FIVE DAYS on the dyno..... 49 Pulls later I think we have a handle on this thing (although I'm going to put at least 2 more pulls on Monday Morning LOL)

I don't even know where to begin, since Monday seems like a year ago...

So I guess we ran this thing Naturally Aspirated Monday morning...

Basic combination (it's all new)

9" deck 48* Siamese R3 block @ 4.185" bore, Pro Gram Billet 1-4 caps
3.79" Callies Dragonslayer crank
Carrillo 6" X 2.10" H beams with SPS 7/16" bolts
CP pistons -22 CC dish, .043"/043"/3MM Total Seal TNT rings 11.3:1 compression
Trend .215" wall H13 Tool Steel pins
Moroso 8 QT pan/Melling oil pump/ATI Damper
Mezziere 55 GPH external water pump
Comp Solid roller 242/242 @ .050", .737" lift with 1.7:1 T&D rockers, 112 LSA
Bob Dowling CNC W9 heads, 49 CC chambers, 2.15"/1.60" Ferrea Comp Plus valves, Beryllium exhaust seats
PAC springs/Tool steel retainers/trick flow locks
1/2" .188" wall Manton pushrods/Crane Ultra Pro lifters
MP "598" Intake ported by Wilson
950 HP Holley homemade blow through carb

So we ran it with the 950 HP in NA tune, motor liked 31 degrees timing best, chamber efficiency is awesome.

Started off with a Wilson Ported 598 intake off a Craftsman truck... I think we made best #'s of 674 HP/588 TQ with the Wilson intake & a 1" HVH spacer.

So then I had a brand new "420" intake that had a 45 minute port match job & knocked casting flash off the runner dividers... It's a drastically different intake than a 598... Figured it would hurt TQ & maybe make hair more up top. I'll post a graph of the 598 next to the 420 here in a while, but yes it was down to the 598 about 5-10 TQ across the borad & about 10 HP across the board. Did not hurt bottom end as bad as I thought, we pulled both intakes down to 3500 RPM. TQ within 5 ft lbs of each other down there... Surprising.

So after the 2 intake tests I put the 598 Wilson back on...

Tried my Brand new Pro Systems 850 Annular blow through carb, for second time, it did not run worth a carp on dyno a month ago so sent it back to PS & they claimed they tore it apart, found nothing wrong, put it on a motor, put it under light load & it worked "fine" & sent it back... well, we forced it to make a pull, but you would'nt want to see the graphs, it was UGLY & sounded like it was going to vibrate my motor to death, I've never seen one that bad... that carb is JUNK at WOT. I have no idea what is wrong with it, but he will either be refunding my $ on it or I'll be bad mouthing him till day I die. 2 chances to make it run right & it can't make a dyno pull is pretty bad.

So there I was with no blow through carb.... (@ this point my 950 HP was not a blow through carb)

So we ordered a Quickfuel Annular 850 Blow through Next Day air from QF in Kentucky...to have it to run under Boost on Tuesday.

Monday afternoon we bolted up the turbo headers & all the turbo plumbing... Installed my Boost referenced Aerospace fuel system etc. It was like 4:15 PM when we got that all done & my buddy was convinced he could turn my 950HP into a blow though in 10 minutes. So I said have at it...15 Minutes later we had a Blow through 950 sitting under the Extreme Velocity carb hat... So before we left for the day we set low speed RPM @ 4500 on dyno & very slowly got it to WOT @ 4500 under boost, we had about 7 PSI @ 4500 RPM & it was making like 720 FT lbs, the AF was showing real good with the home made carb, it was bit rich in the 10.4 range. We re-jetted secondaries & got into the 10.8's.... let motor sit till Tuesday.

Tuesday AM made first pull under boost, just safe check out pull 4500-6000. 7 PSI... AF looked good.

QF carb showed up @ UPS... Threw it on.... Wow way rich... 9.4:1 Pulled 10 jet sizes out, still stupid rich, 9.8's. I said screw this, lets put my 950 back on.... So at this point I have $2K in blow through carbs laying on floor that don't work worth a.... well you know. Was'nt really thrilled @ that point.

950 Back on, made some pulls to 7100 RPM.... PSI A 4500 little lower in 5 range, peaking in the 7 range. OK. Everything looks good, let's try for more boost........

