Re: Help! Duster electrical problems
[Re: RustyDuster]
#697136
05/13/10 03:18 PM
05/13/10 03:18 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,041
Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
Circle Track
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Circle Track
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,041
Lincoln Nebraska
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Might check your idling charging voltages (might still be voltage drops somewhere) and would it be practical for you to raise your idle speed a bit?
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Help! Duster electrical problems
[Re: RapidRobert]
#697137
05/13/10 03:41 PM
05/13/10 03:41 PM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 338
SoCal
RustyDuster
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Quote:
Might check your idling charging voltages (might still be voltage drops somewhere) and would it be practical for you to raise your idle speed a bit?
I'm already at the maximum idle speed though, any more and Ill damage the transmission bands. checking the charging voltage now..
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Re: Help! Duster electrical problems
[Re: Bdrainy]
#697141
05/13/10 05:07 PM
05/13/10 05:07 PM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 338
SoCal
RustyDuster
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Quote:
What is the condition of your battery? Could it be going bad?
Are you using a stock style alternator? I don't think the stock alternators can keep up with everything (headlights, brake lights, blinkers, AC blower) at idle and the systems relies on the battery somewhat until the RPMS increase.
Does the dimming of the lights etc... go away has soon as you start driving and the RPM's are up to cruising speed?
The battery should be OK. It does have the stock alternator however. It doesn't seem that my other duster does this though. What other alternators are available and what mods are necesary to use them?
The problem does seem to go away at cruising speed although if you were running ac and wipers and headlights it might be severe enough to be noticed even at cruising speeds.
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Re: Help! Duster electrical problems
[Re: RustyDuster]
#697143
05/13/10 05:30 PM
05/13/10 05:30 PM
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 512
Sacramento, CA
Bdrainy
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 512
Sacramento, CA
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Quote:
Quote:
What is the condition of your battery? Could it be going bad?
Are you using a stock style alternator? I don't think the stock alternators can keep up with everything (headlights, brake lights, blinkers, AC blower) at idle and the systems relies on the battery somewhat until the RPMS increase.
Does the dimming of the lights etc... go away has soon as you start driving and the RPM's are up to cruising speed?
The battery should be OK. It does have the stock alternator however. It doesn't seem that my other duster does this though. What other alternators are available and what mods are necesary to use them?
The problem does seem to go away at cruising speed although if you were running ac and wipers and headlights it might be severe enough to be noticed even at cruising speeds.
I did a few things to help with the "dimming lights" at idle. add a relay for the headlights, did the mad electrical wiring upgrade, and ultimately put on a Denso 60 amp alternator from a late 80's toyota 4 runner. The denso unit is great and puts out a lot of amps at idle. Look in the archives and it gives all the info on how to do it. Really simple upgrade!
But I would try and figure what your issue is before buying new parts and changing the system.
It wouldn't hurt to have the battery checked out, but it sounds kinda normal for the lights to dim at idle if you are running the headlights, blinkers, wipers, and AC blower motor....?
But I don't know how much they are dimming....Does the car die at all? or does it keep running fine?
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Re: Help! Duster electrical problems
[Re: stumpy]
#697144
05/13/10 05:34 PM
05/13/10 05:34 PM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 338
SoCal
RustyDuster
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Quote:
You aren't going to break any trans bands with an idle at 1000. I idle my 408 at 1200 with no problems going into gear.
This is a slant six / 904. Any higher idle speed and the thing jumps when put into gear.
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Re: Help! Duster electrical problems
[Re: Bdrainy]
#697145
05/13/10 05:38 PM
05/13/10 05:38 PM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 338
SoCal
RustyDuster
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
What is the condition of your battery? Could it be going bad?
Are you using a stock style alternator? I don't think the stock alternators can keep up with everything (headlights, brake lights, blinkers, AC blower) at idle and the systems relies on the battery somewhat until the RPMS increase.
Does the dimming of the lights etc... go away has soon as you start driving and the RPM's are up to cruising speed?
The battery should be OK. It does have the stock alternator however. It doesn't seem that my other duster does this though. What other alternators are available and what mods are necesary to use them?
The problem does seem to go away at cruising speed although if you were running ac and wipers and headlights it might be severe enough to be noticed even at cruising speeds.
I did a few things to help with the "dimming lights" at idle. add a relay for the headlights, did the mad electrical wiring upgrade, and ultimately put on a Denso 60 amp alternator from a late 80's toyota 4 runner. The denso unit is great and puts out a lot of amps at idle. Look in the archives and it gives all the info on how to do it. Really simple upgrade!
But I would try and figure what your issue is before buying new parts and changing the system.
It wouldn't hurt to have the battery checked out, but it sounds kinda normal for the lights to dim at idle if you are running the headlights, blinkers, wipers, and AC blower motor....?
But I don't know how much they are dimming....Does the car die at all? or does it keep running fine?
Pardon my ignorance, but what is the "mad" electrical wire upgrade? I'll check out he archives for the alternator upgrade. The head lights actually dim significantly if you just use the turn signal. I was saying that with additional things operating, you would even notice it at cruising rpm. With just the headlights and blinker at idle, it may almost want to die. Seems like it didn't do this as bad ten years ago when it was my daily driver..
