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Re: SB Oil Pump. Anyone ever done this?
[Re: FastOne]
#1060565
08/24/11 09:36 PM
08/24/11 09:36 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,187
Melbourne , Australia
LA360
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,187
Melbourne , Australia
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In a combination like yours I see no need for a Hi Volume pump, and running one with a standard pan is just asking for trouble IMO. I will also say that you've far too much too assumption, which is probably the root cause of these issues you are having. I wouldn't put an engine together without checking everything, nor would I pay anyone to do so unless I knew they did the same. Machinists are human and make mistakes, which you will never pick up if you don't check it yourself.
The oiling system in small blocks is pretty good for most builds and I have not come across any oiling issues in the past when some common sense is applied. We've (My group of friends) have run a few small blocks running times as you've described. The only mods to the oiling system is a deburring of the entry and exit of the cap and oil pump, a quick deburr of the lifter valley and internally paint the block. Solid lifter, revved to 7K with regular oil changes, the bearings look like when they were installed. A good pan was always a must, and blueprinting the standard Melling pump.
I think the two most prominent points have been
1/. Put a larger, baffled oil pan on. I think you have under estimated how much oil actually sits in the block, especially with your enlarged galleries etc.
2/. Check your clearances are correct.I mean everything, Main and Big end, lifter, anything related to the oiling system. Don't assume, assumptions generally cost you time and money in my experience. If this is an engine someone has paid you to put together, it is going to hurt your reputation while you are at it.
Last edited by LA360; 08/24/11 09:37 PM.
Alan Jones
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Re: SB Oil Pump. Anyone ever done this?
[Re: colt340]
#1060567
08/25/11 05:24 PM
08/25/11 05:24 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 611
Muncie
Racebuddy
OP
mopar
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OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 611
Muncie
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Thanks Colt340 for the diagram. Wonder why people/company's have been trying to modify oil pump intake capacity?? Its because the little SB needs that and everything else it can get to help it oil. 
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Re: SB Oil Pump. Anyone ever done this?
[Re: Racebuddy]
#1060570
08/25/11 07:06 PM
08/25/11 07:06 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,908
Florida
Locomotion
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,908
Florida
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Quote:
Wonder why people/company's have been trying to modify oil pump intake capacity??
Its because the little SB needs that and everything else it can get to help it oil.
 It depends on the HP, rpm and application (drag, road racing, circle track, etc.). One has to know what is needed, not just go by what a company says. Companies try to sell things so they can make a profit. Some things are bad, some can't hurt and some do help. But the blanket statement "the little SB needs that and everything else it can get to help it oil" is simply wrong. It sounds like a comment from a Chevy fan! There are plenty of strong running small block Mopars that don't have anything fancy done to their oiling systems.
I've been racing for 33+ years and continue to learn new things, including from here, on moparts. People are trying to help and offer different perspectives. Take some of the advice.
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Re: SB Oil Pump. Anyone ever done this?
[Re: Locomotion]
#1060571
08/25/11 08:44 PM
08/25/11 08:44 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 611
Muncie
Racebuddy
OP
mopar
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OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 611
Muncie
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You guys crack me up. Congrats on your 33 years of racing but dude, i'm not impressed with condescending posts or your insistance that I bow to your persistant drumming of what you think I need to do to fix my oiling problem. I say again... I was not looking for advice on what might cause bearing failure or anything else other than if folks had any experience with a two pick up pump. I got the rest covered. 
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Re: SB Oil Pump. Anyone ever done this?
[Re: Racebuddy]
#1060572
08/25/11 09:23 PM
08/25/11 09:23 PM
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,091
Delray beach, Florida
Performance Only
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,091
Delray beach, Florida
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Quote:
You guys crack me up.
Congrats on your 33 years of racing but dude, i'm not impressed with condescending posts or your insistance that I bow to your persistant drumming of what you think I need to do to fix my oiling problem.
I say again... I was not looking for advice on what might cause bearing failure or anything else other than if folks had any experience with a two pick up pump.
