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Re: Orig trim tag MIA. How to get the orig layout to redo.
[Re: lahatte]
#1118616
11/22/11 08:48 PM
11/22/11 08:48 PM
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Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 8,948
Harlan, Iowa
69CoronetRT
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 8,948
Harlan, Iowa
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Quote:
I'm curious, how would someone detect a fake tag? I know some people have painted their tags when the car is painted, so any original patina may be lost. So, if a tag looks nice, how would you know if it's original or reproduced?
There are several ways.
Each plant coded things differently. So what was coded, WHEN it was coded and maybe even WHERE it was coded changed during the production year. If you have looked at a large amount of tags from that year and plant, the differences pop right out.
How the plant physically handled the tag could be different leading to important omissions of certain details specific to certain plants that indicate fake tags.
Last edited by 69CoronetRT; 11/22/11 09:12 PM.
Seeking:
1969 St. Louis plant VINs, SPD, and VONs.
Over 2,000 thanks to you!
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Re: Orig trim tag MIA. How to get the orig layout to redo.
[Re: 69CoronetRT]
#1118620
11/22/11 10:44 PM
11/22/11 10:44 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 392
Mississippi
lahatte
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 392
Mississippi
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Quote:
There are several ways.
Each plant coded things differently. So what was coded, WHEN it was coded and maybe even WHERE it was coded changed during the production year. If you have looked at a large amount of tags from that year and plant, the differences pop right out.
How the plant physically handled the tag could be different leading to important omissions of certain details specific to certain plants that indicate fake tags.
Yes, but if the data is correct, there wouldn't be any way to tell, really.
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Re: Orig trim tag MIA. How to get the orig layout to redo.
[Re: Alaskan_TA]
#1118621
11/22/11 10:50 PM
11/22/11 10:50 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 29,654
Hamtramck, PA
Alaskan_TA
Fluffy Balladeer
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Fluffy Balladeer
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 29,654
Hamtramck, PA
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I have no problem with reproduction tags myself.
If someone has a rusty tag or other original data like a broadcast sheet, the data for most cars is available to have a correct reproduction made.
Custom tags also, no one really cares if it is obviously a custom tag.
But when folks do not have the original data to go on & make one up, it steps over a line. If someone guesses at a VON & I know it is in use on a legitimate tag, I'll call it a fake. Others will to.
Fake tags hurt the cars reputation as well as the seller's if the seller is the one that had it made. Sadly, there are places out there that will put anything on a fender tag that anyone wants - for a price.
Anything is available for money to buyers & sellers when niether one of them have scruples. Both are done to make money & done often.
If you are not sure what you are looking at PLEASE try to find someone the does BEFORE you buy a car. Some fakes are very famous, so Google the VIN also just in case.
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Re: Orig trim tag MIA. How to get the orig layout to redo.
[Re: ScottSmith_Harms]
#1118622
11/22/11 11:18 PM
11/22/11 11:18 PM
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,550
Sacramento CA
Morty426
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,550
Sacramento CA
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Quote:
Morty,
I'm not attempting to play judge and jury and I understand that your situation is a tough one (especially on the Hemi car!) but quite frankly I don't see an easy way rectify it other than digging up the original documentation. Imagine if you had it all made up and then the original stuff shows up on a different car? How would that play out?
Personally I don't see a problem with putting a replacement tag on a car as long as it's represented as such. However, having a reproduction tag would definately negatively affect my assesment of the cars value, and if I didn't know the cars owner or it's history (in detail), it would also raise curiousity about the authenticity of the rest of the car.
Regardless of how well meaning you or anothers efforts are, it's the owners down the road that can be either mislead or misrepresent a car with fake documentation. That can easily lead things down the darker pathways. We've all seen it so I'm sure you know what I mean.
Scott,
I do have my VIN tag so I hope no one is out there trying to build a car around my fender tag that may be out there. 
However I do know what you mean. My brother and I had a 1970 Charger R/T Hemi that we restored. The car was brown, column shift with stripe delete. It later found an owner that added a stripe and a Dana 60. It has been on eBay many times with claims about mileage and options that were not original to the car. I would contact the poster and they would change the add, but still.
Morty
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Re: Orig trim tag MIA. How to get the orig layout to redo.
[Re: THESHAKERPROJECT]
#1118623
11/23/11 01:06 AM
11/23/11 01:06 AM
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,550
Sacramento CA
Morty426
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,550
Sacramento CA
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Quote:
Ok ..From A to Y B41 B51 C16 D34 D53 E87 G11 J46 J81 N96 R33 R36 S77 VX1 V6X W23 Y14 T86 There are no A (group) codes. The sticker price for this 71 Challenger was $4752.05 Funny thing about this car is the OPEN 323 rear .It must have been a handful on a rainy day. 
If that's what GG gave you for codes you need to ask for your money back 
D34 would not be correct.
Also there are codes that would have to be there that you don't have listed. Are you holding out?
If you can email me a copy of your broadcast sheet I can probably help you.
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Re: Orig trim tag MIA. How to get the orig layout to redo.
[Re: Alaskan_TA]
#1118624
11/23/11 01:08 AM
11/23/11 01:08 AM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,163
NORTHERN VA
THESHAKERPROJECT
OP
super stock
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OP
super stock
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,163
NORTHERN VA
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Quote:
I have no problem with reproduction tags myself.
If someone has a rusty tag or other original data like a broadcast sheet, the data for most cars is available to have a correct reproduction made.
Thank you !!! I have the orig window sticker, broadcast sheet,vin tag and a whold folder of other info on the car from the 80s. I would use ALL the documentation avail to make an assement on a car, not JUST a trim tag. I have been offered stupid money for this car with the buyers knowing that the trim tag was MIA because I have so much other documentation for the car. 