Yeah that's about when my week started to get worse.....

So we pulled spring out of wastegate, through it on Rimac & tested my 2 other Wastegate springs, found next step up... installed it..... Made pull... 8 PSI, & it was struggling to make 5-6 @ 4500 RPM???? Played with the adjuster on end of gate screwing that in all the way only added about 1 PSI if that. So we thinking it was blowing gate open.... Installed a 1/4" rubber hose for a bleed system with a T in the line with a Holley carb jet for a restrictor... Started with like a 64 jet... then went up to 99 Jet... The removed Jet all together... I dunno what we ahd @ that point, probably like 5 PSI @ 4500, 9 PSI max? & was dropping @ high RPM. What the hell.... Started screwing around putting Compressed air to back side of wastegate, started low @ 5 PSI, did nothing, went up to 15, then 20, then 25.... @ 15 PSI on back side of gate it helped & we made over 1000 HP & had like 12 PSI @ end of pull.... But the more press we put in the gate the worse our starting boost down low was... We were down to like 3 PSI coming on the brake @ 4500 RPM, this was pathetic. TQ was like only 650 @ 4500 @ start of a pull, mid 700's to 800 peak.

We spent nearly the entire day screwing with the damn wastegate, I don'nt know how many times we had it off testing it with shop air, changing valve travel etc. It was ridiculous.....

@ End of Tuesday like 5:30 PM we made bunch of back to back pulls & motor was pretty heat soaked but last pull it made really BAD #'s.... it was way down on TQ coming on brake & power was off etc. @ this point we had 34 pulls on it, with I think 24 of them over 900 HP under boost.... & I thought we had hurt it somehow. I mean it was down to like 480 FT LBS @ 4500!!!!!!!

BTW I ran 24* timing & 112 Sunoco the whole time...

Anyhow.... so we pulled all plugs, did a compression test on all 8 cyls, all plugs looked fine, pulled VC's the valavetrain all looked A-OK. Nothing huffing out breathers etc.. Studied the #'s some more on dyno & some stuff looked "off" especially the water Brake temps were excessively high.... So I said the hell with it, I'm going home, we will make a cold pull first thing Wed AM.

Went in, got oil up to 145 & made cold pull, put up best TQ #'s to date @ like 760 coming on brake @ 4500, 850 peak TQ. I forget what HO was, it was low RPM Check out pull I think 960 HP. Like 8 PSI boost. We found that the dyno had recorded a set of data points as motor was DE-CELLERATING the last pull on Wed hence why water brake temps so high & HP & TQ looked goofy. OK, so motor is fine... Why can't we build boost???

@ this point my buddy decides he feels the exhaust system is just too big, it is laggy down low & it can't drive turbo up top... I said fine, we have always known it is way big since minute I first made the stuff years ago, get the materials & you have the next 2 days to build me a new exhaust cross over pipe in 2.5" & a new turbo inlet in dual 2.5's feeding a singe 3" T6 flange.... that should give the turbo a TON of energy especially since it is being fed with 417 inches that makes a good bit of power NA.... So over course of next 2 days he made me a real sweet looking stainless 2.5" Crossover & new turbo inlet pipe, relocated the wastegate & my wideband....

We installed the new plumbing this Morning.... looks AWESOME... lets build some damn boost finally.... this is "only" an 80 MM Borg Warner S480 with a 1.32 AR exhaust housing we should not be having issues spooling it with a 680 HP 417 inch motor for God's sake! Guess what.... 8 PSI..... started screwing with wastegate & it struggles to build 6 PSI @ 4500.... you've GOT to be pumping me......... What the hell. Fine, the wastegate HAS to be junk.... Lets cap it off completely... So we weld it shut.... 9 PSI?? How can that be....

I'm beyond frustrated.... So I go make phone calls looking for a 1.10 AR exhaust housing... While my buddy becomes convinced the headers are leaking bad enough @ head flange that it is causing the issue. I know we did'nt have them sealed perfect.y as after a while there was signs of exhaust up on valve cover rail etc, & I could hear them leaking, but looking @ it, the flanges were up against head, how much loss could there be with slight header leak? Not enough to not spool a turbo............ surely............... So he unbolts the entire turbo system & pulls heads back & looks in there with a flashlight...................................

