out of spec more than half a degree. I also did try fitting old head gaskets, and the cylinders seem to be in right places in relation to bolt holes and dowel pin holes. Overall I donīt think the machining can be so much wrong that it would make a big difference in sonic numbers.

So there is not much that I can do except to keep the bore smaller than I planned, and maybe move cyl #1 maybe .020” or so. Iīm not going to put sleeves to a new block that I paid full price of. These blocks are supposed to go 4.22” bore and handle 750+ hp, and I donīt think this block is good for it. Although it will screw up my schedule, I think Iīm going to ask for another block. I just hope I donīt end up with another bad one like moparmacka.

Re: R3 sonic results, need help [Re: mopster] #1130836
12/11/11 01:08 PM
12/11/11 01:08 PM
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,019
Finland
mafo Offline
super stock
mafo  Offline
super stock

Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,019
Finland
I machined my block to 4.185, luckily I never sonic checked


-65 Valiant,420", all motor,2700#, dot tires, 8,42 @ 160,2
Re: R3 sonic results, need help [Re: mopster] #1130837
12/11/11 01:19 PM
12/11/11 01:19 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
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MR_P_BODY  Offline
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Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
As someone said... you might try going through a
engine builder over here to have him check it out
first before shipping it to you... just a idea

Re: R3 sonic results, need help [Re: mopster] #1130838
12/11/11 03:49 PM
12/11/11 03:49 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,784
PA
W5DART66 Offline
top fuel
W5DART66  Offline
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Posts: 1,784
PA
Quote:

I have a brand new siamese R3 48* tall deck that I just got back from sonic test, and Iīm not very pleased with the results. This is 3.99" bore as it comes, and it seems to have core shift to every possible directions leaving some areas a bit thin. Thinnest spot is in front of cyl 1. Outer walls are thinner than inner walls on both sides, worst spot on major thrust sides is in the bottom of cyl 4.



Are these typical results for R3 block or do I have a bad one? I hoped that I could build a 4.185" bore 700-800hp N/A engine at first, but leave room for another rebuild, and if I decide to, be able to go forced induction and about 1200-1400hp power level. Not going to happen with this block?

I could fix some of the core shift by moving the bores away from the thin sides. My machine shop guy told me he could move the bore centers individually up to .060" if my head gaskets and combustion chambers allow it. I donīt think the combustion chambers will be a problem since I have untouched W9 heads and I will do all the headwork myself and I can fit the chambers to the cylinders. The head gaskets may be a problem, and I probably should get them first and do some measuring. I think the left side bores should be moved some towards back, and both sides should be moved inwards. Could this be done and which head gaskets should I get?

I could also do a smaller bore like 4.165" for the first build if required. Also I could do a partial fill since the thinnest spots are all in the bottom of the bores.




Numbers don't look that bad to me I would run that block at 4.200 with out any worries about it.
Looks like you would be over .200" thick every place but a non-thrust on 2 cylinders. I was .135" at 4.180 on my engine masters 411CI W8 engine this year. I was at 800HP 80 pulls on dyno and 15passes in the car so far.
that engine was 14.1to1 and only a 255* at .050" intake lobe so it has lots of cylinder pressure.

Re: R3 sonic results, need help [Re: W5DART66] #1130839
12/11/11 05:05 PM
12/11/11 05:05 PM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 128
Finland
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mopster Offline OP
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mopster  Offline OP
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 128
Finland
This would be .122" at max bore, I donīt think thats acceptable since I bought it new at full price. Now if it would be a second hand block that I got for good price, that would be another thing.

Re: R3 sonic results, need help [Re: mopster] #1130840
12/11/11 06:21 PM
12/11/11 06:21 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 4,330
Lynchburg, VA
Leon441 Offline
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Leon441  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 4,330
Lynchburg, VA
I didn't think the numbers were that bad either. But, you pay for a block advertising bore capabilities of 4.220". OK what does Mopar say is a suitable wall thickness. If it meets their recommendations you have no gripe. If it does not I would jump up and down and scream until I got results.

Leon


Career best 8.02 @ 169 at 3050# and 10" tires small block power.
Re: R3 sonic results, need help [Re: mopster] #1130841
12/12/11 06:49 AM
12/12/11 06:49 AM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 370
Queensland Australia
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moparmacka Offline
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moparmacka  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2006
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Queensland Australia
Mopster,

I like the idea of maybe having a reliable builder/supplier like performance only check the block state side prior to shipping. Even that isn't a given I suppose after his post. If things don't work out with my 3rd block I will most likely be going that route.


Leon,
I had the Mopar supplier over here check with his contact at mopar to find out the minimum allowable thicknes and he said no less than 0.180" finished. Maybe some else can shed some light on mopar's tolerances for wall thickness.

Another point is that due to the sheer cost of these blocks (compared to other brands Dart, Ford etc) a lot of people don't want to max out the bore first up with noting left in the tank if you know what I mean.

Just my thoughts
Macka

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