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Re: Is basic (bracket) drag racing on its last leg?
[Re: mopacltd]
#708093
05/26/10 01:52 PM
05/26/10 01:52 PM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,128
Salt Lake City
camastomcat
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,128
Salt Lake City
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Quote:
Payouts!
Sportsman entry $35 with usually 40 to 50 entries and only get $150 to win.
Pro entry $45 with usually 30 entries and only get $250 to win.
Super Pro entry $55 with usually 15 cars and gets $700 to win.
Now how is that fair? Sportsman has to go 6 rounds, Pro goes 5 rounds and the big money goes to Super Pro for only 4 rounds.
Just because the Super Pro guys have more money in their cars? I think this is part of the problem!
That would be correct, we have more money in our cars. And I am not fortunate enough to have all the tracks with the different big $$$ programs to go to like those of you in the midwest, South, and East coast racers do. I didn't spend what I did on my car to compete for $150, and that's OK. It's kinda like playing poker, they have 1-3 games, 2-7 games, and no limit games. All are fun to watch and play. And every particapant is able to play at the level they wish to. But, if not for the big money races, I wouldn't get as excited about it. Cause it's an adrenaline junky's sport. And the more the money, the more the adrenaline, and the more serious you need to be to compete at that level. JMO
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Re: Is basic (bracket) drag racing on its last leg?
[Re: rt66jim]
#708094
05/26/10 02:02 PM
05/26/10 02:02 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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I must say that I really like any event that is at least 2 days long because alot of the fun is in the evening sitting around the bonfire and tipping a couple with your fellow racers and BSing... that lay back part of it makes a BIG difference..... not to mention its less costly in the hauling fees 
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Post deleted by Defbob
[Re: Steve1118]
#708095
05/26/10 02:07 PM
05/26/10 02:07 PM
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Re: Is basic (bracket) drag racing on its last leg?
[Re: rt66jim]
#708096
05/26/10 02:09 PM
05/26/10 02:09 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,931
A shed in England
Tig
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,931
A shed in England
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Quote:
I have heard many racers lament that it's not fun anymore. Part of the answer to that is we don't take the time to make it fun anymore. I look forward to our little local Mopar series. It is a chance to renew friendships. Meet new people and make new friends. Also see new cars. 30 years ago the racing was about getting together having a few  cooking out together. I guess you could say becoming a big racing family. Now some arrive in motor homes and enclosed trailers. We have to take the time personally to make it fun. I can't make you have fun or enjoy it. Each of us must find a way to make it fun for ourselves. Spending more money won't ensure more pleasure. I have reflected on this a long time ago. I would sometimes like to attend more events. But the $$ aren't there to do that. So those I do attend are the one's that offer the most enjoyment. Winning money is about the last consideration. I do because it's more fun than sxx. Jim
There's not a lot of money in UK Drag racing, the vast majority of the sportsman classes are brackets. We've made a lot of friends and every racer and crew in the pits is like part of an extended family. I guess it's like what it was for you US guys a few years ago only on a smaller scale.
For the fans bracket racing is confusing. A friend of ours had been watching drag racing for years but didn't understand bracket racing. Once we told him how it works he really got into it. 
'74 Challenger..9.46 @ 145.9 1/4, 6.001 @ 118 1/8 so far. 4023lb !!! # N/A, Marsh performance 655ci, Indy Maxx, T/R, Indy 600-13 X's, Street legal, pump gas, full interior, Cal-Tracs, mufflers, 3:73's and real 10.5 radials.
9.51 @ 142.4 1/4, 6.003 @ 114 1/8 with our old mule KB, 572-13, 580 wedge.
RHD '68 Barracuda Fastback 323ci street/strip. Best ET 13.88 @ 99.03
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Re: Is basic (bracket) drag racing on its last leg?
[Re: camastomcat]
#708097
05/26/10 02:21 PM
05/26/10 02:21 PM
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Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,506
Az
Crizila
master
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master
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,506
Az
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Quote:
Quote:
Payouts!
Sportsman entry $35 with usually 40 to 50 entries and only get $150 to win.
Pro entry $45 with usually 30 entries and only get $250 to win.
Super Pro entry $55 with usually 15 cars and gets $700 to win.
Now how is that fair? Sportsman has to go 6 rounds, Pro goes 5 rounds and the big money goes to Super Pro for only 4 rounds.