Alright, I'll admit it I'm a dumbass & never paid enough attention to fact that a std W9 head exhaust flange is just SLIGHTLY different than a Raised Port W9 exhaust flange in the sealing area.... well guess what, a Schoenfeld W9RP flange on a std W9 head will leak @ the top of the flange... I had originally made these headers & ran them on W9RP heads & have since converted to a smaller Std port W9... Off to the MIG welder we go.... 45 minutes of welding/grinding later, we head over to the Kansas Belt Surfacer & re-surface the flanges perfectly flat...

Some Permatex Hi-temp silicone & few bolts later we re-set wastegate & are ready to make a pull. It's now about 4:45 PM Friday.... Next thing I know, we try to load motor slowly to 4500 WOT & I see 16+ PSI of boost, the warning lights are flashing & TQ #'s are somewhere in the 900+ range @ 4300-4500 RPM... Holy $#@&!!!!!!! So THAT is what a turbo is supposed to spool like! OK...... time to work on wastegate again, now we need to knock all sorts of boost OUT of it... Go back to lightest spring, stock settings, no bleeds... Make pull Solid 8 PSI from 4500-7000. Add Bleed line 65 Jet. 9 PSI. 99 JET 11 PSI. NO JET, screw in wastgate adjuster 1/2 way.... 14 PSI VICTORY!!! This was well after 5 PM.... Took 5 days & nearly 50 dyno pulls but we got that thing to finally make low 14's PSI coming on brake @ 4500 RPM....

@ end of day we did a 3800 RPM low end pull to see what it has down lower, it's around 11 PSI @ 3800 coming on brake. I did'nt want to load it any lower than that, it was heat soaked & was time to call it a day. We made 986 FT LBS @ 14 PSI on last pull of day. I waited to see 1000 TQ, but it was too hot & did'nt like being loaded @ 3800 as much as it does @ 4500. I have no doubt we'll get over 1000 TQ on Monday on the first cold pull starting @ 4500.

HP wise.......... We are maxing the compressor wheel out, this 80 MM turbo (really not very big for 417 inches) just has nothing left. We made 1071 HP best. Bunch of 1040, 1055, 1066 type pulls. But the boost peaks around 14.2 & starts dropping about ~5800 RPM & is only in the 12's @ end of a pull. Compresor is just out of it's efficiency range.... If for some unGodly reason after I run car this year I decide I "need" more top end power for some reason, all I will have to do is have the compressor housing machined for a 86 MM wheel.... 86 MM compressor should not affect the spooling @ all, & will just increase the top end potential into the 1150? range. @ that point you start to reach level where Holley Cathedral style fuel bowls/single needle & seat can not physically flow enough fuel & I'd have to go to the twin seat bowls which are not really recommended for street use. So I'd be better off lightening the car rather than trying to do more power @ that point.

AF on last pull was in the 11.3:1 range with the home made 950HP, I'm really happy with it...

We just want to make couple more pulls on Monday morning, to break the 1000 TQ mark & also test out a different custom made air inlet hat against my Extreme velocity hat...

I'm going to buy a Methanol injection system for in the car, we ran a small home made one on the motor today, but it was non adjustable & the injector nozzle was sized for a 500 HP 4 cylinder, so it was not injecting enough methanol into turbo, it was helping inlet temps some, but not as much as a bigger system will. I do not want additional plumbing of an intercooler, I have enough crap already in this car, so will just do a Meth injection system. Intercooler probably would add at least 50+ HP to this motor as it sits, especially @ higher RPM when the turbo is pumping some serious hot air being inefficient, but I just don't want one, this is not really a drag car, so I don't need every last HP....

I'll post some numbers/graphs here in a minute....

