Re: Vibration from bad forged crank harmonic balancer?
[Re: rapom]
#1073240
09/12/11 09:28 PM
09/12/11 09:28 PM
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Aurora, CO
Manifold
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Quote:
Also might be the torque converter or a cracked flex plate.
True. I'm hoping it isn't as the trans (B&M), converter (TCI Streetfighter... I know, I know!) and flexplate (MP) are all new as of last year. My fear is it is the converter because of the poor rep TCI has in the Mopar community.
I'm trying to eliminate as much as possible before having to pull the trans again.
Hopefully someone out there has some insight on the harmonic balancer. I may call a company which rebuilds them to get their opinion. Though, I don't want to open myself up to getting taken.
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Re: Vibration from bad forged crank harmonic balancer?
[Re: Manifold]
#1073241
09/12/11 09:56 PM
09/12/11 09:56 PM
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JohnRR
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Quote:
Quote:
Also might be the torque converter or a cracked flex plate.
True. I'm hoping it isn't as the trans (B&M), converter (TCI Streetfighter... I know, I know!) and flexplate (MP) are all new as of last year. My fear is it is the converter because of the poor rep TCI has in the Mopar community.
I'm trying to eliminate as much as possible before having to pull the trans again.
Hopefully someone out there has some insight on the harmonic balancer. I may call a company which rebuilds them to get their opinion. Though, I don't want to open myself up to getting taken.
Easy enough to tell, get out your timing light. the odds are huge that it spun exactly 360 degrees and yes some will have a small amount drilled out of the outer ring to balance.
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Re: Vibration from bad forged crank harmonic balancer?
[Re: JohnRR]
#1073242
09/13/11 02:33 AM
09/13/11 02:33 AM
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JohnRR
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Re: Vibration from bad forged crank harmonic balancer?
[Re: JohnRR]
#1073244
09/13/11 08:09 PM
09/13/11 08:09 PM
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Aurora, CO
Manifold
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Quote:
Easy enough to tell, get out your timing light. the odds are huge that it spun exactly 360 degrees and yes some will have a small amount drilled out of the outer ring to balance.
 360 degrees.
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Re: Vibration from bad forged crank harmonic balancer?
[Re: RemCharger]
#1073245
09/13/11 08:16 PM
09/13/11 08:16 PM
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Manifold
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I have been fighting this in my 383 street car (too a tee). I have narrowed it down to the hub on the conv going into the crank, being too small and off centric , and wobbling in there. I had enough of working on it and just drive it now, but at some point when I get fired back up, I'm going to pull the convert and get that machined down, and make a bushing for it. I know a shop teacher from the track that says he has done this repair before with good success .
Again, I have not verified the issue, but am 95% certain that is my problem. 
Very interesting. I'd be concerned with damaging the pump or something else on the trans. Hopefully it isn't out enough to do damage.
After I go re-verify that TDC matches the balancer, I'll probably be pulling the transmission. Ugh. I just don't have the drive for this stuff like I used to. 
Thanks everyone!
EDIT: Just had a thought of something to try before pulling the transmission. Unbolt the converter from the flexplate and give it a spin/whatever. Then, bolt it back up and see if the vibration changes. It bugs me that this wasn't a problem until several months after installing all the new parts.
Last edited by Manifold; 09/13/11 08:24 PM.
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Re: Vibration from bad forged crank harmonic balancer?
[Re: Manifold]
#1073246
09/15/11 04:55 PM
09/15/11 04:55 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,825
Sk. Canada
RemCharger
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Quote:
Quote:
I have been fighting this in my 383 street car (too a tee). I have narrowed it down to the hub on the conv going into the crank, being too small and off centric , and wobbling in there. I had enough of working on it and just drive it now, but at some point when I get fired back up, I'm going to pull the convert and get that machined down, and make a bushing for it. I know a shop teacher from the track that says he has done this repair before with good success .
Again, I have not verified the issue, but am 95% certain that is my problem.
Very interesting. I'd be concerned with damaging the pump or something else on the trans. Hopefully it isn't out enough to do damage.
After I go re-verify that TDC matches the balancer, I'll probably be pulling the transmission. Ugh. I just don't have the drive for this stuff like I used to.
Thanks everyone!
EDIT: Just had a thought of something to try before pulling the transmission. Unbolt the converter from the flexplate and give it a spin/whatever. Then, bolt it back up and see if the vibration changes. It bugs me that this wasn't a problem until several months after installing all the new parts.
I have done this too. I thought it changed slightly, but not sure. I even tried putting a timing light to it ,to see if something would show up. Tried marking it with chaulk to see if I could find a runout issue with no decent results.
You could unbolt it and see if there is up down play... Again might not get good test results.
It gets real tiring after about 5 times...
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Re: Vibration from bad forged crank harmonic balancer?
[Re: Manifold]
#1073247
09/15/11 06:35 PM
09/15/11 06:35 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
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JohnRR
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Quote:
EDIT: Just had a thought of something to try before pulling the transmission. Unbolt the converter from the flexplate and give it a spin/whatever. Then, bolt it back up and see if the vibration changes. It bugs me that this wasn't a problem until several months after installing all the new parts.
What is that going to accomplish, the convertor only bolts on in one orientation ?
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Re: Vibration from bad forged crank harmonic balancer?
