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I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened belts #56669
04/18/08 01:59 PM
04/18/08 01:59 PM
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Valencia, España
NachoRT74 Offline OP
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what you read. All troubleshooting guides talks about when you ARE NOT able to crank engine even with fastened seatbelts, but no one talks about what is wrong if I'm able to crank the engine with unfastened seatbelts.


what could it be wrong ?


With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela
Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: NachoRT74] #56670
04/18/08 02:10 PM
04/18/08 02:10 PM
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Rancho Cucamonga, CA
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What Vehicle, What Year, and why do you care?

I disabled my Seat-Buzzer as soon as I could figure out how to do it.

That said, I always wear my Seat-Belt (just don't like the "Nanny" buzzer.)

Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: D_C] #56671
04/18/08 02:13 PM
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EDIT:Ok he's serious... I'll retract my smart azz comment. Still don't understand why anyone would want that system to function

Get the 12v tester out and start at one end of the wiring and work to the other.

Last edited by R70RUNNER; 04/18/08 03:14 PM.

Current cars: 2000 Dak Quad Cab, 2012 Challenger,1970 Road Runner, 1994 Firehawk


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Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: D_C] #56672
04/18/08 02:23 PM
04/18/08 02:23 PM
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NachoRT74 Offline OP
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74 Charger

I do care because:

-No one thief will fasten the seatbelt and never wonder what does happen.

-I like to have everything working as must be.

-I usually fights with passengers ( usually women ) to carry on fastened seatbelts, so CAR WON'T START UNTILL FASTEN... If she wants to ride, has to fasten it.


With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela
Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: NachoRT74] #56673
04/18/08 02:34 PM
04/18/08 02:34 PM
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pull up a wiring diagram, and look for the interlock. I'd guess that someone has bypassed the circuit next to the belt, or where they terminate.

Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: RodStRace] #56674
04/18/08 02:47 PM
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NachoRT74 Offline OP
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I already have lot of info that I already posted on 3rd gen charger website by myself... and maybe there some language stuff that I'm not getting.

Just added on to my car because my car assemblied in Venezuela didn't came with that stuff. Was working at first instance but not anymore


With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela
Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened belts [Re: NachoRT74] #56675
04/18/08 02:47 PM
04/18/08 02:47 PM
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Off the top of my head; It may depend on the build date. The seatbelt interlock was immediately unpopular, and Ma discontinued the feature. Yours may be just fine as it is...

(edit) Just read your reply. Nevermind. Export and SoAm market could have been a whole nother ball of wax.

Last edited by Chief-Kikerdown; 04/18/08 02:52 PM.
Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened belts [Re: A38s!] #56676
04/18/08 02:51 PM
04/18/08 02:51 PM

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Some ramblings from the past.

1 Be a man in your own car. If passengers won't buckle up, then don't start the car.

2 If you've ever suffered through a carjacking, you'll wish you COULD start the car in a hurry

3 There are much better anti-theft measures, namely, a hidden switch that breaks the wiring or shuts off the fuel pump

Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened belts [Re: A38s!] #56677
04/18/08 02:56 PM
04/18/08 02:56 PM
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The sensors are in the front seats, they start as a closed circut & when a person sits in them the circut opens...if they aren't working then fot what ever reason the circut isn't seeing an open circut, to pinpoint try unpluging the seat sensors, that would create a open & the starter shouldn't crank..If it still does the you've veried the problem is elsewhere so you'll need to move to the starter interupt relay...I can't tell you where that would be on your Charger but at least you have a direction to try...Good Luck..

Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: NachoRT74] #56678
04/18/08 02:59 PM
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Agree with above...

Not sure on a '74, but there "may" be a seat weight-sensor that consists of a wire stretched across the underside of each front seat.

It may be broken or the sensor might be broken.

There is also a sensor in the seat-belt connector. It must be linked to a starter interlock.

Do you have the 1974 Dodge Chassis Service Manual? There should be an electrical troubleshooting section.

Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: D_C] #56679
04/18/08 03:07 PM
04/18/08 03:07 PM
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my 73 you just unplugged the sensor under the seat.

but it only buzzed at you for a moment, and would still start.


The 74's had a button under the hood.... and the cars I have ran across with it still on it, usually were wire, taped or zip tied so the car would start

Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: BlakDak] #56680
04/18/08 06:37 PM
04/18/08 06:37 PM
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NachoRT74 Offline OP
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some replies to your comments:

SoAm ( at least Venezuelan ) cars didn't have the interlock system... I just got from USA cars since I'm "cloning" for a complete 74 USA car with all real stuff, nothing bypassed.

So, to your thoughts, nothing is bypassed, cut or modified simplye because just recently I made the installation and worked at first instance. Simply suddenly one day stop to work like it should be.

The fact you don't like interlock doesn't mean I can get it working as must be

I made all testing explained on FSM manual ( I got emailed that section ) and everything takes me to a damaged control unit, but just partially because the logical circuit what makes work the warning signals is working like a clock, buzzing/lighting when I try to crank and when I gear. Just that shouldn't crank, but is cranking. I have been analizing the printed board inside interlock and does look could it be a diode or transistor went bad. There is a BIG transistor what links the starter circuit. Have to seartch further thought.

I say the logical circuit, including sensors, is working perfect simply by the fact all sensors are sensing... seats, buckles, making work the light and buzzer on the right moments.

BTW what I have experienced with interlock system and if everything was good in the fisrt, as far seats sensors doesn't send signal, you can crank engine, so for a fast start up, simply start before sit

Last edited by NachoRT74; 04/18/08 07:14 PM.

With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela
Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: NachoRT74] #56681
04/19/08 09:20 PM
04/19/08 09:20 PM
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Manitoba, Canada
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IIRC the seat-belt interlock was brought in for the 73 model year and dropped sometime in the 74 model year. I've owned two 74's that had no evidence of the seat belt interlock system.

Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: DaytonaTurbo] #56682
04/19/08 10:00 PM
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Hmmm, I just found an interlock control unit for Nacho in a 5-74 build-date Satellite Sebring... That's getting pretty late in the model year.

Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: DaytonaTurbo] #56683
04/20/08 02:38 PM
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NachoRT74 Offline OP
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I have known more in 75 than in 74

for a late 74 control unit I have an orange box, what is supposelly is a canadian unit and is not interlocked, but works the advertising functions. already mounted and works as stated just for buzzer and lights advertising signals PN 3501371

My conclusion about is a canadian unit was simply because I got the rallye harness from a Canadian Guy on ebay ( about 4 years ago ) with the control box attached

on Mopar parts catalog this orange unit is stated like to AUTO and also MANUAL cars after 2-01-74

In_The_Pink...the one you grabbed me with PN 3746849 is labeled to Manual cars ( excepy C bodies ) from 10-28-73 to 4-01-74

the is the actually one I have with interlock function apparently damaged:


this are two one ebay right now:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/AMC-SEAT-...5QQcmdZViewItem
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NOS-MoPar...9QQcmdZViewItem

the AMC one ( that was the reason I made a thread about earlier ) carries the manual boxes color to Mopars, but seller doesn't have specs for what cars was used/designed


With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela
Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: D_C] #56684
04/20/08 03:34 PM
04/20/08 03:34 PM
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Quote:

What Vehicle, What Year, and why do you care?

I disabled my Seat-Buzzer as soon as I could figure out how to do it.

That said, I always wear my Seat-Belt (just don't like the "Nanny" buzzer.)