But first here is what it did naturally Aspirated, the 598 Wilson intake is Sweep #2, & the 420 Intake is Sweep #8. Both with 1" HVH spacer & same carb, same timing etc. This thing is no slouch on motor, that was kind of how I wanted it... I put more compression to it than you would typically put in a turbo motor, & it has a real good efficient head. TQ is exactly what I expected, 1.41/INCH is very typical of a good W9 head on a low 11:1 pump gas type deal with mild camshaft. Cam is real small @ .050", but it is a Comp TK lobe, combined with a 1.7 rocker, it's pretty aggressive for being a "small" cam.... I was hoping for at least 640 HP, 678 made me happy. Peak TQ with a 3.79" crank motor in the 4800-4900 range is great for street car, I was real happy with it Monday afternoon NA. This thing would eat my INDY EZ-1 Head 448" alive that is in my Road Runner.... These CNC W9's are nothing "exotic" but they are a good piece... If I had put a more typical NA cam like 268-274 @ .050" in it, & few other more typical "drag" tricks in motor, I'm sure it would have made 770+ HP with ease on pump gas.

Anyhow, here are the NA pulls.... kind of boring when compared to the Turbo pull, but plenty of info to be learned from these sheets.

Here is what it was doing Tuesday with very little boost down low....(4-7 PSi depending on pull) You can see how much TQ varied coming on the brake @ 4500 RPM depending on the pull & how much boost was being out to it. These were showing potential, but just needed to get boost into it...

& here is what happens when you seal your headers up & really lay the wood to it boost wise down low..... I'm not sure how I'm going to get a 3800 LB car with 14.5" Hoosier QTP's to ever hook with 960 FT LBS @ 4000 RPM LOL

We'll see if we can't turn that 986 FT LBS into a 4 digit # on Monday Morning... Torque is FUN.

49 Pulls on it @ this kind of power, I guess the bottom ed is going to stay together. May need a re-build before it ever goes in the car LOL.

TQ curve is pretty flat........................

Not sure what little dip is @ 5900, will have to look more @ Data on Monday, I'm guessing some type of Compressor surge issue as that is about where compressor starts dropping boost off @.

ALOT of work to get dyno setup to accept turbo motor...especially since I have radiator mounted Mezziere water pump & had to bring my entire boost referenced Aeromotive -12 Fuel system & bypass system in to hook up for fuel.... We had plumbing running all over the place. This is pic with the old 3" cross over pipe... I'll try to get a pic of new exhaust on Monday.

Don't take it the wrong way Ryan, but i'm glad to see that even guys like you sometimes have trouble getting new combinations figured out... Everything else you do just seems to make great power, and takes you no effort !

So, the real question is, when and where are we gonna see this thing go down the track?

Car it's going into.....

& just as a side note, I've been stewing on for couple years but..... I was out @ Bob Georges, when he was doing Chassis work on it while back, & some jack nut guy was there working on his 10 sec. Hemi car of some sort & he asked us how big of a Hemi we were going to put into my Bee... & my Buddy was talking to him & laughed & said , no no he's putting a SMALL BLOCK in it.... & the guy scoffed @ him & told him that I was wasting my time/$ building a chassis like that for a SB. My Buddy said, no it's getting a turbo & will make 1000+ HP. The guy thought he was full of BS & scoffed, turned & walked away.... Well Mr 10 Sec 500+" Hemi car, I don't think you would want any piece of this little 417 SMALL BLOCK.

Killer Ryan. I can't imagine that thing going down your road though..

Ryan, aren't turbos fun? LOL Been there, done that, bought the @#%& t-shirt and don't care to wear it again. I'll go with a Procharger next time. I'm looking for a chassis to put the motor in since I can't sell it. Good luck!

Mike Gray

Being a master of the Evelyn Wood speed reading method, I didn't find that to be long at all....

But it was interesting.

Yep that was Long, Detailed, And AWSOME!!!




Id love to built that kinda stuff all day long and get paid for it.

GREAT WORK!!!

Kasey

Nice numbers Ryan, you sure do work your tail off. Now I'd like to hear how your buddy converted your carb to blow-thru in 15 minutes.

Ryan I gotta keep ths one,turbo motors really intrest me.Thanks

EFI Ryan EFI

Jesus- now this is what I call entertainment- a 5 day dyno session and a post that took 3 hours to complete and 15 minutes to read & re-read- you are definitely giving us our moneys worth LOL. Thank for the enlightening and entertaining post(s) it's this kind of stuff that I look forward to seeing when I frequent here.
Anyways- nice results

thanks for that loong and wellwritten dynoreport, i found it very intresting:) keep up the good work