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Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. [Re: runya] #102965
08/11/08 09:03 PM
08/11/08 09:03 PM

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There is a manufacture max gross combination(towing) weight.My Dodge 3500 is gvw at 12,200lbs my max combination weight is rated at 23,000lbs.I can only licence my total combo weight at the 23,000lbs even though my trailer is rated at 16,000lbs.Last night I was weighed at 20,200lbs,my fine was based on the difference of my truck gross and combo gross weight,8000lbs.

Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. [Re: G-Money1320] #102966
08/11/08 09:09 PM
08/11/08 09:09 PM
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California, USA
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Phil Saran Offline
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There is another big link over on www.classracer.com about this same subject
going on in NC and the effects it's having.


Phil Saran Parker, Colorado
Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. [Re: G-Money1320] #102967
08/11/08 09:10 PM
08/11/08 09:10 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,361
PA
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PA
If you read the CDL licensing requirements book in PA it contradicts it's self. I asked PennDOT for a clarification on the statements and got, "read the book it is in there." According to the book you may have a trailer OVER 10,000 lbs. and as long as your combination wt. does not exceede 26,001 lbs. you are not required to have a CDL. I have asked State Police officers who I personally know and they all came back with the same answer. Drive it. It's all a money racquet for the state or small town cops who think they are the greatest DOT officers. I carry the book with me in my console and as soon as someone says something about it, that book is coming out and I have the page photocopied to give the the nice officer.

Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. [Re: ] #102968
08/11/08 09:15 PM
08/11/08 09:15 PM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 204
Indiana
MFR426 Offline
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I have looked at this post as well as other post from other sites with great interest. I have tried to weed through the FMCSA regulations many times myself and I carry a copy of the exemption page that states RV's are exempt as the Vehicle Reg's say but they have changed it from a year or so ago as it now says "recreational vehicles operating under their own power." So since I have a 48 Ft. Gooseneck that is titled and licensed as an Rv I'm going to keep my old copy in the truck. I'm lucky as I have the Class A CDL as I drive a school bus so all I think I would need would be the log book and if made to, the DOT but as General applicabilty Part 390.3 (f)( 3) states "f) Exceptions. Unless otherwise specifically provided, the rules in this subchapter do not apply to —(f)(3) The occasional transportation of personal property by individuals not for compensation nor in the furtherance of a commercial enterprise;" I'll be carrying a copy of that along with my past year IRS documents. I tried to catch the Indiana DOT police as they were inspecting our busses to ask them their viewpoint but they were to busy and I don't like interrupting them. Ha! While I was looking up this info on the FMCSA site, I was asked to take a survey and I really (nicely) let them have it on not having the exemptions better defined and examples so we could carry something with us to show the DOT officers and implied that there is inconsistency in the interpretation by officers. Don't know if it will help, but can't hurt.
It is hard to beleive that we have come to having to carry our tax returns with us to prove that our property is ours and not a business to enjoy a hobby!
Thanks!
MFR426

Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. [Re: B G Racing] #102969
08/11/08 09:17 PM
08/11/08 09:17 PM
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Fort Pierce, FL
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Outlaw10_5 Offline
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Quote:

There is a manufacture max gross combination(towing) weight.My Dodge 3500 is gvw at 12,200lbs my max combination weight is rated at 23,000lbs.I can only licence my total combo weight at the 23,000lbs even though my trailer is rated at 16,000lbs.Last night I was weighed at 20,200lbs,my fine was based on the difference of my truck gross and combo gross weight,8000lbs.



OK, but where do they get that spec from? I also have a 3500 (05 dually) which Dodge claims has a 16,900 lb towing capacity. It also is 12,200 GVW.

Again, it's a different state, but the only way to tag something by CGVW here is a cab and chassis. Pickups over 10K GVW get a December tag (commercial experation even tho it's personal) and don't have a CGVW limit by the tag.

Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. [Re: Outlaw10_5] #102970
08/11/08 09:33 PM
08/11/08 09:33 PM
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Kissimmee Fl.
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look at your registration I also have a 05 dodge 3500 dually and on my registration it states gvw 26000 lbs gvw and I am here in fl.


70 duster full chassis super pro 416 CNC Indybrock heads 727 w/brake

best so far 1.212 60 6.219 in 1/8 at 110.88 9.768 at 137.81 1/4
Post deleted by Defbob [Re: Phil Saran] #102971
08/11/08 09:41 PM
08/11/08 09:41 PM

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Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. #102972
08/11/08 09:45 PM
08/11/08 09:45 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 995
Boynton Beach, Fl
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http://classracer.com/classforum/showthread.php?t=11913


This same type of thread is going on in at least 5 different sites i know of .....