I got the rest covered.
the only dual pickup small block pump setup i've ever seen was a cobbled up mess, kind of like the one pictured in this thread. that was many years ago. i'm not sure where that idea came from, but it was a bad one for sure. the guy apparently had several engine failures and other issues he had been trying to overcome. obviously he got a rude awakening...
eventually he brought the engine to us as a basket case to repair. as i recall, he was running a 6 quart pan with a hi volume pump on a high rpm 340. there wasn't much left in that engine that was useable. it had spun bearings, bent factory crank, and a whole host of other problems.
i can assure you that when we built a new combo we didn't use dual pickups. we ran a baffled 8 quart pan, a hi-volume pump, standard oiling mods on a combo that made near 700 HP and went through the traps at 7800 rpm regularly. freshen up's are every 3 years since he only puts about 150-170 passes a year on it.
take from that experience what you want. i realize it might not be what you want to hear, but consider yourself informed.
may people here are trying to steer you in the right direction. you have an odd way of showing your gratitude, Dude.
Last edited by Performance Only; 08/25/11 09:26 PM.
machine shop owner and engine builder
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Re: SB Oil Pump. Anyone ever done this?
[Re: Performance Only]
#1060573
08/25/11 10:21 PM
08/25/11 10:21 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 611
Muncie
Racebuddy
OP
mopar
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OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 611
Muncie
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There is nothing COBBLED about it. It is a fine piece of craftsmanship. if y'all don't like it then great, pass on the idea. It appears greater minds than mine worked on the idea some years before. Don't be afraid of things off the beaten path. If u haven't tried it then u don't know if its a good idea or not so peace out. I don't need to hear any more success stories about who has done what to this and that. I GOT MY OWN ENGINE SUCCESS STORIES. Hear this. there hasn't been a suggestion or a story or a method offered up from y'all that I haven't used, thought of, improved on, researched, or tested myself. Its all good in my neighborhood. For all u professional haters, quit lookin for pats on the back.
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Re: SB Oil Pump. Anyone ever done this?
[Re: Racebuddy]
#1060575
08/25/11 10:35 PM
08/25/11 10:35 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 12,041
Finally a HUSKER again
Moparnut426
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 12,041
Finally a HUSKER again
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From your origional post I could tell you have this issue as a unsuccessfull "try" at racing, and MANY very experianced engine BUILDERS in this thread have told you where you have issues, and your issue isnt going to be repaired by a stupid dual pick up design that obviously dosnt work. If it did work it would be in every Ryan J engine, Dan Costello engine, Competition wedge, or Brian from the west coasts engines. YOU my friend have a very interesting way of going about getting an issue fixed. You have it in your head that you need this dual puck up, so go ahead and do that, continue to not double check your stuff, and continue to post threads on here when your 33 years of racing and engine fun fail you once more. Because my friend, from what I am reading you are going to continue to have "issues" and they arent oil pick up related.
Stop being so hard nosed, and take some very good and well layed out advice from a lot of very tallented, and very thoughtfull guys on here. Your ignorant responds to some very good points on here tell me your gonna continue to have problems. I can tell you one thing, Im glad I have Dan at performance onlys number in my phone because that guy knows his [Edited by Moparts - Family Friendly Site - Keep it clean], and Id never second guess his recomendations.
Oh, and If I had the room Id have a swinging pickup in my pan inside a baffled box. I loved my swinging pichup we used.
Kasey
Last edited by moparnut426; 08/25/11 10:47 PM.
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Re: SB Oil Pump. Anyone ever done this?
[Re: Racebuddy]
#1060576
08/25/11 10:49 PM
08/25/11 10:49 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Quote:
You guys crack me up.
Congrats on your 33 years of racing but dude, i'm not impressed with condescending posts or your insistance that I bow to your persistant drumming of what you think I need to do to fix my oiling problem.
I say again... I was not looking for advice on what might cause bearing failure or anything else other than if folks had any experience with a two pick up pump.
I got the rest covered.
I think you should maybe go with 3 or even 4 pickups
that way you'll be 3 or 4 times as good
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Re: SB Oil Pump. Anyone ever done this?
[Re: Racebuddy]
#1060579
08/25/11 11:08 PM
08/25/11 11:08 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 12,041
Finally a HUSKER again
Moparnut426
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 12,041
Finally a HUSKER again
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Quote:
Hey moparnut426
did u not just read the previous post from the roundtrack guy who said he always used dual pickups??