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Re: Orig trim tag MIA. How to get the orig layout to redo.
[Re: Morty426]
#1118625
11/23/11 01:37 AM
11/23/11 01:37 AM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,163
NORTHERN VA
THESHAKERPROJECT
OP
super stock
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OP
super stock
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,163
NORTHERN VA
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Quote:
Quote:
Ok ..From A to Y B41 B51 C16 D34 D53 E87 G11 J46 J81 N96 R33 R36 S77 VX1 V6X W23 Y14 T86 There are no A (group) codes. The sticker price for this 71 Challenger was $4752.05 Funny thing about this car is the OPEN 323 rear .It must have been a handful on a rainy day.
If that's what GG gave you for codes you need to ask for your money back
D34 would not be correct. Yikes...my typin is no good actually the codes are B41 B51 C19 C55 C93 F25 F96 G11 G41 J11 J15 J21 J25 J31 J46 J81 L76 M21 M26 N41 N42 N85 N96 R36 R33S15 S25S77 S81 W23...
Also there are codes that would have to be there that you don't have listed. Are you holding out? I see on the left side of the printout E87 D32 D53 T86 V01 V1X GY3 V6X TX8 Those are all the 3 letter codes
If you can email me a copy of your broadcast sheet I can probably help you.
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Re: Orig trim tag MIA. How to get the orig layout to redo.
[Re: lahatte]
#1118626
11/23/11 04:02 AM
11/23/11 04:02 AM
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Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 8,948
Harlan, Iowa
69CoronetRT
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 8,948
Harlan, Iowa
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Quote:
Quote:
There are several ways.
Each plant coded things differently. So what was coded, WHEN it was coded and maybe even WHERE it was coded changed during the production year. If you have looked at a large amount of tags from that year and plant, the differences pop right out.
How the plant physically handled the tag could be different leading to important omissions of certain details specific to certain plants that indicate fake tags.
Yes, but if the data is correct, there wouldn't be any way to tell, really.
The we go to step two. There are other ways to tell fake tags that are not listed.
Seeking:
1969 St. Louis plant VINs, SPD, and VONs.
Over 2,000 thanks to you!
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Re: Orig trim tag MIA. How to get the orig layout to redo.
[Re: THESHAKERPROJECT]
#1118628
11/23/11 10:33 AM
11/23/11 10:33 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,636
Nashville, TN
MOPARMIKE69
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,636
Nashville, TN
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Quote:
Quote:
I have no problem with reproduction tags myself.
If someone has a rusty tag or other original data like a broadcast sheet, the data for most cars is available to have a correct reproduction made.
Thank you !!! I have the orig window sticker, broadcast sheet,vin tag and a whold folder of other info on the car from the 80s. I would use ALL the documentation avail to make an assement on a car, not JUST a trim tag. I have been offered stupid money for this car with the buyers knowing that the trim tag was MIA because I have so much other documentation for the car.
Here we go.... wait for it.... So WHY make a fake tag for it??????????
It is missing. I would much rather have an honest guy just say. Here is what I have on the car, the tag is missing. SO WHAT! you have the build sheet, NOTHING else matters. Except when I step up and look at your car, and I can tell a repop tag easily, I walk away thinking you faked it and then everything about the car is tainted. As you said the value isn't hurt by not having one so again...... why fake one??? 
69 Road Runner vert
69 GTX hard top
70 Road Runner 4 speed
70 Hemi Cuda vert
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Re: Orig trim tag MIA. How to get the orig layout to redo.
[Re: lahatte]
#1118629
11/23/11 11:31 AM
11/23/11 11:31 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,070
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,070
U.S.S.A.
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Quote:
Quote:
There are several ways.
Each plant coded things differently. So what was coded, WHEN it was coded and maybe even WHERE it was coded changed during the production year. If you have looked at a large amount of tags from that year and plant, the differences pop right out.
How the plant physically handled the tag could be different leading to important omissions of certain details specific to certain plants that indicate fake tags.
Yes, but if the data is correct, there wouldn't be any way to tell, really.
No, even if the data is correct a repop tag can be told from an original pretty easily by someone that knows what they are looking at.
It also depends on the plant, take Lynch Rd., there is info on the tag that is not on any other piece of documentation, you have to make those numbers up.
When I see a repop tag on a restored car EVERYTHING is in question without solid proof to back it up.
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Re: Orig trim tag MIA. How to get the orig layout to redo.
[Re: Morty426]
#1118632
11/24/11 11:52 AM
11/24/11 11:52 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,070
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,070
U.S.S.A.
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Ok ..From A to Y B41 B51 C16 D34 D53 E87 G11 J46 J81 N96 R33 R36 S77 VX1 V6X W23 Y14 T86 There are no A (group) codes. The sticker price for this 71 Challenger was $4752.05 Funny thing about this car is the OPEN 323 rear .It must have been a handful on a rainy day.
If that's what GG gave you for codes you need to ask for your money back
D34 would not be correct. Yikes...my typin is no good actually the codes are B41 B51 C19 C55 C93 F25 F96 G11 G41 J11 J15 J21 J25 J31 J46 J81 L76 M21 M26 N41 N42 N85 N96 R36 R33S15 S25S77 S81 W23...
Also there are codes that would have to be there that you don't have listed. Are you holding out? I see on the left side of the printout E87 D32 D53 T86 V01 V1X GY3 V6X TX8 Those are all the 3 letter codes
If you can email me a copy of your broadcast sheet I can probably help you.
Mike
Based on the info you provided your tag would look like this. However I still think you are holding back a code or two that might make people question the tag. All the lower case stuff are things you have not provided.
PS: I know all you "experts" can ID a repo tag.
That one will stick out like a sore thumb ... 
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with that, and maybe even a 3rd, but I'm not talkin' 