Just because the Super Pro guys have more money in their cars? I think this is part of the problem!
That would be correct, we have more money in our cars. And I am not fortunate enough to have all the tracks with the different big $$$ programs to go to like those of you in the midwest, South, and East coast racers do. I didn't spend what I did on my car to compete for $150, and that's OK. It's kinda like playing poker, they have 1-3 games, 2-7 games, and no limit games. All are fun to watch and play. And every particapant is able to play at the level they wish to. But, if not for the big money races, I wouldn't get as excited about it. Cause it's an adrenaline junky's sport. And the more the money, the more the adrenaline, and the more serious you need to be to compete at that level. JMO
Drag racing - yes, adrenaline junky's sport, but it's not a gamblers sport. Never was. If your in it for the money, your odds are better at the casino.
Fastest 300
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Re: Is basic (bracket) drag racing on its last leg?
#708099
05/26/10 02:30 PM
05/26/10 02:30 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,763
Walton's Mountain, Pa
Steve1118
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,763
Walton's Mountain, Pa
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Eric, you make a lot of good points...and I do see your point.
Pittsburgh is lucky, I don't think the car counts have suffered all that much. But others can't make the same statement.
I think electronics and buy backs are a two edge sword....they have their plusses, but like anything else its a trade off....I know a lot of ex racers that don't like them, and have parked because of them. Take your choice.
Maybe I'm just getting old and cranky. I don't dislike bracket racing the way it is, but I admit to liking it the way it used to be a lot better. I don't see the guys having fun like it was back when I was doing it as spring chicken, and I really think it is having a negative impact. Just an observation. I was just trying to give my thoughts on the original posters questions.
Let's see that Arrow in the winners circle this weekend at PRP.
"Old age and treachery trumps youth and enthusiasm, every time!" East Central Director / Chrysler Power Magazine www.reasbeckracing.webs.com
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Re: Is basic (bracket) drag racing on its last leg?
[Re: Steve1118]
#708101
05/26/10 03:10 PM
05/26/10 03:10 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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I remember way back when I first started racing and there was a TON of classes but you all ran for a trophy but that isnt going to keep the car running... specially in the financial world that we are in now days... we are ALL looking to make a buck... yeah I think I still have some of those OLD trophies and yes it was fun to cruise on Woodward with your class number STILL wrote on the window with your trophy sitting in the passenger seat(if you lost they wiped the window).. and yes I'm sure we all had the idea that we were going to make a living on it just like Garlits BUT that didnt happen 
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Re: Is basic (bracket) drag racing on its last leg?
[Re: camastomcat]
#708102
05/26/10 03:11 PM
05/26/10 03:11 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,763
Walton's Mountain, Pa
Steve1118
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,763
Walton's Mountain, Pa
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Brackets will always be around...no doubt. Electronics and buy backs are here to stay...no doubt about that, no matter how some of us feel. I accept that. You can't put the genie back in the bottle.
The point is that the sport, on a racer's level, has become much more diversified. There are so many programs to offer to so many different types of venues, there is something for everyone. For geezers like Ronnie, Bob, and myself there is the Nostalgia deal (bigger than I ever thought it would be), there is Super Chevy, Chrysler Classic, index, NMCA, Pro Stick, Nostalgia Gassers, you name it. Ther are budget racers in all those venues.
I've kind of gotten off the beaten track (no pun intended), but my original point was that drag strip operators need to be open to these other venues in order to flourish. They need to offer, at least on a part time basis, these other things. I honestly don't believe that a track can flourish only focusing on one venue, including brackets. Not any more, brackets have become too specialized. Those other venues wouldn't be growing the way they are if brackets were the answer for every regular guy racer. Take advantage of them.
Eric, the fifty passes is such a terrific idea I don't know why more don't offer it. Give someone whose never been to the races a freebie to come in and walk around, eat a hot dog, watch the races. You never know what could happen....
"Old age and treachery trumps youth and enthusiasm, every time!" East Central Director / Chrysler Power Magazine www.reasbeckracing.webs.com
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Re: Is basic (bracket) drag racing on its last leg?
[Re: modelmakerinc]
#708103
05/26/10 03:21 PM
05/26/10 03:21 PM
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
Hey all, I am a bit frustrated and sad at what I see happening with drag racing. It seems that the basic weekend warrior have gone away, everyone that I know who used to be big into it has slowly walked away because there is no fun to a weekend of spending $200-300 to bracket race a car.
