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RB main girdle ?????? #896428
01/04/11 11:13 PM
01/04/11 11:13 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 294
Minnesota
RockChip Offline OP
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RockChip  Offline OP
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Minnesota
What is the best main girdle setup?

I have seen a few. some that come with caps and some that dont, what is the expected max HP with some of the different girdles, with caps or without?

then I found a set of main caps with the cross bolt ears on them like the Hemi's have that you machine and drill your block to make them fit, anyone have anny experience with them?

I have had verry good luck running a stock 413 Industrial block with just studs runnin sneeze on it but I want to keep the old blocks together for future use.

6397934-Freshend440-4.jpg (291 downloads)
Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: RockChip] #896429
01/05/11 11:49 AM
01/05/11 11:49 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
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BradH Offline
Taking time off to work on my car
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Val-haul-ass... eventually
My opinion is the cap & girdle combination that BCR used to make is the best setup to run on an OEM big block. However, the cost of that + the machine work to install starts pushing the $$$ into aftermarket block territory.

If you still are interested, contact Moparts member "CRE2004" (Mike at Chenoweth Racing) to see if they're ready to start reproducing the BCR stuff, yet.

Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: RockChip] #896430
01/05/11 02:29 PM
01/05/11 02:29 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,305
Bend,OR USA
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Cab_Burge Offline
I Win
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Bend,OR USA
I have built several stock 440 and 400 passenger blocks that I used the Mopar brand Ductile iron main caps with ARP main studs that make over 700 HP, one is over 800 HP with no problems yet I have bought and will continue to buy the better, world or Koleno(Koffels ) aftermarket cast iron block for motors making above 800 HP from now on


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: RockChip] #896431
01/05/11 03:18 PM
01/05/11 03:18 PM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 5,080
organ
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maximum entropy Offline
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any girdle is a significant improvement, imo. the bcr is monstrously strong, but expensive to buy and install. i've had real good results with the chenoweth girdles. cheap, easy insurance.


for what is the good life if not doing things thoughtfully?
Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: maximum entropy] #896432
01/05/11 04:36 PM
01/05/11 04:36 PM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,805
ky hills
thehemikid Offline
top fuel
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ky hills
...Any body know who makes this one.

Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: thehemikid] #896433
01/05/11 04:48 PM
01/05/11 04:48 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 3,675
Akron, Ohio U.S.A.
roadhazard Offline
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Akron, Ohio U.S.A.
Quote:

...Any body know who makes this one.




Looks like a hybrid of BCR main caps and a Chenoweth girdle to me

Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: thehemikid] #896434
01/05/11 08:38 PM
01/05/11 08:38 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,279
bcrproducts Offline
super gas
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That is my original cap and girdle setup BCRproducts that I made sitting on my den table. It is not anyone elses as you can see it is 1/2" plate. I thought it almost looked like art against the red cherry wood. I almost kept it there but the wife wouldn't have it lol lol lol
Mike and Dale at CRE are making them now call them at 309-266-8084



Greg

Quote:

...Any body know who makes this one.



Last edited by bcrproducts; 01/05/11 08:43 PM.
Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: bcrproducts] #896435
01/06/11 01:18 PM
01/06/11 01:18 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,279
bcrproducts Offline
super gas
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Remember it was you guys here on Moparts that made that setup what it is today. It was feedback from at least five shops and at least ten individuals and Tom's great initial insight. I was just the one who put it all together and made it a reality.
It is never a substitite for an aftermarket block but it makes a stock block take at least 40% more than it could without one in my veiw.

Greg

Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: bcrproducts] #896436
01/06/11 02:14 PM
01/06/11 02:14 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 3,675
Akron, Ohio U.S.A.
roadhazard Offline
master
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Akron, Ohio U.S.A.
Sorry guys, should have looked closer at the thickness of the plate

It's nice to know that these will be available from the capable hands of Dale & Mike @ Chenoweth.

Best of luck in your future endevors Greg

Greg

Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: RockChip] #896437
01/07/11 12:09 AM
01/07/11 12:09 AM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 399
SouthEast Michigan
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PETE@BESTMACHINE Offline
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SouthEast Michigan
Save your money and get a aftermarket block. Has anybody used one and stopped block failure because of it?

Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: bcrproducts] #896438
01/07/11 01:46 AM
01/07/11 01:46 AM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,805
ky hills
thehemikid Offline
top fuel
thehemikid  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,805
ky hills
Quote:

Remember it was you guys here on Moparts that made that setup what it is today. It was feedback from at least five shops and at least ten individuals and Tom's great initial insight. I was just the one who put it all together and made it a reality.
It is never a substitite for an aftermarket block but it makes a stock block take at least 40% more than it could without one in my veiw.

Greg




...I understand, & thanks for all the info.

Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: PETE@BESTMACHINE] #896439
01/07/11 03:13 AM
01/07/11 03:13 AM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,279
bcrproducts Offline
super gas
bcrproducts  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,279
I agree there is no substitute for an aftermarket block but this system has its merrits and use. Looking back at sales records I sent about 25% of these to outside the USA sales. These were countries that have existing blocks and no aftermarket that is affordable. I sent these to England Norway Finland New Zealand Australia Germany and Denmark. Oddly enough Finland I had sold at least a dozen to?? There is no doubt that there is a middle ground where this setup finds its place. Hundreds of sales proved that. If they were failing all over the place you would have seen it here on this public forum. But you didn't. I am not saying that there wasn't failures because ther may have been. But I am not aawre of them. Public forums are a dangerous place to play as 100 customers that are happy will tell only 5 people but one unhappy customer will tell 50 people. Pete and the guys build great motors just look here on this forum with all the happy customers.But I also have been selling caps and systems since the early 90's and You would be hard pressed to find anyone on this or any other board say that my products did not live up to their name. In all those years I had one production run go bad and I knew exactly where those caps went and took care of it that week.

