Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 6 1 2 3 4 5 6
building back half car #903230
01/13/11 02:54 AM
01/13/11 02:54 AM
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
Chargerfan68 Offline OP
pro stock
Chargerfan68  Offline OP
pro stock

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
A few more questions please...

When building a back half car with 4-link setup, in what order do the following steps/items happen in? What needs to be figured out first that would determine specific items ordered?

Certain things known:
1) Wheelbase established.
2) Tire size known (rim backspacing undetermined)
3) frame rail spacing established (26")
4) Tub size established (40")

I do not know the following yet (and need to determine the order which to figure them out)
1) ride height
2) Rear end housing width
3) backspacing of 15 X 15 rims
4) tub install height (based on ride height)

For mock up purposes for the build, do I just need the tire/rim to establish rear end width and tub location?

I know it is a lot of questions, but you guys have the knowledge.

Thanks,
Greg.


1.50 60Ft. , 10.75@ 127MPH Hauling 3900 LBS.
Re: building back half car [Re: Chargerfan68] #903231
01/13/11 04:25 AM
01/13/11 04:25 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,138
Melbourne , Australia
LA360 Offline
master
LA360  Offline
master

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,138
Melbourne , Australia
You will need to establish where you axle is going to go in the car, it is also very important you get your ride height where it is going to be. This is important for the placement of the front 4 link brackets. I would start with the main rear cross member, get that and the front four link brackets positioned correctly and build around there.


Alan Jones
Re: building back half car [Re: Chargerfan68] #903232
01/13/11 04:53 AM
01/13/11 04:53 AM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,749
Chowchilla,ca
Chassisman Offline
master
Chassisman  Offline
master

Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,749
Chowchilla,ca
Quote:

A few more questions please...

When building a back half car with 4-link setup, in what order do the following steps/items happen in? What needs to be figured out first that would determine specific items ordered?

Certain things known:
1) Wheelbase established.
2) Tire size known (rim backspacing undetermined)
3) frame rail spacing established (26")
4) Tub size established (40")

I do not know the following yet (and need to determine the order which to figure them out)
1) ride height
2) Rear end housing width
3) backspacing of 15 X 15 rims
4) tub install height (based on ride height)

For mock up purposes for the build, do I just need the tire/rim to establish rear end width and tub location?

I know it is a lot of questions, but you guys have the knowledge.

Thanks,
Greg.


Buy the EXACT wheels and tires your going to race with.....don't guess or estimate......

Re: building back half car [Re: Chassisman] #903233
01/13/11 06:29 AM
01/13/11 06:29 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,647
aotearoa
rebel Offline
master
rebel  Offline
master

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,647
aotearoa

i bought the rims i was going to use & fitted them up with a used set of slicks the size i was going to use. next i cut down the 9" housing to suit, which i fitted up with floater hubs. now i had a roller rear end that i was now able mock up where the best location was to have the rear sit in relation to the chassis & wheel arch. with that in place you can lower the body to the ride height you want to run & check driveshaft location. once we knew that, we could fabricate the diff mount & shock mount to suit knowing our driveshaft had room to move without touching the rear cross member. i had seen a failure in that area before i built the car so i knew, check everything & check it again.

6414729-DSC00144.jpg (414 downloads)
Last edited by rebel; 01/14/11 04:03 AM.
Re: building back half car [Re: Chassisman] #903234
01/13/11 06:29 AM
01/13/11 06:29 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
Master
MR_P_BODY  Offline
Master

Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
Quote:

Quote:

A few more questions please...

When building a back half car with 4-link setup, in what order do the following steps/items happen in? What needs to be figured out first that would determine specific items ordered?

Certain things known:
1) Wheelbase established.
2) Tire size known (rim backspacing undetermined)
3) frame rail spacing established (26")
4) Tub size established (40")

I do not know the following yet (and need to determine the order which to figure them out)
1) ride height
2) Rear end housing width
3) backspacing of 15 X 15 rims
4) tub install height (based on ride height)

For mock up purposes for the build, do I just need the tire/rim to establish rear end width and tub location?

I know it is a lot of questions, but you guys have the knowledge.

Thanks,
Greg.


Buy the EXACT wheels and tires your going to race with.....don't guess or estimate......




that will determine alot.,, then set it
at the ride height you want... that will determine
the height you need for the tubs(make sure you leave
enough for tire growth)

Re: building back half car [Re: MR_P_BODY] #903235
01/14/11 12:52 AM
01/14/11 12:52 AM
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
Chargerfan68 Offline OP
pro stock
Chargerfan68  Offline OP
pro stock

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
Thanks very much for the info. I understand what everyone is saying. I will get the rims/slicks and figure out the width the rear housing has to be.

I now have the body mounted on a rigid jig perfectly leveled, since i removed the rear half of the car. Before I proceed with actually fitting and welding the rear frame rails and crossmembers in, does the body have to be removed off the jig for mock up? I am thinking I can lift the rear up to where I want it to sit at ride height and do the mock up with it mounted on the jig. I do not want to remove it because I don't want anything to move before the frame rails and cage go in.