Everything is high dollar nos or turbo monsters (mustangs) which the regular guy cant compete with because of the rules packages and the ole mighty $$$
I have gotton a bunch of questions about a car I am selling and one of the first questions I get is the cage certified to 8.50 I am 42, I seem to recall that most home built type of race cars were basic cars which ran pro and super pro catagories from the mid nine's to high 10's and did it every other weekend and enjoyed it.
Am I off base? is it just South Florida this is happening? what is your
What kind of car are you selling? Both West Palm and Immokalee are IHRA. You can run mid nines without a certified car. You just can't go over 150 MPH.
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Re: Is basic (bracket) drag racing on its last leg?
[Re: Steve1118]
#708104
05/26/10 03:22 PM
05/26/10 03:22 PM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,128
Salt Lake City
camastomcat
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,128
Salt Lake City
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Quote:
Brackets will always be around...no doubt. Electronics and buy backs are here to stay...no doubt about that, no matter how some of us feel. I accept that. You can't put the genie back in the bottle.
The point is that the sport, on a racer's level, has become much more diversified. There are so many programs to offer to so many different types of venues, there is something for everyone. For geezers like Ronnie, Bob, and myself there is the Nostalgia deal (bigger than I ever thought it would be), there is Super Chevy, Chrysler Classic, index, NMCA, Pro Stick, Nostalgia Gassers, you name it. Ther are budget racers in all those venues.
I've kind of gotten off the beaten track (no pun intended), but my original point was that drag strip operators need to be open to these other venues in order to flourish. They need to offer, at least on a part time basis, these other things. I honestly don't believe that a track can flourish only focusing on one venue, including brackets. Not any more, brackets have become too specialized. Those other venues wouldn't be growing the way they are if brackets were the answer for every regular guy racer. Take advantage of them.
Eric, the fifty passes is such a terrific idea I don't know why more don't offer it. Give someone whose never been to the races a freebie to come in and walk around, eat a hot dog, watch the races. You never know what could happen....
I totally agree with that statement, there track owners are diversifying though. Heck....I heard one of them say how remedial the typical person was that watched the Pinks show, but he had the race at his track. And all the arm drop stuff, I don't understand what the draw is, but people like it and that's what matters. It brings spectators and that's good for the sport. NHRA could learn a thing or 2 from Pinks, and IHRA and their program. And let's not forget the midnight mayham races, or whatever your local track calls it. It brings alot of money in. But don't take what I and lot's of other people like to do and understand. Like the guy said earlier, bracket racing really saved drag racing at one time. OK done spewing.
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Re: Is basic (bracket) drag racing on its last leg?
[Re: 69dart]
#708107
05/26/10 09:19 PM
05/26/10 09:19 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 245
Tucson, Az.
RATKLR
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 245
Tucson, Az.
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Street cars should have a trophy class. Some of the Fun Ford Weekend events had it set up this way. Less cost to enter without a payout. Plus there aren't any buy backs in it so it keeps things moving. If you're not racing for money most of the seasoned Sportsman cars wont be interested. It gives the new guys a chance to go a round or two.
69 RoadRunner, 434 stroker, 4spd, 4.56 dana
65 Belvedere, 440 (8.5 to 1 Compression)509 cam, auto, 4.30 dana, 12.25 @ 111mph
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Re: Is basic (bracket) drag racing on its last leg?
[Re: RATKLR]
#708108
05/26/10 09:51 PM
05/26/10 09:51 PM
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 492
South Jersey, NJ
DragDart360
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 492
South Jersey, NJ
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I'm an old guy that's loved this sport since the sixties. Lifes twists and turns and misunderstanding kept me from participating until the 2005 season then my work schedule dictated I run on Tuesday gamblers night. (Run what you brung, Electronics permitted!) I've went a few rounds beat some elec. cars then we had an unfortunate accident and were out two more years bulding a new car. My biggest expenses are entry fees and travel 50 miles ea. way. The car runs week after week without even being out of the trailer. I could afford to run with most of the guys (Big motor, pro built etc. but I prefer to have other toys!) I don't think the sport is too overpriced at this time. I'm a rookie and have gone rounds with the best. Not enough rounds but I only have 3 years of part time racing under my belt. I'm burned out in another hobby I spent my money on for 30+ years and find racing refreshing, I'm sure that it works the other way arround also. I've been thinking about a 10 sec. engine but think I'll just buy some good rocker arms and run what I have for another year or two. The car is now consistent and I'm cutting decent lights that first payout is just around the corner.  I'm one of the guys that stayed away from bracket racing because I didn't understand it. Once someone took the time to teach me what it really is I took to it like a duck to water. 
