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Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. #849012
11/08/10 04:32 PM
11/08/10 04:32 PM
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MD
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ADakotaRTGuy Offline OP
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Going with a 4.18 stroke, 4.125 bore with 2.08/1.65 edelbrock heads and about 14psi. CR will be ~9.5:1, Jesel shaft rockers, solid roller cam.

Its going into a Magnum 360 based race block and MPFI computer controlled.

So based on that information, what brand rod would you go with? Trying to tough 9's with this truck and engine combo. If I left anything

Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: ADakotaRTGuy] #849013
11/08/10 05:12 PM
11/08/10 05:12 PM
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Posts: 2,028
Trumbull,CT.
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jim sciortino Offline
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Oliver or Carrillo are good pieces.

Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: jim sciortino] #849014
11/08/10 05:48 PM
11/08/10 05:48 PM
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 216
still waiting on 684
K
Kiner Offline
enthusiast
Kiner  Offline
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K

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Posts: 216
still waiting on 684
Oliver +2

Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: Kiner] #849015
11/08/10 05:53 PM
11/08/10 05:53 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,380
Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda Offline
I Live Here
an8sec70cuda  Offline
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Marion, South Carolina [><]
I have Oliver rods in mine.


CHIP
'70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60
'69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60
'71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75
'73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75
'90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt
'06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: ADakotaRTGuy] #849016
11/08/10 07:14 PM
11/08/10 07:14 PM
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Oregon
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AndyF Offline
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Oregon
If you use a Chevy rod you'll save a bunch of money and will be able to find a higher quality product. You didn't say what rod bearing or pin size that you would be using so it is hard to provide you with any answers. But in general, there are a lot more options in the Chevy sizes than in the Mopar sizes.

Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: AndyF] #849017
11/08/10 07:22 PM
11/08/10 07:22 PM
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 527
alaska,usa
9
9secondsatellite Offline
mopar
9secondsatellite  Offline
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alaska,usa
Quote:

If you use a Chevy rod you'll save a bunch of money and will be able to find a higher quality product. You didn't say what rod bearing or pin size that you would be using so it is hard to provide you with any answers. But in general, there are a lot more options in the Chevy sizes than in the Mopar sizes.



Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: 9secondsatellite] #849018
11/08/10 08:17 PM
11/08/10 08:17 PM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,082
St. Paul , Mn.
tubtar Offline
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tubtar  Offline
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St. Paul , Mn.
Not to jack the thread...........has anyone tried Howards billet rods ?
I like what I read about them , but don't know anyone who is using them.
I have Crower in my motor and they are stout pieces as well.
If I did it again ( I'm sure I will eventually ) I would go with SBC pin and crank dia.
Wayyyyyyyyyyyyy more options.

Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: ADakotaRTGuy] #849019
11/08/10 08:54 PM
11/08/10 08:54 PM
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Posts: 4,210
New York
polyspheric Offline
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Despite the helpful attempts by the vendors to sell you the most expensive rod "pick one capable of delivering power for your final upgrade"), rod choice has very little to do with max HP.
Except for bolt size (and quality) rod failure are almost always in tension, and the most predictable breakage is ATDC on closing throttle.
If your engine has 750 HP with the throttle shut, I'd like to buy it.
The cause is inertia, which is directly proportionate to reciprocating weight (piston, pin, rod small end) and to the square of RPM. More HP does nothing, unless it occurs at higher RPM - in which case it's the RPM that breaks it.

A rod that will take 600 HP @ 8,000 RPM will take 800 HP @ 7,000 just fine.

Stop reading catalogs and magazines, and ask your engine builder.