[Re: JohnRR]
#1073248
09/16/11 10:35 PM
09/16/11 10:35 PM
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Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 15,871
Central Florida
larrymopar360
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Same deal here. Around 2000rpm, driving, or in Park or Nuetral. Annoying has can be. I don't believe it is in my motor (Magnum 360). I have a TCI 727 and TCI Converter. I feel certain I have the right combination flexplate/converter. Wondering if it is my TCI converter. Their tech dept is worthless!!! Maybe for something other than a Mopar, I don't know, but worthless for Mopar stuff. Three different techs will give you three different answers. I feel your pain out there with your vibrations.
Facts are stubborn things.
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Re: Vibration from bad forged crank harmonic balancer?
[Re: RemCharger]
#1073249
09/22/11 12:22 AM
09/22/11 12:22 AM
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 35
Aurora, CO
Manifold
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I have been fighting this in my 383 street car (too a tee). I have narrowed it down to the hub on the conv going into the crank, being too small and off centric , and wobbling in there. I had enough of working on it and just drive it now, but at some point when I get fired back up, I'm going to pull the convert and get that machined down, and make a bushing for it. I know a shop teacher from the track that says he has done this repair before with good success .
Again, I have not verified the issue, but am 95% certain that is my problem.
Very interesting. I'd be concerned with damaging the pump or something else on the trans. Hopefully it isn't out enough to do damage.
After I go re-verify that TDC matches the balancer, I'll probably be pulling the transmission. Ugh. I just don't have the drive for this stuff like I used to.
Thanks everyone!
EDIT: Just had a thought of something to try before pulling the transmission. Unbolt the converter from the flexplate and give it a spin/whatever. Then, bolt it back up and see if the vibration changes. It bugs me that this wasn't a problem until several months after installing all the new parts.
I have done this too. I thought it changed slightly, but not sure. I even tried putting a timing light to it ,to see if something would show up. Tried marking it with chaulk to see if I could find a runout issue with no decent results.
You could unbolt it and see if there is up down play... Again might not get good test results.
It gets real tiring after about 5 times...
I think one time was enough for me. Didn't make a difference. Didn't attempt to pry on it - if we're talking about a few thousands, I suspect you'd have to be darn luck to get it just right.
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Re: Vibration from bad forged crank harmonic balancer?
[Re: JohnRR]
#1073250
09/22/11 12:27 AM
09/22/11 12:27 AM
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 35
Aurora, CO
Manifold
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Quote:
Quote:
EDIT: Just had a thought of something to try before pulling the transmission. Unbolt the converter from the flexplate and give it a spin/whatever. Then, bolt it back up and see if the vibration changes. It bugs me that this wasn't a problem until several months after installing all the new parts.
What is that going to accomplish, the convertor only bolts on in one orientation ?
I do know that the converter only bolts on in one orientation - at least I knew enough to mark everything before installation.
The idea is that if one could change - even just slightly - the position of the converter in relation to the crank and flexplate, then the vibration may change enough to notice. Thus, one could be fairly sure that was the problem.
But figuring there's such a small amount of room for there to be play, I think it'd be hard to get the vibration to go away or change. I was hoping to spot something which would give me a clue, but the bolts were tight and the holes in the flexplate looked fine. Only thing that gave me a sliver of hope was that the paint on the converter had come loose and was pinched between the two. I wire brushed the rest of it away, but it made no difference.
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Re: Vibration from bad forged crank harmonic balancer?
[Re: larrymopar360]
#1073251
09/22/11 12:37 AM
09/22/11 12:37 AM
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 35
Aurora, CO
Manifold
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Quote:
Same deal here. Around 2000rpm, driving, or in Park or Nuetral. Annoying has can be. I don't believe it is in my motor (Magnum 360). I have a TCI 727 and TCI Converter. I feel certain I have the right combination flexplate/converter. Wondering if it is my TCI converter. Their tech dept is worthless!!! Maybe for something other than a Mopar, I don't know, but worthless for Mopar stuff. Three different techs will give you three different answers. I feel your pain out there with your vibrations.
Thanks for sharing. <sigh> I told myself don't go with a TCI converter (I have a B&M 727). But, I got it new for a song. Oh well, if it is the problem.
RemCharger - What brand of converter are you running?
The POS reman power steering pump is making a racket now. I doubt I put 500 miles on it. 
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Re: Vibration from bad forged crank harmonic balancer?
[Re: Manifold]
#1073253
09/22/11 03:07 AM
09/22/11 03:07 AM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,825
Sk. Canada
RemCharger
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I read that thread, thanks for sharing. Maybe its the balljoints.(sorry).
My convertor is a b+m holeshot,, which is really irrelevant ,because a convertor is just a huge mass of steel being whirlled off the end of your crank. either its dialed in and balanced, or its out of synch. Mine has a raised ring on the snout that goes in the crank end , and it appeared to be worn on on side.....
This convertor was in a neutral balanced ,, cast crank,, 440. It shook, and I raced it. (the conv, and eng, are fine.)
Long and short of the story is, I'd like to see the convertor in a lathe and checked for concentricity. And made sure that the snout is true , and the right dimensions...
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Re: Vibration from bad forged crank harmonic balancer?
[Re: dogdays]
#1073255
09/23/11 03:21 PM
09/23/11 03:21 PM
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JohnRR
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Quote:
I think JohnRR was trying to say 180 degrees.... He's got a point worth checking, though, because most neutral balance dampers have some balancing holes on the outer ring.
R.
PS: IIRC there were stock 1968 383s with cast cranks, just to complicate matters.
PPS: If this seems bothersome, try finding the right flywheel for a Ford engine!
What I was trying to say was the timing mark moves when the outer ring slips and the only way to not tell with your timing light would be if the outer ring slipped to put it back in exactly the same spot wheter it did it by moving one direction and then back or spining all the way around and stopping in the exact same place .
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