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Hard Starting 69 GTX
#971919
04/12/11 12:25 PM
04/12/11 12:25 PM
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 89 Colorado
CaptainGTX
OP
member
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OP
member
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 89
Colorado
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I own a 69 GTX 440 4spd which I've restored as close to factory original as possible. Not unlike a lot of high performance cars of that vintage, it takes a lot of cranking to start it. If it sets more than about 6-8 hours, I can count on having to grind it for a full 30 seconds before starting. The weird thing is:
This hard starting occurs even if I start the car, let it run for a couple minutes & shut it off. I kinda expect this to happen after I've driven it long enough to get everything up to operating temperature. Then I figure the gas is boiling out of the carb and maybe the fuel line next to the block. But the fact that it happens even after it's not gotten hot is puzzling.
I have had the carb rebuilt by two different shops - one a regular carb shop & the other a mopar mechanic - no difference. I've replaced the fuel pump under the assumption the diaphram was leaking - no difference. I replaced the fuel line when I restored the car, the return line is original but not blocked & the entire fuel system is stock. It's almost as though something is pulling a vacuum on the line back to the tank, but all the venting seems to work properly. Occasionally, I get a storng gasoline smell in the garage after I've driven it, but haven't been able to tie it to any particular method of operation.
I've lived with this problem for the 5 years the car has been restored. Some mopar mechanics just say its the nature of the beast. And that its the incompatability of a carbureted engine and today's blends of gasoline, but it seems it should be possible to improve starting. The gasoline shouldn't be evaporating from a cold carb setting on a cold engine. The car runs fine. Anyone experienced this (particularly on a cold engine) and have a thought as to how to get it to start better?
Thanks, Rich in Golden, CO
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Re: Hard Starting 69 GTX
[Re: CaptainGTX]
#971920
04/12/11 12:44 PM
04/12/11 12:44 PM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344 Central TX
roe
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
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Ive read on here, where timing settings have affected how hard/easy an engine starts. Have you thought about a mini-starter or do you want to keep the stock style? My mini-starter turns my motor over much faster and gives me easier and quicker starting
roe
1971 Plymouth Satellite 408/904 8 3/4 3.23 SG
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Re: Hard Starting 69 GTX
[Re: CaptainGTX]
#971922
04/12/11 02:53 PM
04/12/11 02:53 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,201 Someplace you aren't
SomeCarGuy
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,201
Someplace you aren't
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Weak starter or bad ground. Maybe add a big ground and see if it cranks faster and starts easier.
Timing off
Timing chain loose
If it happens cold but not after sitting for week(s) then boiling gas isn't it.
Any drivability problems? Wondering if it may have a huge vaccum leak, but you would notice other issues. My car starts at the bump of the key or at least coughs.
I want my fair share
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Re: Hard Starting 69 GTX
[Re: SomeCarGuy]
#971923
04/12/11 05:31 PM
04/12/11 05:31 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040 Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
Circle Track
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Circle Track
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
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Next time when it is at the point where it acts up, b 4 you crank it take off the air cleaner & open choke & see if it has a good squirt of gas from the AP and hold the coil wire 1/4" from a safe ground while a helper turns the key to start. Basic stuff but might point you in the right direction
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Hard Starting 69 GTX
[Re: CaptainGTX]
#971926
04/13/11 01:47 PM
04/13/11 01:47 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,277 West Coast, USA
jbc426
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,277
West Coast, USA
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Does your accelerator pump shoot in fuel when you open the carb when cold?, when hot? If so, test the + voltage at the coil(Not at the spark plug tower). It should be around 6 to 8 with the key on(key in Start 1= run = through the ballast resistor) and 12+ with the starter cranking(Start 2 = Cranking).
Mopars use two "12v" feeds to the coil, Start 1 & Start 2. This was to boost the coil output when cranking to reduce hard starting, and run the car on reduced voltage to increase the longevity of the coil etc.
If you only have the reduced voltage from the ballast resistor when cranking, you may not be getting the bypassed straight battery voltage(Start 2 = 12v) when cranking. This can cause the starting problems you are having.
What is your initial and total timing?
1970 Plymouth 'Cuda #'s 440-6(block in storage)currently 493" 6 pack, Shaker, 5 speed Passon, 4.10's 1968 Plymouth Barracuda Convertible 408 Magnum EFI with 4 speed automatic overdrive, 3800 stall lock-up converter and 4.30's (closest thing to an automatic 5 speed going)
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