Boffin Emeritus
Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: polyspheric] #849020
11/08/10 09:31 PM
11/08/10 09:31 PM
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Posts: 2,091
Delray beach, Florida
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Performance Only Offline
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Delray beach, Florida
Quote:

Despite the helpful attempts by the vendors to sell you the most expensive rod "pick one capable of delivering power for your final upgrade"), rod choice has very little to do with max HP.
Except for bolt size (and quality) rod failure are almost always in tension, and the most predictable breakage is ATDC on closing throttle.
If your engine has 750 HP with the throttle shut, I'd like to buy it.
The cause is inertia, which is directly proportionate to reciprocating weight (piston, pin, rod small end) and to the square of RPM. More HP does nothing, unless it occurs at higher RPM - in which case it's the RPM that breaks it.

A rod that will take 600 HP @ 8,000 RPM will take 800 HP @ 7,000 just fine.

Stop reading catalogs and magazines, and ask your engine builder.




i agree with the above and i'll just add a few comments to go with it.
i
ve never seen a connecting rod failure from compressive forces unless there was a problem elsewhere in the engine combo. IMO too many people put too much emphasis on light weight without the knowledge of how to do it properly. i've seen the pin ends of rods pulled apart simply because the wrist pin was too weak and severely flexed/ bent. rod big ends fail for a number of reasons. obviously bearing clearance or lack of oil is the big reason, but that's not the connecting rods fault. not all rods are made the same, regardless of country of origin. the placement of the bolts can be critical to holding the two halves together. the footprint of the mating surfaces is also critical since that becomes a leverage point when the piston is ATDC. seldom will you ever see a beam fail simply because it was over stressed. i won't say it can't happen, but it's rare. another obvious problem is people that don't use a bolt stretch gauge and rely on a torque wrench alone. torque is more a measure of friction than anything else. proper preloading of the fastener is much more important that a torque reading. okay, enough rambling, carry on.


machine shop owner and engine builder
Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: Performance Only] #849021
11/08/10 09:53 PM
11/08/10 09:53 PM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,082
St. Paul , Mn.
tubtar Offline
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tubtar  Offline
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A fella much wiser than myself said " use the best bolt you can afford " , or words to that effect.
based on information gleaned from different magazines and publications ( sorry Poly ) , this would seem to be accurate.
Asking your engine builder is great advice.......so long at the engine builder's fiscal boat isn't sinking and his grasp on the truth gets tenuous.
Don't ask me how I came about feeling that way unless you really need to see a grown man cry.
I'll settle for " ask an engine builder you can trust ".........and I am not afraid to use opinions found on these very pages.
( Thank you , Poly )
At the core of this , and any other part debate is this.........you get what you pay for.
For a " real " motor , I would not waste my time on budget rods.

Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: tubtar] #849022
11/08/10 10:06 PM
11/08/10 10:06 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,200
UK
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602heavy Offline
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Used the Scat 7.1" H beam rod in a 4300lb 605" charger circa 850hp spun to 8K with a shed load of sniff. ..............never could get it to hook up.

EDIT: some interesting reading in this thread.

Last edited by 602heavy; 11/08/10 10:17 PM.
Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: 602heavy] #849023
11/08/10 11:57 PM
11/08/10 11:57 PM
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IN
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ahy Offline
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I know it takes more than HP rating to pick a rod, still its a good guideline. The "good budget" rods like the Eagles I run or Scat or ... seem to be rated and consistantly sucessful up to around 650-700 HP SB and 750-800 HP BB. Your setup is at or above the typical max. If it were my engine, I'd probably be looking at Oliver or Carillo. Another consideration is the blower piston is likley to be heavier than an NA forging.

Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: ADakotaRTGuy] #849024
11/09/10 04:22 AM
11/09/10 04:22 AM
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WA
JD Dart Offline
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Good luck on your quest for the 9's but 750 RWHP won't get your 4000+ lbs beast there. For rods Oliver or Carrillo Is this going to be S/C or T/B for boost. If you do get that much HP good luck getting it to the ground. That's why I move from my truck years back and build the car. But your R/T trucks are cool and how many R/T are in the 9's zero unless it's a tube chassis weighting 2200 lbs. I’m not trying to be cynical just save your coin and put it into something lighter, faster is always more fun. If my car weight 4250 with 825 RWHP it would do 10.06 now with it weighing 2850 it will and does 8.80
Which is more fun? When people see a fast car or truck they like it but if you run 10.00 and spin half way down the track are they impressed NO maybe you because you took something very heavy and made it fast but 10’s compared to 8’s with the same motor


best so far 8.53 @ 158.59 MPH 60'1.240
Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: ADakotaRTGuy] #849025
11/09/10 05:07 AM
11/09/10 05:07 AM
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Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
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Aurora, Colorado
Aluminum, steel, or titanium?
Crower has several Ti rods for about $6,000/set

Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: 451Mopar] #849026
11/09/10 05:49 AM
11/09/10 05:49 AM
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Posts: 3,502
SOUTH JERSEY
HEMIFRED Offline
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Quote:

Aluminum, steel, or titanium?
Crower has several Ti rods for about $6,000/set




steel for you

TITANIUM no way


home of the
Sox and Martin Hemi Duster


Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: HEMIFRED] #849027
11/09/10 10:27 AM
11/09/10 10:27 AM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
B G Racing Offline
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Eighty Four, PA
We have used H-beams rods in high eight and low nine second engines consistently with no issues we just use L-19 or ARP-2000 rod bolts.If you have issues it is usually a faulty rod bolt or caused by other failures not the rod. My 588",Fred's 588",Don's 605" and 555",just to name a few.

Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: B G Racing] #849028
11/09/10 03:01 PM
11/09/10 03:01 PM
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Posts: 193
MD
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ADakotaRTGuy Offline OP
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Yea, the engine builder is recommending oliver rods. Should do well. Thanks for the opinions everyone.

Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: JD Dart] #849029
11/09/10 03:07 PM
11/09/10 03:07 PM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 193
MD
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ADakotaRTGuy Offline OP
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Quote:

Good luck on your quest for the 9's but 750 RWHP won't get your 4000+ lbs beast there. For rods Oliver or Carrillo Is this going to be S/C or T/B for boost. If you do get that much HP good luck getting it to the ground. That's why I move from my truck years back and build the car. But your R/T trucks are cool and how many R/T are in the 9's zero unless it's a tube chassis weighting 2200 lbs. I’m not trying to be cynical just save your coin and put it into something lighter, faster is always more fun. If my car weight 4250 with 825 RWHP it would do 10.06 now with it weighing 2850 it will and does 8.80
Which is more fun? When people see a fast car or truck they like it but if you run 10.00 and spin half way down the track are they impressed NO maybe you because you took something very heavy and made it fast but 10’s compared to 8’s with the same motor




Its going to be turbocharged. Single in bay unit. It actually should weigh about 3700 race weight with me in it. Weighed, 4150 with me in it before a 4 link, A/C removal and no race wheels. Wheels alone will drop about 120 lbs. I was running a supercharger before so that weight should offset. I understand your take, but I don't go racing every weekend, for competition. Just like driving a dodge, I am trying to be different. Not many people say anything when you drive a car into the 9's. Drive a truck into the 10's and many many people will take notice. Check out the video in the sig, I am sure that mustang never thought he would lose that race. Thing still ran 12's.

Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: ADakotaRTGuy] #849030
11/09/10 05:10 PM
11/09/10 05:10 PM
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Posts: 142
Maryland
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Sick 660r Offline
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Maryland
How would H beam compstars hold up in this situation? I would probably be a hair under 3000 lb.


2000 dakota 418 magnum paxton novi 2k T56
Re: Rods for about 750 RWHP in a heavy vehicle. [Re: Sick 660r] #849031
11/10/10 02:57 AM
11/10/10 02:57 AM
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Posts: 193
MD
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ADakotaRTGuy Offline OP
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Ah, welcome traitor.

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