Whats your big response to that??
Don't have one? You just waiting to see what one of your heroes thinks first so u can agree with them from afar?
Why don't u call him hard headed and foolished too?
C'mon let's hear it, tell him how stupid he is and how he should listen to YOU cause read it on Moparts.
Evidently this MOPAR round tracker has found a practical application for a dual pick up set up and it performs the function as he needs it to. U wanna gripe about the result cause the execution doesn't suit your vision?
Take an ambien, you don't impress me.
Yeah he is one of thousands on here. You have a buddy!! sweet for you.
Hes dirt trackin your suposedly drag racing. AND your problem is NOT the pick up, its your head. Now pull it outa your pooper, and deal with the issue at hand. IGNORANCE!
how that for a BIG RESPONCE.... DUDE..
And that guys stuff is still together,,,prolly cause he can read a MIC, and a dial indicator.
Im not trying to impress you, DOnt give a crap, just cant believe how bad you have tunnelvision.
Kasey
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Re: SB Oil Pump. Anyone ever done this?
[Re: Racebuddy]
#1060580
08/25/11 11:10 PM
08/25/11 11:10 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Quote:
2 pick ups is fine.
I wouldn't know where to plum any more pick up tubes there mr p brain
I understand your just a moron and you can help it
but if you could just open your little brain up to
some KNOWN FACTS it could help you... but since you
dont even check anything on a engine build it doesnt
suprize me in the slightest.... continue blowing up
your JUNK
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Re: SB Oil Pump. Anyone ever done this?
[Re: MR_P_BODY]
#1060581
08/25/11 11:22 PM
08/25/11 11:22 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 611
Muncie
Racebuddy
OP
mopar
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OP
mopar
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 611
Muncie
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 You can check out my JUNK on the Muncie dragway website. check out the Pro winner for 8-20-2011. the winner is sporting one of my engines in her 67 Rambler. When was the last time one of u bitches won anything?? thats what I thought. Put that in ur pipe and smoke it. I'M OUT kisses
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Re: SB Oil Pump. Anyone ever done this?
[Re: MR_P_BODY]
#1060582
08/25/11 11:22 PM
08/25/11 11:22 PM
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,091
Delray beach, Florida
Performance Only
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,091
Delray beach, Florida
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it's pretty strange of you to ask for help, and then when you don't like what people have to say you become offensive. not only is it a shame, but it's also quite telling. i'm sure after seeing this debacle unfold people will be jumping at the chance to help you in the future.  maybe you just need a vacation. 
Last edited by Performance Only; 08/25/11 11:25 PM.
machine shop owner and engine builder
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Re: SB Oil Pump. Anyone ever done this?
[Re: Racebuddy]
#1060583
08/25/11 11:25 PM
08/25/11 11:25 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 12,041
Finally a HUSKER again
Moparnut426
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 12,041
Finally a HUSKER again
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Quote:
You can check out my JUNK on the Muncie dragway website. check out the Pro winner for 8-20-2011.
the winner is sporting one of my engines in her 67 Rambler.
When was the last time one of u bitches won anything??
thats what I thought. Put that in ur pipe and smoke it.
I'M OUT
kisses
You sound more and more like one of those POPOFFS from the bullet. Are you sure you arent running a Chevy, you sound like ya do.
LATER dude..
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Re: SB Oil Pump. Anyone ever done this?
[Re: Racebuddy]
#1060584
08/25/11 11:33 PM
08/25/11 11:33 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Quote:
You can check out my JUNK on the Muncie dragway website. check out the Pro winner for 8-20-2011.
the winner is sporting one of my engines in her 67 Rambler.
When was the last time one of u bitches won anything??
thats what I thought. Put that in ur pipe and smoke it.
I'M OUT
kisses
Oh I have won plenty...I have the pics to prove it...
not like some BS... oh I built the engine thats in the
winners circle... like thats really gonna happen
when you dont check a damn thing..... your the one
thats blowing up your junk.... not me.... what a idiot...
just do what ever you feel like... you didnt want to hear
what you wanted
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