Thanks again,
Greg.


1.50 60Ft. , 10.75@ 127MPH Hauling 3900 LBS.
Re: building back half car [Re: Chargerfan68] #903236
01/14/11 01:23 AM
01/14/11 01:23 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
Master
MR_P_BODY  Offline
Master

Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
Quote:

Thanks very much for the info. I understand what everyone is saying. I will get the rims/slicks and figure out the width the rear housing has to be.

I now have the body mounted on a rigid jig perfectly leveled, since i removed the rear half of the car. Before I proceed with actually fitting and welding the rear frame rails and crossmembers in, does the body have to be removed off the jig for mock up? I am thinking I can lift the rear up to where I want it to sit at ride height and do the mock up with it mounted on the jig. I do not want to remove it because I don't want anything to move before the frame rails and cage go in.

Thanks again,
Greg.




I'm doing a full chassis right now... next week I'll
roll my chassis jig in and set the car on it... I
use the jig as the ground surface then reference
from that
This is where I'm at now

6416610-DSC00172.JPG (496 downloads)
Re: building back half car [Re: MR_P_BODY] #903237
01/14/11 01:24 AM
01/14/11 01:24 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
Master
MR_P_BODY  Offline
Master

Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
Another

6416613-DSC00164.JPG (522 downloads)
Re: building back half car [Re: MR_P_BODY] #903238
01/14/11 02:00 AM
01/14/11 02:00 AM
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
Chargerfan68 Offline OP
pro stock
Chargerfan68  Offline OP
pro stock

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
Quote:

Another





Thanks Mr P body. Got it.


1.50 60Ft. , 10.75@ 127MPH Hauling 3900 LBS.
Re: building back half car [Re: Chargerfan68] #903239
02/03/11 01:56 AM
02/03/11 01:56 AM
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
Chargerfan68 Offline OP
pro stock
Chargerfan68  Offline OP
pro stock

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
Hey guys,

Well I am getting close to installing the back half kit. It is arriving tomorrow and I am finishing up the repair and reinforcement of the rocker area. This is after cutting the back of the car off and removing the rusted and damaged rocker area.




Now, a few more questions. I went with the Chris Alston ChassisWorks Eliminator II 4 link setup. When I looked at the specs, I was surprised to see that it is designed to set the rockers at 6" off the ground. Is this correct?? It just seems so low and the front of the car at the rockers is about 8" with the drag torsion bars . I have them cranked up pretty high for some built in stored energy and the front control arm (lower) are still just touching the bump stops. I can't really set the front any lower.

At 6 " up front, the header pipes would almost be scraping the floor.

So the first question again is : is this right based on your experience with this particular kit?

If this is not right and potentially a problem, I was thinking of cutting the front section of framerail at the downleg of the rail 2 ", which would raise the car height 2" , giving me rockers at 8". If I do this, I know the 4 link brackets would hang down 2 " lower, and I would reinforce the front area of the brackets back into the frame connector area , and get shock/spring height 2" longer to make up for the height change. This would leave the bracket geometry the same as before and just be lifting the car up 2".

Is this correct and do you see any problems with this?

Thanks for any input,
Greg.


1.50 60Ft. , 10.75@ 127MPH Hauling 3900 LBS.
Re: building back half car [Re: Chargerfan68] #903240
02/03/11 02:05 AM
02/03/11 02:05 AM
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
Chargerfan68 Offline OP
pro stock
Chargerfan68  Offline OP
pro stock

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
I just remembered that "Craig" (his username) had the same issue and he lowered the brackets just as I am talking about (that's where I got the idea from (in the back of my brain...I must be getting old). So I think I might just do what he did to adjust it.

The only thing I don't like is my brackets hanging lower than the rest of the frame rails.

Greg.


1.50 60Ft. , 10.75@ 127MPH Hauling 3900 LBS.
Re: building back half car [Re: Chargerfan68] #903241
02/03/11 10:16 AM
02/03/11 10:16 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 642
New Jersey
Craig Offline
mopar
Craig  Offline
mopar

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 642
New Jersey
If you look at the faster Super Stock cars, they have the same limitations of higher than desired ride height due to stock front suspension, but want a low chassis bracket to get the IC needed. They usually have tubular main framerails that are a few inches below the floorpan and that gets the bottom of the chassis brackets low enough. I'll attach a small pic of Gary Wolkwitz's SS Hemi Dart that is that way. But I have seen a couple that are like mine, hanging down with a support brace.


67 Dart, 426 Hemi, 9.23/145mph, 3400lbs, footbraked, owned since 1982
Re: building back half car [Re: Chargerfan68] #903242
02/03/11 10:23 AM
02/03/11 10:23 AM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,410
Belpre,Ohio
C
CHAPPER Offline
master
CHAPPER  Offline
master
C

Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,410
Belpre,Ohio
Looks like you pretty much have clearance for about anything you want to put about anywhere you want to put it!! What are you going to use for a car to attach everything to?? Just kidding. I am not trying to offend you,,,I just think that I would be sort of 'intimidated' by the project every time I went into the garage. I have gotten into some big jobs like this in the past, but, don't think I will live long enough to do one like this now. Good luck and keep us posted with pics.


