charging system just took a dive
#1034394
07/17/11 07:44 PM
07/17/11 07:44 PM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,179 California
mickm
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,179
California
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so my ammeter is usually showing in the positive range a little past positive, and very past positive when it took a lot of cranking to start the car, and then it settles down. just what you would expect. today i noticed that it is showing about that much negative, and sure enough, after a few starts, the battery now no longer has enough juice to start the car.
i only had a few minutes to start looking at it. battery shows 11.8 volts, and no change when the engine is revved up to 2k+. i started looking at the FSM on testing the voltage regulator, and the test involves the ballast resistor. i believe mine is bypassed, as i've got an MSD ignition, so is this test still valid?
i don't yet suspect the alternator, as it was rewound by a very reputable shop within the last year or so, although that doesn't mean it isn't it.
did a quick check and all connections seem to be tight.
i'm charging the battery now, so will be able to start it and begin testing later. what are some quick tests i can make to try and track this down?
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Re: charging system just took a dive
[Re: mickm]
#1034395
07/17/11 11:01 PM
07/17/11 11:01 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,041 Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
Circle Track
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Circle Track
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,041
Lincoln Nebraska
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eng off/ign on see if the blue feed wire out from the bulkhead has fire (1) at the blue wire alt field terminal and (2) at the top terminal in the VR triangle w it facing up like a pyramid (some C bodies are sideways or upside down). Pull alt brushes & quick visual of them & they wear at an angle so replace them at that same angle. Check VR ground (jumper wire w alligator clips) 1 clip to known good ground then scrape the VR case w the other clip & see if it starts charging (eng running). pull a batt cable & w your VOM see if continuity between the ends of the green field wire (alt/vr). Full field the alt: pull both female field terminals off & jump from batt positive to either male alt field terminal, start eng & at a fast idle then jump from the batt neg post to the other alt male field terminal for 3 seconds MAX & if it charges (you'll hear it kick in & slow the eng down slightly but decisively) the alt is good. Have no light bulbs or accessories going when you "full field" and it's a good idea to run a seperate 8 ga jumper from the alt "batt" terminal to the battery positive post when you full field. If the alt tests good and the blue/green circuits are good and the reg has a good ground that only leaves the reg as the culprit
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: charging system just took a dive
[Re: mickm]
#1034396
07/18/11 12:16 AM
07/18/11 12:16 AM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 18,157 Mass
DAYCLONA
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 18,157
Mass
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Start the car, if the alternator is "working", the rear bearing at the center position of the case, in the rear case, will have some magnetic attraction when the tip of a screwdriver is touched to it,....if there's magnetic attraction, but the output to the battery is nil,....time for a Voltage Regulator,.... If there's no magnetic attraction the alternator is kaput,..replace the alt. AND THE VR......
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Re: charging system just took a dive
[Re: intragration]
#1034398
07/18/11 11:21 AM
07/18/11 11:21 AM
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Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,822 Colorado
denfireguy
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,822
Colorado
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Quote:
I had a bad connection on the fusible link, right by the starter solenoid. This high resistance apparently blew the link and also fried the newly rebuilt alternator.
Not sure but it also could have been the rebuilt alternator had a diode short out and take your fusible link out. That happens often, especially with newly rebuilt alternators. Craig
2014 Ram 1500 Laramie, 73 Cuda Previous mopars: 62 Valiant, 65 Fury III, 68 Fury III, 72 Satellite, 74 Satellite, 89 Acclaim, 98 Caravan, 2003 Durango Only previous Non-Mopar: Schwinn Tornado
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Re: charging system just took a dive
[Re: intragration]
#1034400
07/26/11 02:31 AM
07/26/11 02:31 AM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,179 California
mickm
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,179
California
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turns out it was the stator in the alternator. when i asked the guy why it took a dump, as it was rewound just 2 years ago, he simply said "too much load on the alternator".
i didn't get a chance to talk to him more, but what causes too much load? sometimes when i have to crank it a bunch to get gas to the carb, the needle on the ammeter hovers just below the first mark on the positive side, but quickly comes back to just above mid line as the battery recharges.
i've never had any indicator that there was too much load on the alternator. besides the MSD box, everything else is stock: am radio, headlights, etc...
any thoughts? i'd rather not burn up another stator in two years time...
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Re: charging system just took a dive
[Re: mickm]
#1034403
07/26/11 10:21 AM
07/26/11 10:21 AM
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 6,566 Downtown Roebuck Ont
Twostick
Still wishing...
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Still wishing...
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 6,566
Downtown Roebuck Ont
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Quote:
turns out it was the stator in the alternator. when i asked the guy why it took a dump, as it was rewound just 2 years ago, he simply said "too much load on the alternator".
i didn't get a chance to talk to him more, but what causes too much load? sometimes when i have to crank it a bunch to get gas to the carb, the needle on the ammeter hovers just below the first mark on the positive side, but quickly comes back to just above mid line as the battery recharges.
i've never had any indicator that there was too much load on the alternator. besides the MSD box, everything else is stock: am radio, headlights, etc...
any thoughts? i'd rather not burn up another stator in two years time...
Too much load on the alternator... what a load of crap. Sounds like you need a new stator and a new rebuilder.
Unless I saw him actually rewind the stator, I would bet it came out of a box like it does at every other shop in country. Just get a new stator and install it yourself or get a bracket kit for a Denso alternator from a Toyota. http://www.arengineering.com/alternatorbracket/ND_bracket/denso.html Mancini sells these too.
Another option is to adapt an Autolite from a 70's (gasp) Ford. Very dependable alternator. (They used them on Cessna aircraft)
Kevin
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Re: charging system just took a dive
[Re: Twostick]
#1034404
07/26/11 10:45 AM
07/26/11 10:45 AM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 18,157 Mass
DAYCLONA
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 18,157
Mass
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Quote:
Too much load on the alternator... what a load of crap. Sounds like you need a new stator and a new rebuilder.
...you said what I was thinking as I read the OP's post,...I gave up on rebuilt/restored alternators a long time ago, after going thru various companies and individuals,...and getting stuck at the most inopertune locations with a bad alt,....I've been running the Powermaster line of reproduction and street alternators the last 7+ years with not one issue on any kind on my cars,...and they do get driven long distance, hours on end, days at a time, no garage/trailer queens, so I need an alternator that's in it for the long haul, for the money you spend on a junk rebuilt, you can buy a Powermaster reproduction that's all new parts, cases included, that's been tested before ship, test sheets are included with each alt, plus they're rated up to 13,000 RPM pulley speeds,...prolonged hi rpm was the biggest killer of my rebuilts, along with other "mysterious" issues that were never the rebuilders fault
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Re: charging system just took a dive
[Re: DAYCLONA]
#1034405
07/26/11 11:52 AM
07/26/11 11:52 AM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,179 California
mickm
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,179
California
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high resistance on a bad connection does make sense, but wouldn't that show up in other ways? i will start playing around.
with what little i know of charging systems, and the behavior of the car, the too much load thing didn't quite make sense either...
the shop i went to has a great reputation, and has been around for a long time. doesn't always mean anything, but a good start.
he did replace the stator, and it kind of looks like junk, so i don't know for how long i'm out of the woods. i checked out Powermaster, just waiting for a quote back.
but there is at least one member who rebuilds alternators, does anyone know who that is?
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