Greg
Quote:

Save your money and get a aftermarket block. Has anybody used one and stopped block failure because of it?



Last edited by bcrproducts; 01/07/11 03:15 AM.
Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: bcrproducts] #896440
01/07/11 08:35 AM
01/07/11 08:35 AM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,664
North Sweden
R
RT540 Offline
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North Sweden
Quote:

Remember it was you guys here on Moparts that made that setup what it is today. It was feedback from at least five shops and at least ten individuals and Tom's great initial insight. I was just the one who put it all together and made it a reality.
It is never a substitite for an aftermarket block but it makes a stock block take at least 40% more than it could without one in my veiw.

Greg




Hi Greg, this is all history, and it was a lot of fun to help you out with idea´s and try to make the caps and girdle as solid as possible, we made a pretty good job, and I think that I and Dan had both some good input, along with others here.
The stock block is very thin in many places, and the thickness of the cylinder walls, are an equal big problem in many of the old blocks, causing flex, and in some cases cracks that take in water= hydraulic lock and broken rod.

Tom

Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: RT540] #896441
01/07/11 01:18 PM
01/07/11 01:18 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,279
bcrproducts Offline
super gas
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Posts: 1,279
Tom good hearing from you. You are right we are trying to do the best with what some of us have. The Aftermarket block is just not always possible logistically or financially. There are lots of guys that have a machine shop sponsor and this setup works great for them. There are lots of guys with nitrous street motors that this setup works great on. Then there are us drag race guys. I raced my Cuda with the same OEM block and aluminum main caps for a dozen years with no reline bore. In fact it is still together in my shop albeit I have not raced for several years. That motor went 9.20s at 146 with ported cast iron 915 heads that I still have and went 9.0s at 150 with ported stock size window Eddy's. My goal is to run high 8s with the same motor 452 and run low 8.s with a new 510 inch that I am building with the same port window Eddy's As far as I know there was not a faster OEM stock stroke block OEM head car out there for at least a ten year period. That motor was NA no boosters.

Greg

Last edited by bcrproducts; 01/07/11 03:38 PM.
Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: PETE@BESTMACHINE] #896442
01/07/11 03:43 PM
01/07/11 03:43 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1,131
Thigh-Gap Junction
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@#$%&*! Offline
New user name, Same old jerk!
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Thigh-Gap Junction
Quote:

Save your money and get a aftermarket block. Has anybody used one and stopped block failure because of it?




So you're asking for people to prove a negative? That is, to prove that an engine would have failed without the girdle?
The ability to make the widely available factory blocks take a lot more power is a wonderful thing. Not everyone is interested in a 300# block so they can run in the 8's.

Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: @#$%&*!] #896443
01/07/11 03:51 PM
01/07/11 03:51 PM
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 5,080
organ
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maximum entropy Offline
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organ
Quote:

Quote:

Save your money and get a aftermarket block. Has anybody used one and stopped block failure because of it?




So you're asking for people to prove a negative? That is, to prove that an engine would have failed without the girdle?
The ability to make the widely available factory blocks take a lot more power is a wonderful thing. Not everyone is interested in a 300# block so they can run in the 8's.



trying not to hijack here, but, has ANYONE had a stock block failure when running a girdle?


for what is the good life if not doing things thoughtfully?
Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: maximum entropy] #896444
01/07/11 03:57 PM
01/07/11 03:57 PM
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 614
Michigan
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Get-X Offline
mopar
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Posts: 614
Michigan
Most web failures I've seen were in rb blocks, so anyone wanting to use production stuff should consider a b block as a base. I'd be way more worried about splitting a cylinder than a web failure to be honest.


'65 Belvedere
'68 GTX
'57 Dodge pickup
Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: @#$%&*!] #896445
01/08/11 02:23 PM
01/08/11 02:23 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 399
SouthEast Michigan
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PETE@BESTMACHINE Offline
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SouthEast Michigan
I would like to here from someone that had a high horsepower stock block, the block failed in the main web area, redid a stock block this time with a girdle and and no problem. Yes cylinder wall thickness is a concern and problem. We use aluminum caps and hard block with good results.You need to know the limits of a stock block and know when not use one, thats all I am trying to point out. It does seem like the low decks do better than the RB block in this area.

Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: PETE@BESTMACHINE] #896446
01/08/11 05:19 PM
01/08/11 05:19 PM
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Posts: 6,295
U.S.
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moparniac Offline
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U.S.
Im curious to see a girdled block that did have block failure? just curious as I cant ever recall seeing a post on here or someone posted pics of a split block or anything when it had a girlde on! not saying they aint out there just curious if anyone had it happen


Mopar Performance
Re: RB main girdle ?????? [Re: moparniac] #896447
01/08/11 05:26 PM
01/08/11 05:26 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 209
Finland
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Hessu Offline
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Finland
with steel caps and girdle... and little NOS


6405160-img2030852.jpg (495 downloads)
Last edited by Hessu; 01/08/11 05:33 PM.
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