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Re: Help! Duster electrical problems
[Re: RustyDuster]
#697146
05/13/10 05:53 PM
05/13/10 05:53 PM
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 512
Sacramento, CA
Bdrainy
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 512
Sacramento, CA
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Here is the MAD electrical wiring upgrade: http://www.madelectrical.com/electricaltech/amp-gauges.shtmlIt bypasses the AMP meter and you run a wire from the alternator to the big stud on the starter relay. I re read some of your posts and you say that it reads 12.5 volts with the headlights on? (so I assume that you have a voltmeter hooked up also in the car?) What is your voltage reading when the headlights are off? (should be around 14.2 or so) If you have replaced all the wiring, etc.. I would assume that you don't have a voltage drop anywhere (but you still very well could) I keep coming back to a bad battery or alternator. Either the battery is on its way out and cant keep up with the slight discharge at idle or your alternator is not putting out enough AMPs to keep up. (either due to RPM's or its going bad) But since you have replace the alternator I would look at the battery. You said you have another duster that isn't doing this? Try swapping the battery or taking your battery to an autoparts store to have it checked out. Its free and easy to swap the battery out of your other car.
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Re: Help! Duster electrical problems
[Re: Bdrainy]
#697147
05/13/10 06:30 PM
05/13/10 06:30 PM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 338
SoCal
RustyDuster
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Quote:
Here is the MAD electrical wiring upgrade:
http://www.madelectrical.com/electricaltech/amp-gauges.shtml
It bypasses the AMP meter and you run a wire from the alternator to the big stud on the starter relay.
I re read some of your posts and you say that it reads 12.5 volts with the headlights on? (so I assume that you have a voltmeter hooked up also in the car?) What is your voltage reading when the headlights are off? (should be around 14.2 or so)
If you have replaced all the wiring, etc.. I would assume that you don't have a voltage drop anywhere (but you still very well could) I keep coming back to a bad battery or alternator.
Either the battery is on its way out and cant keep up with the slight discharge at idle or your alternator is not putting out enough AMPs to keep up. (either due to RPM's or its going bad)
But since you have replace the alternator I would look at the battery. You said you have another duster that isn't doing this? Try swapping the battery or taking your battery to an autoparts store to have it checked out.
Its free and easy to swap the battery out of your other car.
Its 12.5 with headlights on or off. It has a constant voltage regulator. I have a voltmeter that I hook up under the engine bay to determine this. The battery has been swapped and theres no change. The car a 73 by the way, and already has a 60A alternator. Do you have a link to the alternator upgrade article? The search button in the tech archives isn't working for me. What amperages can the alternator be upgraded to? Is it possible that its that fuseable link? I cleaned it.
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Re: Help! Duster electrical problems
[Re: RustyDuster]
#697148
05/13/10 06:43 PM
05/13/10 06:43 PM
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 512
Sacramento, CA
Bdrainy
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 512
Sacramento, CA
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Its 12.5 with headlights on or off. It has a constant voltage regulator. I have a voltmeter that I hook up under the engine bay to determine this. The battery has been swapped and theres no change. The car a 73 by the way, and already has a 60A alternator. Do you have a link to the alternator upgrade article? The search button in the tech archives isn't working for me. What amperages can the alternator be upgraded to? Is it possible that its that fuseable link? I cleaned it.
12.5 seems low...I think the constant output VR is supposed to be a 13.5...not 100% sure though. Your checking the voltage at the battery? Before I made the switch to the Denso (internally regulated) I had a constant output VR on there and issues with it. The car would charge for a while and then stop charging..my volt meter would drop to 12 exactly. On a 20 minute drive it did that about 5 times. Switch back to a stock VR and my problems went away. Maybe try a different VR....? Not sure about the fusable link causing it...I wouldn't think so but I'm not sure.
Sounds like you have a voltage drop somewhere...i would start checking connections and make sure your grounds are good.
http://www.moparts.org/Tech/Archive/elec/34.html
There is the link to the Denso alternator swap. These Denso alternators put out more amps at idle than our originals do, even if the peak (60amp) is the same.
Sorry I couldn't be of more help.
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Re: Help! Duster electrical problems
[Re: Bdrainy]
#697149
05/13/10 08:51 PM
05/13/10 08:51 PM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 338
SoCal
RustyDuster
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SoCal
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Quote:
Its 12.5 with headlights on or off. It has a constant voltage regulator. I have a voltmeter that I hook up under the engine bay to determine this. The battery has been swapped and theres no change. The car a 73 by the way, and already has a 60A alternator. Do you have a link to the alternator upgrade article? The search button in the tech archives isn't working for me. What amperages can the alternator be upgraded to? Is it possible that its that fuseable link? I cleaned it.
12.5 seems low...I think the constant output VR is supposed to be a 13.5...not 100% sure though. Your checking the voltage at the battery? Before I made the switch to the Denso (internally regulated) I had a constant output VR on there and issues with it. The car would charge for a while and then stop charging..my volt meter would drop to 12 exactly. On a 20 minute drive it did that about 5 times. Switch back to a stock VR and my problems went away. Maybe try a different VR....? Not sure about the fusable link causing it...I wouldn't think so but I'm not sure.
Sounds like you have a voltage drop somewhere...i would start checking connections and make sure your grounds are good.
http://www.moparts.org/Tech/Archive/elec/34.html
There is the link to the Denso alternator swap. These Denso alternators put out more amps at idle than our originals do, even if the peak (60amp) is the same.
Sorry I couldn't be of more help.
Thanks for the link. One more question, do you think that the voltage drop could be in the ammeter itself? Looks like I have some work ahead of me. 
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Re: Help! Duster electrical problems
[Re: RustyDuster]
#697151
05/13/10 09:13 PM
05/13/10 09:13 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,001
s. e. pa.
calrobb2000
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,001
s. e. pa.
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hi 12.5 is too low 1 try a different vr , should be app 13.5 . eather alt is not putting out enough or vr is not doing its job ! autozone vr i have puts out 13.8 !
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