70 Dart Swinger, 2850 lbs
SB 408, Bullet roller 264/268 @50 .636 SSDS stage 2 Edelbrock heads, 1 7/8 Headmans, 1050 dominator by Dom, 9.867 @ 133
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Re: Is basic (bracket) drag racing on its last leg?
[Re: Steve1118]
#708109
05/26/10 10:03 PM
05/26/10 10:03 PM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,460
Florida STAYcation
dOOc
The village idiot's idiot
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The village idiot's idiot
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,460
Florida STAYcation
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Quote:
Brackets will always be around...no doubt. Electronics and buy backs are here to stay...no doubt about that, no matter how some of us feel. I accept that. You can't put the genie back in the bottle.
I agree ...BROOM the E-stuff .. but why get-rid of buy-backs ? ...
Genie-in-the-bottle? ... if THE RACERS say NO to E ...and just enter no-box classes .. it is gone.
Am I missing something?
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Re: Is basic (bracket) drag racing on its last leg?
[Re: dOOc]
#708110
05/26/10 10:15 PM
05/26/10 10:15 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
Master
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Master
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
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Quote:
Quote:
Brackets will always be around...no doubt. Electronics and buy backs are here to stay...no doubt about that, no matter how some of us feel. I accept that. You can't put the genie back in the bottle.
I agree ...BROOM the E-stuff .. but why get-rid of buy-backs ? ...
Genie-in-the-bottle? ... if THE RACERS say NO to E ...and just enter no-box classes .. it is gone.
Am I missing something?
There already is a NO BOX... enter in that one if
you want... why kill another class
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383man
[Re: RATKLR]
#708111
05/26/10 10:41 PM
05/26/10 10:41 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421
Balt. Md
383man
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421
Balt. Md
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I used to bracket race my old 66 Dart with a 340 fourspeed years ago. What I liked about bracket racing was it gave even the lowest buck person a class to race in. But I do agree that once electronics came into bracket racing it wasn't as much fun. But I am also an old Geezer now as I will be 54 in July and I enjoy the NSS racing alot as thats the cars I grew up with and raced as a teenager. I still like racing but I just like to put a few passes on my street car sometimes at the T & T days. I also really enjoy special events like some of the all Mopar races. But thats me as I like it to be fun and I dont want to race for points and all that as I see to many ticked off people when I am one who just loves the Nostalgic racing and having fun while doing it. I really want to see bracket racing stay around as it has it's place in drag racing. Ron
Last edited by 383man; 05/26/10 10:47 PM.
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Re: 383man
[Re: 383man]
#708112
05/26/10 11:41 PM
05/26/10 11:41 PM
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 6,257
gulfport, ms, west mi
rowin4
master
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master
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 6,257
gulfport, ms, west mi
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I started racing back in 68, talk about a old geezer. Class racing was the only game in town and back then as now the guy with the most bucks in class racing did win the race. If you had a edelbrock intake and holley carb you were put into modified production, or if you didn't have a front bumper you were in gas class and every body cheated. Oh, it's a 283 sure. I believe if it wasn't for bracket racing there wouldn't be any small tracks just big pro tracks to run big buck pro races. Big money to race, I question that. Down on the gulf coast the test and tune is on wednesday night, the track gets about 80-100+ cars $20. bucks, 800 -1200 spectators $7.00 bucks this year, raised from $5.00 . Three hour of tnt then a race , 4 brackets, motorcycles, trucks, 11.50 & slower and and 11.49 and faster bracket , box and no box together . Now the most interesting part, there are a number of 7 second door slammers and rails in this group and the payout is $50.00 to win, yes $50.00. Now each month there is a big race with a couple hundred fast cars running,$15.00 spectator fee, maybe 50 people show up to watch. Is it the $10. extra ? I think most people only have so much money to spend right now and racing just isn't in that picture, as a racer or spectator.
it's ok to butt heads, just don't do it with a butthead
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