If you like drag racing, support your local track.
Re: building back half car [Re: Craig] #903243
02/04/11 01:34 AM
02/04/11 01:34 AM
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
Chargerfan68 Offline OP
pro stock
Chargerfan68  Offline OP
pro stock

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
Quote:

If you look at the faster Super Stock cars, they have the same limitations of higher than desired ride height due to stock front suspension, but want a low chassis bracket to get the IC needed. They usually have tubular main framerails that are a few inches below the floorpan and that gets the bottom of the chassis brackets low enough. I'll attach a small pic of Gary Wolkwitz's SS Hemi Dart that is that way. But I have seen a couple that are like mine, hanging down with a support brace.




Thanks for the picture. I mocked the rails up tonight and I think I got them positioned in the right postition just to see where everything will sit. I need to lower the rails 1" in order to get the ride height where I want it and also end up centered with the tailpanel crossmember. I didn't want to tilt the rails to achieve this, and lowering them 1 " got me perfectly aligned in the back.

The brackets will hang down 1" and will be reinforced.

thanks,
Greg.


1.50 60Ft. , 10.75@ 127MPH Hauling 3900 LBS.
Re: building back half car [Re: Chargerfan68] #903244
02/04/11 01:55 AM
02/04/11 01:55 AM
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
Chargerfan68 Offline OP
pro stock
Chargerfan68  Offline OP
pro stock

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
Another question:

What would be lighter , using 20 ga. steel OR .040" Aluminum floor/trunk kit for the back half?

Trying to decide which one to go with.

Greg.


1.50 60Ft. , 10.75@ 127MPH Hauling 3900 LBS.
Re: building back half car [Re: MR_P_BODY] #903245
02/04/11 02:10 AM
02/04/11 02:10 AM
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 266
iowa
R
rook440 Offline
enthusiast
rook440  Offline
enthusiast
R

Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 266
iowa
Mr pea body i wish you lived by me I would love to help u build that car ...great project ...I might have to come down to dragweek in topeka just to meet u .............rook

Re: building back half car [Re: rook440] #903246
02/04/11 09:15 PM
02/04/11 09:15 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 976
Woodstock , Georgia
Mopar_racer_99 Offline
super stock
Mopar_racer_99  Offline
super stock

Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 976
Woodstock , Georgia
On the flooring and firewall NHRA allows .024 steel or .032 alum. The weight of .024 (24 guage)steel is 1 lb per ft. 20gauge steel (.0360) is 1.5 lb per ft. .032 (20 guage) alum is .452 lb per ft. and .0403( 18 guage) alum is .569 lb per ft. John


8.72 @ 154.6 ,68 Charger 578ci 440-1s, 3000# w/drvr, 2150 den/alt NA
Re: building back half car [Re: rook440] #903247
02/04/11 11:49 PM
02/04/11 11:49 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
Master
MR_P_BODY  Offline
Master

Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
Quote:

Mr pea body i wish you lived by me I would love to help u build that car ...great project ...I might have to come down to dragweek in topeka just to meet u .............rook




Hopefully it'll be done and on the trip

Re: building back half car [Re: MR_P_BODY] #903248
02/05/11 12:35 AM
02/05/11 12:35 AM
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 6,257
gulfport, ms, west mi
rowin4 Offline
master
rowin4  Offline
master

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 6,257
gulfport, ms, west mi
One thing that wasn't mentioned on the rims you will be purchasing, remember the deeper the back space the harder it will be to remove the tire/rim from your car I would look at around 4" back space. and as for those pictures, My vision of a back half is completely different. Good luck with your project


it's ok to butt heads, just don't do it with a butthead
Re: building back half car [Re: Mopar_racer_99] #903249
02/05/11 01:49 AM
02/05/11 01:49 AM
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
Chargerfan68 Offline OP
pro stock
Chargerfan68  Offline OP
pro stock

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
Quote:

On the flooring and firewall NHRA allows .024 steel or .032 alum. The weight of .024 (24 guage)steel is 1 lb per ft. 20gauge steel (.0360) is 1.5 lb per ft. .032 (20 guage) alum is .452 lb per ft. and .0403( 18 guage) alum is .569 lb per ft. John




Thanks very much for the info John and Rowin'. Much appreciation for the heads up.


Here's another question. What have you guys done as far as mounting the frame connectors. The rear attachment point is at the rear frame rails (set at 26") and it should spread out towards the front to meet where the front rails mount to the x member. But, If I do that, I don't think I will be able to get the torsion bars out. Besides getting rid of the torsion bar setup, what is the solution. No room on the insides of the torsion bar mounts to fasten them (I don't think)??

Thanks,
greg.


1.50 60Ft. , 10.75@ 127MPH Hauling 3900 LBS.
Page 1 of 6 1 2 3 4 5 6






Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1