Mo money mo money for the states....until everybody sells their bigger rigs and the stiff fines and tag revenues go down....then they will have to come up with something else


93 Dodge Stealth - Supercharged 526ci Hemi
93 Dodge Daytona Top Sportsman injected 588 Hemi - plus a lil NOS
67 Hemi GTX (may the 4speed with you!)
Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. #102973
08/11/08 09:46 PM
08/11/08 09:46 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 7,348
Mt.Vernon ,Ohio
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Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. [Re: dusturbd340W5] #102974
08/11/08 09:48 PM
08/11/08 09:48 PM
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Fort Pierce, FL
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Quote:

look at your registration I also have a 05 dodge 3500 dually and on my registration it states gvw 26000 lbs gvw and I am here in fl.


It's 11000, which is about 1200 different than the door sticker.



Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. [Re: Outlaw10_5] #102975
08/11/08 09:52 PM
08/11/08 09:52 PM
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Kissimmee Fl.
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dusturbd340W5 Offline
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outlaw cant get that link to work not sure what that is but I just looked at my registration and its printed right on it gvw 26000


70 duster full chassis super pro 416 CNC Indybrock heads 727 w/brake

best so far 1.212 60 6.219 in 1/8 at 110.88 9.768 at 137.81 1/4
Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. [Re: dusturbd340W5] #102976
08/11/08 09:55 PM
08/11/08 09:55 PM
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Fort Pierce, FL
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Quote:

outlaw cant get that link to work not sure what that is but I just looked at my registration and its printed right on it gvw 26000




Better? I'm new at the pic thing, so sorry to everyone it came out so big, lol.

Anyway, you can see it's 11,000 and there is NO place for a CGVW which is what would matter for towing GVW is only what the single vehicle can carry.

Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. [Re: Outlaw10_5] #102977
08/11/08 10:17 PM
08/11/08 10:17 PM
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Kissimmee Fl.
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dusturbd340W5 Offline
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my registration is just like that but says 26000


70 duster full chassis super pro 416 CNC Indybrock heads 727 w/brake

best so far 1.212 60 6.219 in 1/8 at 110.88 9.768 at 137.81 1/4
Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. [Re: Outlaw10_5] #102978
08/11/08 10:19 PM
08/11/08 10:19 PM
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 659
Tampa Fl
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thats your taged weight.. and its to low..


Remember in here some don't think you should have a Opinion.. sad fact..
Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. [Re: G-Money1320] #102979
08/11/08 10:24 PM
08/11/08 10:24 PM
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Bitopia
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Quote:

Quote:

The very pleasent DOT officer said this follows the federal transportation act guidelines. and if yor rig falls in the CDL requirements you must keep a log book.I will keep everyone informed as I go through the process and pending hearing and get more info.


I would think the log book would only come into play if you were traveling across country and were driving around the guidelines of maxing out the hours you drive. I have driven a truck for 22 years locally and have never had to fill out a log book!




Even though there is zero consensus on this topic, it should be clear that adpting one policy to follow likely gets you under other less understood/undesired regulations. Walk very carefully here, it is a minefield.

On log books, in a nut shell with any DOT Number records must be kept. The DoT is allowed to visit without notice during normal business hours to ensurethe records are kept and up to date. Fines can approach $50K. If you are driving more then 100 miles as the crow flies from your base ( you can only have one) you must have an up to date/hour log book showing at least the entire prior 8 days of activity for the driver in the cab ready for review. If you are UNDER 100 miles, those records can be kept at the office, and of course you must not be driving beyond legal service hours. These records and others are subject to any unannouced audit by the DOT. Think about that. Nobody here follows that, nor likely really understands it. This whole topic is a major can of worms.

Changing the law, not following it is the real answer.


Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. [Re: SCDaytona] #102980
08/11/08 10:28 PM
08/11/08 10:28 PM
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City of Champions
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Quote:


So my Dodge 2500 is rated at 8800 GVW. My trailer is 28' and registered at 9900 GVW. If I have to go register the truck for 18700 GVW,




Yep, thats the way it is.

A few year ago, the DOT cops sat outside if Maple Grove raceway in Reading PA citing for people who don't register their trucks "in combination" as per PA law. They had a field day raking in fines and it was all over the message boards.

You have to abide by the laws of the states you are towing through, no matter what your home state requires.

Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. [Re: Prostock] #102981
08/11/08 10:35 PM
08/11/08 10:35 PM
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Posts: 2,273
Greenville, South Carolina
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So right now I pay NY for 9600 for the Ram and 10000 for the 24' enclosed. I should be paying 19600 for the Ram AND I still need to pay 10000 for the trailer??? So I would be paying for 29600 pounds when I never would actually be more than 19600 pounds???


