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Copper head gaskets, sealing issues
#660909
04/04/10 09:09 PM
04/04/10 09:09 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,918
Akron, Ohio
ProSport
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I Live Here
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OP
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Posts: 17,918
Akron, Ohio
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Last year I used the Summit .043 thick copper head gaskets. I used the Permatex 'Right Stuff' around the water holes, I remember someone here mentioning that it may not seal with the right stuff. Well, it didn't. The block has o-rings in it but no o-rings or receiver grooves in the heads. The Summit copper gaskets had a nice consistent ring around them from the o-rings in the block, but the right stuff sealer looked like it never hardened or sealed. Water would kinda lightly run down the sides of my block after a run down the track.
So should I try these Summit gaskets($80 a pair) again with a different sealer or just buy the SCE Titan copper gaskets that have the correct sealer around the water holes already?
The Titans are $127 a pair and require either the block or head to be o-ringed, it does not say they both have to be o-ringed.
The SCE Titans are out of my price range and don't require any o-rings since the o-rings are embedded in the gasket itself.
So does anyone run the regular Titans? Do they seal?
1970 Challenger, all aluminum 528 Hemi, HDK suspension, Tremec 5 speed manual
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Re: Copper head gaskets, sealing issues
[Re: moparguy7074]
#660912
04/04/10 09:34 PM
04/04/10 09:34 PM
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 8,647
ELYRIA,OH
blownzoom440
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 8,647
ELYRIA,OH
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Quote:
Bob,
What my brother did with his 588" in his Polara that was o-ringed was use the Permatex Ultra Copper in a spray can. He would spray on a half dozen coats or more of the stuff on each side, letting each coat tack up before spraying the next. Never had a leak problem, and this was with regular copper gaskets. 
that is a lot of spray silicone. 
Bob i hope thing get fixed for you. 
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Re: Copper head gaskets, sealing issues
[Re: racerAL]
#660914
04/04/10 10:16 PM
04/04/10 10:16 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,918
Akron, Ohio
ProSport
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Akron, Ohio
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So the Titans do not seal right out of the package??   I've heard mixed reports about the copper spray the last couple years. It's alot of work to tear this thing apart so I need to get this right. Don't have much spare time these days either. I'm also afraid to just try another sealer, what if it don't work. Let's hear some more ideas. I'm about to say screw it and just put some composition MP #4529455's on the motor. I used those on my 451 with no problems.
1970 Challenger, all aluminum 528 Hemi, HDK suspension, Tremec 5 speed manual
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Re: Copper head gaskets, sealing issues
[Re: ProSport]
#660917
04/04/10 11:22 PM
04/04/10 11:22 PM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 21
Midwest
tony1966
member
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member
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 21
Midwest
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I had similar issues. Orings in head, no groove in block. Water passages didn't want to seal, so i used 100% RTV silicone (like you get at Homedepot). Works great, but you have to watch where you put it. Not too thick and remember the shape of the passages in the block are not the same as the gasket and those are not the same shape as those in the head. BTW, I tried the SCE gaskets, and they leaked.  the thickness of the bead of sealer they put on really wasn't very thick and my heads are not that smooth. After one use the sealant was gone anyway.  Tony
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Post deleted by Defbob
[Re: ProSport]
#660920
04/05/10 08:29 AM
04/05/10 08:29 AM
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Re: Copper head gaskets, sealing issues
#660921
04/05/10 09:17 AM
04/05/10 09:17 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,048
Shelby Twp. Mi
HardcoreB
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,048
Shelby Twp. Mi
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Quote:
If you have an o-ringed block, and no receiver grooves in the heads, that's your problem right there. Because of the exposed wire, your heads will be lifted up from the deck. You need receiver grooves with o-rings.
Not completely true...That is why I asked how tall the o-ring stands. Higher end Fel-Pros have an o-ring integrated into the gasket (fire ring) and they don't critically bridge the head from the block.
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Re: Copper head gaskets, sealing issues
[Re: HardcoreB]
#660922
04/05/10 12:48 PM
04/05/10 12:48 PM
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 365
Motor City
Shaker223
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 365
Motor City
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Quote:
Quote:
If you have an o-ringed block, and no receiver grooves in the heads, that's your problem right there. Because of the exposed wire, your heads will be lifted up from the deck. You need receiver grooves with o-rings.
Not completely true...That is why I asked how tall the o-ring stands. Higher end Fel-Pros have an o-ring integrated into the gasket (fire ring) and they don't critically bridge the head from the block.
Agreed. My copper gasket does not leak with no receiver groves in the head. I believe the o-ring should stick up about .010".
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Post deleted by Defbob
[Re: HardcoreB]
#660925
04/05/10 04:25 PM
04/05/10 04:25 PM
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Anonymous
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Re: Copper head gaskets, sealing issues
[Re: joez]
#660927
04/08/10 07:33 PM
04/08/10 07:33 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,918
Akron, Ohio
ProSport
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The man, the legend..................JoeZ! That sounds like a trick setup Joe, but I just want to find a decent gasket that I can throw on there and get running w/o having any machine work done. My Summit gaskets probably would have been fine with some Moroso ceramic seal but since the motor is out for the oil pan I figured I'd do it right. I'll measure my o-ring height this weekend but it doesn't stick out enough to cause problems, it left a very small indentation in the copper gaskets. I'll lay a flat edge across them this weekend and slide a feeler gauge in there. SCE says either the heads or the block need to be o-ringed, not both, but both is probably better I would think. I was all excited about the SCE Titans with the sealer and they are .032 thick which would help my compression since the piston is .016 in the hole. I wonder if I could run a bead of better sealer alongside their sealer  , or just get the ones with no sealer. Or aneal mine.  I'm still confused. I'd just like to locate some MP 4529455's!!! 
1970 Challenger, all aluminum 528 Hemi, HDK suspension, Tremec 5 speed manual
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Re: Copper head gaskets, sealing issues
[Re: ProSport]
#660928
04/08/10 08:01 PM
04/08/10 08:01 PM
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,090
north cakalaky
instigator
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,090
north cakalaky
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This is what I have always put on my coppers...paint in on all 4 surfaces, not just around oil/water holes but the whole surface...torque down once, and never leaked an ounce of water or oil at 25 psi boost.
65 Barracuda
All aluminum Indy HEMI with some boost!
COMING TO A TRACK NEAR YOU!
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thats what i did..i'm using the SCE Titans...i originally installed them dry, with fresh machine shop deck surfaces, and they leaked. 
..ended up using a scotch bright to clean off the embossed o'ring around the water holes..then used the Permatex stuff...hasn't leaked since.
that leaked like crazy sitting still on the dyno 
You could try some Aluminaseal stop leak first 