Grandma always said I had "hands of gold"!
Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: CHRGR69] #56685
04/20/08 06:10 PM
04/20/08 06:10 PM
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Here's the one I grabbed:



Hard to read as the ink stamp is faded, but it's part number 3746849, date code 1334, and the door sticker on the car it was removed from had a date of 5-74:




I'm 99% sure the car was an automatic and it was definitely a slant six.


on

Some people don't understand why others like to keep things the way the factory made it, or even just use factory items that were never on their vehicles. If it's a palin jane Belvedere and someone wants to clone it into a Hemi GTX, people start and saying what a great idea it is. When someone wants to add some obscure factory equipment that isn't flashy, sexy or flavor-of-the-month, they don't understand . isn't for everyone- some people like obscure and unique. I'll help you all I can Nacho, cuz this is the type of thing I enjoy reading about and watching others do. Keep plugging away and you'll get it figured out eventually. Someone might even learn a thing or two reading about what you find.

off

Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: In_The_Pink] #56686
04/20/08 11:01 PM
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NachoRT74 Offline OP
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LOL... thanks for you support!!!

/6 with auto and white box ? maybe somebody simply fit that one as working replacement ?


With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela
Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: NachoRT74] #56687
05/03/08 04:11 PM
05/03/08 04:11 PM
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ok two harnesses with white box, suposelly from auto cars.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/71-74-sat...0247613708&

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/74-Plymou...0245539094&

but this FSM section states should it be blue on autoand shouldn't be interchanged!




With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela
Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: NachoRT74] #56688
06/03/08 10:13 PM
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Here's one I found in a '75 C-body (New Yorker, maybe? ):





I will find a blue one yet!

Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: In_The_Pink] #56689
06/03/08 10:53 PM
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will you start to collect them ? LOL

that's the same PN than the orange box non interlocked unit I have: 3501371


With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela
Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: NachoRT74] #56690
06/03/08 11:07 PM
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Quote:

will you start to collect them ? LOL

that's the same PN than the orange box non interlocked unit I have: 3501371




This one is PN 3501374

I guess I am collecting them now.

Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: In_The_Pink] #56691
06/04/08 01:04 AM
06/04/08 01:04 AM
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not listed in my 74 Parts catalog.


With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela
Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened belts [Re: NachoRT74] #56692
06/04/08 02:19 AM
06/04/08 02:19 AM

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Whoa..before this get's out of hand here.

I have a 74 Chally, seat belt interlock system (just posted another tidbit on another post).

"Pink" is on the right track here. There is a seat belt interlock "brain" module that is attached to the dash wiring system. Mine has alway's been an off white color, never seen a 74 black one. I've alway's just disconnected the seat sensor/switches to overide the whole thing.
(That was back in 1976).

If you are a 74 person, you will know what I'm talking about. It's a one year only thing..and I'm still trying to educate the world on how different 74's were....a one year only thing that was not popular.

Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: D_C] #56693
06/04/08 12:50 PM
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Quote:

Agree with above...

Not sure on a '74, but there "may" be a seat weight-sensor that consists of a wire stretched across the underside of each front seat.

It may be broken or the sensor might be broken.

There is also a sensor in the seat-belt connector. It must be linked to a starter interlock.

Do you have the 1974 Dodge Chassis Service Manual? There should be an electrical troubleshooting section.




Is that what this piece is part of? I found this clipped to the seat bottom springs in a Duster:





Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: In_The_Pink] #56694
06/04/08 06:42 PM
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NachoRT74 Offline OP
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I already know what is the brain ( control unit ) just got than my blue unit got damaged. I have a couple offered but they are white box. I'm still trying to catch a blue box and if not then will take the white box what suposelly is for manual trannies. However I know that they have been found on auto tranny cars. everytime I catch a 74 underdash harness on ebay, I ask to seller what car and tranny came out.

Pink
yes, thats the seat sensor.

FSM manual for trouble shooting, here is posted the interlock section ( with a link to a video at the end )
http://wichargerguy.proboards101.com/ind...amp;page=1#7583


With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela
Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: NachoRT74] #56695
06/05/08 12:25 AM
06/05/08 12:25 AM

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i have a couple of those
3746653

Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: In_The_Pink] #56696
06/05/08 12:57 AM
06/05/08 12:57 AM
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This was a very cool read for me! Hope you get your interlock situation sorted Nacho! Pink, you rock for being so helpful!

Wish I had any knowledge on 74s, but mine are 66, 68, and I had a 69 so long before interlock.

