Looking for 440 build suggestions
#703441
05/20/10 03:27 PM
05/20/10 03:27 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,764 near Port Huron, MI
Paul
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,764
near Port Huron, MI
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I'd like to upgrade my 69 Coronet convertible from a worn out 318 to a mild 440.
I have several core 440's sitting around to choose from, all are steel crank motors. The likely candidate would probably be either a mid 70s motor home engine with 452 heads or 68 350hp engine with 906 heads and stock 4bbl intake. I also have a few CH4B intakes and/or SixPack setups to choose from. If I go with a 4bbl, I would need a carb recommendation. The car has a Ramcharger hood and I have a correct 69 air cleaner assembly or 1970 6pk air cleaner assemblies I plan to use as well. I also expect a complete rebuild is in order, new pistons, rings, cam/lifters, cylinder head rebuilt/upgraded, etc.
Below are my desires/expectations/vehicle specs in no particular order.
The car is a weekend cruiser, I live 20 or more miles from everything, so it has to have good road manners both city/highway.
Must run on pump gas, premium or lower. Must make good power at low rpm Will have an auto trans, would like to convert to an overdrive trans at some point. Rear end is an 8.75" with 2.94 sure grip, will increase gear size if/when an overdrive trans gets added. Would like the power band to be at lower range, again, it's a driver, not a race car. It needs to 'look' stock. It will have 69 HP exhaust manifolds, I'm thinking 2.5" h-pipe into Hemi mufflers.
The car has air conditioning, I would like to retain that. I have a shorty sanden ac compressor and big block brackets that clears the Ramcharger air cleaner base.
I have some ideas already, but I'm open to all suggestions. I don't want to spend a fortune, but looking for some fresh ideas at the same time.
So if it were your car, what would your engine build include?
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Re: Looking for 440 build suggestions
[Re: Paul]
#703447
05/20/10 09:46 PM
05/20/10 09:46 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck
Not enough dumb comments...yet
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Not enough dumb comments...yet
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
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Quote:
interesting cam choice, seems to contradict my goal of low rpm power.
Now, maybe a modern grind with high lift/short duration?
528 is a mellow cam. has plenty of down low power and with the 6-pack it will pull real hard mid-range. Remember it's only about a 500 lift cam once you set the lash and it has a nice 112 center line. If you are dead set on the 2.94's maybe you can call and have a custom cam made.
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Re: Looking for 440 build suggestions
[Re: Mr.Yuck]
#703450
05/21/10 12:18 AM
05/21/10 12:18 AM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 21,318 Manitoba, Canada
DaytonaTurbo
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 21,318
Manitoba, Canada
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Quote:
Quote:
interesting cam choice, seems to contradict my goal of low rpm power.
Now, maybe a modern grind with high lift/short duration?
528 is a mellow cam. has plenty of down low power and with the 6-pack it will pull real hard mid-range. Remember it's only about a 500 lift cam once you set the lash and it has a nice 112 center line. If you are dead set on the 2.94's maybe you can call and have a custom cam made.
The 528 isn't a super aggressive cam. It's a good mild street cam. If you have some decent compression it will have perfect driveability. AndyF has dyno proven the MP528 solid to be THE cam if you're dead set on running HP manifolds. The MP528 just works great with the hp manifolds. A little more $ because you have to spring for the adjustable valvetrain though. The lunati voodoo 60303 would be a good alternative if you want to save some $ and run stock rockers/pushrods and have similar performance characteristics.
For pistons/rods I would go with a set of reconditioned LY rods and set of KB237 pistons. They're a good choice because they'll give you acceptable compression with 906/452 heads yet provide a good base if you ever choose to do a set of aluminum heads in the future. Do the edelbrock rpm or 440source stealth heads now if you can afford it, later if you need to squeeze the budget right now.
With stock heads, the ch4b would be a good intake. Upgrade to the edelbrock rpm if you ever do aluminum heads because they will take advantage of the extra flow where stock heads don't flow that much.
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Re: Looking for 440 build suggestions
[Re: Paul]
#703454
05/21/10 10:36 AM
05/21/10 10:36 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck
Not enough dumb comments...yet
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Not enough dumb comments...yet
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
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Quote:
What do you think of the KB236? I'd think the quench pad with the open chamber head could help combustion efficiency.
The calculated CR assuming that a 906 head has a 90cc chamber volume puts it just under 10:1 at .030 overbore. I'm speculating that a thick head gasket would probably get that down to 9.5 to 9.75:1 cr.
I'd hope that I would be just below the upper limits of running pump 93 without detonation problems.
This motor (440-6 w/ 528 solid) was around 10.5:1 (maybe more) w/ 516 heads, ran fine at 36* total and 93.
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Re: Looking for 440 build suggestions
[Re: Paul]
#703457
05/21/10 11:27 AM
05/21/10 11:27 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck
Not enough dumb comments...yet
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Not enough dumb comments...yet
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
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Quote:
Are 516s are the small valve closed chamber heads?
They are from the factory. Mine have 2.14/1.81 valves, have been as ported as you can, flow really good. Somebody dumped a ton into them. I'm guessing before alminums were made cheap. I can never recall the flow numbers but they'll do just fine for my application. Something like 270-190 @ 500.
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Re: Looking for 440 build suggestions
[Re: flatius]
#703460
06/18/10 12:05 PM
06/18/10 12:05 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,915 A collage of whims
topside
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,915
A collage of whims
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For a torque-motor that looks stock, I'd be inclined towards more stroke if budget allows. Carb would be an AVS, either a stock 440 w/AC carb or a newer Edelbrock, 750-800 CFM would be plenty. Stock intake or aluminum dual-plane that won't affect height. Deck the block for piston height about .006 in the hole, a good quench piston (Ross or JE). Best ARP rod fasteners. Engle split-pattern hydro cam (I run their 224/234@.050 - don't recall lift, around .510/.524 - in my 446", which sounds pretty stout but has good manners. I also run 1.6 Harland Sharp rockers. A/C will not tolerate much duration or overlap when idling. Stealth heads would be cool, but if you're stuck with iron, polish the chambers a bit and clean up the bowls. Gasket-match the intake side (heads, not intake). No more than 9.0:1 with iron heads, 10.0 with aluminum, so you can run some meaningful vac advance for MPG. On modern gas, that's going to be an issue even in the best of circumstances. A windage tray in the pan. Your thinking on the exhaust is plenty adequate. As cubic inches increase, the motor will tolerate more cam timing, but for steet motors I've had better results increasing lift rather than duration. Duration & overlap will bleed off compression ratio, so it would be wise to work with the CR & quench issues before committing to a cam. The FelPro 1009 gasket's a bit thick @ .039 compressed but they've been bulletproff for me even at 13.0:1.
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