Walter
1969 Dart Swinger w/ARC Pump Gas 493 B1/BS 10.18 at 130mph
Racing Pro in street trim.
1981 Aries ARC 548 B1 8.88 at 147mph (footbraking)
1996 Ram 2500 V10 16.52 at 80mph
1981 Reliant 400
Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. [Re: Outlaw10_5] #102982
08/11/08 10:45 PM
08/11/08 10:45 PM
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CT
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Here in Connecticut they will not let you register the vehicle for more weight then the GVW that the truck is rated for. They run the VIN number and it gives them a range (on my truck it came up as 8501-9000 pounds.) I tried to register it for 10,500 because everything over 10,000 GVW in Connecticut is exempt from emissions, but they wouldn’t let me do it because it was over the range. Guess there is no way I could legally tow anything into PA.
Lets look at this another way, say you have a 3500 truck that the GVW on the door sticker is 14,500 but you live in PA so you register is for 24,490 so you can tow your enclosed car trailer that is rated for 9990 pounds. Does that mean if you are not towing your trailer, that you can now legally load up the back of the truck until just the truck weighs 24,990 pounds? How could the friendly PA DOT officer give you a ticket for being overweight if the truck was legally registered for it?

Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. [Re: mrrandyj] #102983
08/11/08 11:00 PM
08/11/08 11:00 PM
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Fort Pierce, FL
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Here is the FL law without all the gunk from my earlier post. It also has the staute # and the link to the page.

I will dig deeper into the tag issue, but I think it only matters for commercial, OR just about everyone that hooks to a trailer around here is illegal. I am not hooked up to my trailer full time like a semi would be, and I can't imagine that everyone with a truck over 8K GVW considers their boat/travel/whatever trailer when buying a tag.

26) "Commercial motor vehicle" means any vehicle which is not owned or operated by a governmental entity, which uses special fuel or motor fuel on the public highways, and which has a gross vehicle weight of 26,001 pounds or more, or has three or more axles regardless of weight, or is used in combination when the weight of such combination exceeds 26,001 pounds gross vehicle weight. A vehicle that occasionally transports personal property to and from a closed-course motorsport facility, as defined in s. 549.09(1)(a), is not a commercial motor vehicle if the use is not for profit and corporate sponsorship is not involved. As used in this subsection, the term "corporate sponsorship" means a payment, donation, gratuity, in-kind service, or other benefit provided to or derived by a person in relation to the underlying activity, other than the display of product or corporate names, logos, or other graphic information on the property being transported

http://www.flsenate.gov/Statutes/index.c...H0320/Sec01.HTM

Re: Warning for racing rigs in Pa. [Re: Outlaw10_5] #102984
08/11/08 11:15 PM
08/11/08 11:15 PM
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Bitopia
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Quote:

Here is the FL law without all the gunk from my earlier post. It also has the staute # and the link to the page.

I will dig deeper into the tag issue, but I think it only matters for commercial, OR just about everyone that hooks to a trailer around here is illegal. I am not hooked up to my trailer full time like a semi would be, and I can't imagine that everyone with a truck over 8K GVW considers their boat/travel/whatever trailer when buying a tag.

26) "Commercial motor vehicle" means any vehicle which is not owned or operated by a governmental entity, which uses special fuel or motor fuel on the public highways, and which has a gross vehicle weight of 26,001 pounds or more, or has three or more axles regardless of weight, or is used in combination when the weight of such combination exceeds 26,001 pounds gross vehicle weight. A vehicle that occasionally transports personal property to and from a closed-course motorsport facility, as defined in s. 549.09(1)(a), is not a commercial motor vehicle if the use is not for profit and corporate sponsorship is not involved. As used in this subsection, the term "corporate sponsorship" means a payment, donation, gratuity, in-kind service, or other benefit provided to or derived by a person in relation to the underlying activity, other than the display of product or corporate names, logos, or other graphic information on the property being transported

http://www.flsenate.gov/Statutes/index.c...H0320/Sec01.HTM




But that would not mean squat if you drove to Pa for example.

On the post a couple back, just register the truck (power unit, tractor, etc) at what the combined fully loaded weight of both the trailer and the truck will be, which if I remember is 19+K lbs

On Haz mat, If I remember correctly, hauling over 110 gals of say fuel gets you a required CDL endorsement as a "bulk" carrier. Otherwise just a haz mat endorsement. There are a mulititude of different quantities for different items that trigger haz mat placards, and the amounts are rather small relative to what I think you guys carry to the races. And any US required placarded towed vehicle will really muck up your insurance, if they ask, be warned.


Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
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