Good luck!
Eric

Quote:

on

Some people don't understand why others like to keep things the way the factory made it, or even just use factory items that were never on their vehicles. If it's a palin jane Belvedere and someone wants to clone it into a Hemi GTX, people start and saying what a great idea it is. When someone wants to add some obscure factory equipment that isn't flashy, sexy or flavor-of-the-month, they don't understand . isn't for everyone- some people like obscure and unique. I'll help you all I can Nacho, cuz this is the type of thing I enjoy reading about and watching others do. Keep plugging away and you'll get it figured out eventually. Someone might even learn a thing or two reading about what you find.

off



Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b #56697
06/05/08 12:35 PM
06/05/08 12:35 PM
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NachoRT74 Offline OP
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Quote:

i have a couple of those
3746653




theorically a buddy got me one, but get a couple won't be bad, specially because there is no way to test them without a car or the bench tester

PM with price please


BTW yeah I did like Pink's attitude... everybody says GET RID OFF THE INTERLOCK, THAT STUFF IS ANNOYING etc... I want my car working like was from fact, thats the goal on a RESTORATION right ?
If somebody doesn't want the interlock, then trash in to my mail box that. Your garbage could it me my treasure.

Same about cams and torque converter options. Everybody says 3000 stall or kinda off ( oftenly does look an auto response LOL ). But don't take in mind:

-NOT EVERYBODY WANT TO RACE.
-Probably just want a performance plus
-Budget is a part to take in mind


With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela
Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: NachoRT74] #56698
06/05/08 12:54 PM
06/05/08 12:54 PM
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Zzyzx Road
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Just a thought, two differnt harnesses were used in '74. Do you have the correct harness?


Amazing how an unchallenged lie can become the absolute truth.
Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: beepbeep] #56699
06/05/08 01:28 PM
06/05/08 01:28 PM
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wich harness you mean ? the one down the carpet or the underdash one?

If you mean about the undercarpet one actually there are 3 or 4 really. I do have actually two. one without driver seat sensor plug and for bench cars, and the other one with sensors everywhere and for bucket/buddy seats cars

At first instance when I got first the orange box ( non interlocked )I had before matched that box with the the harness without driver seat sensor ( modified the plug to plug the bench setup on to passenger bucket seat sensor and belt buckle ). worked perfect.

Then after I get the right interlocked box ( blue one ) tried to mount this box with the harness I had down the carpet working with orange box. Didn't work properlly...

Then by MAGIC ART ( some ebay seller drop that harness extra maybe accidentally when I was buying the engine harness to hook the reset button ) got the harness with all sensors wires and bucket/buddy seat setup. I got to get working for a week or so the bucket/buddy seat harness with all sensors provisions with the blue box.

I got:
-Crank/start the engine spreading my arm throught the window, without be sat or press the reset button. Dunno if must be on that way. No FSM manual or instruction or any info about if thats is posible or not, If is correct or not. Just ppl experience would it be able to provide that info, but since EVERYBODY GETS RID OFF OF THAT, then not too much ppl able to help

-Once I sat on seat, then no crank engine untill fasten the seatbelt or reset the system. That's how must be

Thats why I think box got damaged suddenly, thinking I made it to work.

Warning advertisement signals ( lights and buzzers ) ARE ACTUALLY WORKING PERFECT, and still.


ANY info about this you have will be great to every 74 owner


With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela
Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: NachoRT74] #56700
06/05/08 06:31 PM
06/05/08 06:31 PM
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Ijust threw the idea out. Unfortunately I do not have any '74 wiring diagrams. If you can find a January 1974 MTSC the entire booklet deals with Seat Belt Starter Interlock.


Amazing how an unchallenged lie can become the absolute truth.
Re: I'm able to crank the engine even with unfastened b [Re: beepbeep] #56701
06/05/08 10:41 PM
06/05/08 10:41 PM
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I DO have the 74 diagrams, but sensors section of harness file is corrupted and imposible to read


With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela
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