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Re: Manuel brake question
[Re: Dougsmopars]
#432658
08/09/09 04:46 PM
08/09/09 04:46 PM
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 6,446
NJ-USA
HPMike
master
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master
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 6,446
NJ-USA
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I have very limited experience with Manuel brakes. I have however worked on several Jose and Miguel brake systems so I'll give it my best shot.. (just kidding, couldn't resist  ) Seriously, i would focus on two areas. Is the master an actual manual drum cylinder? Both fluid compartments(front and rear) are equal and small. I have seen some that have disc brake masters installed with all drums. It will work, but you will have pedal feel issues. The other area I would look is are the shoes glazed? This will cause the drum brake shoes to lose some of their ability to "self energize" when they come into contact with the drum wear surface. Good Luck, MB
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Re: Manuel brake question
[Re: HPMike]
#432659
08/09/09 05:19 PM
08/09/09 05:19 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,468
So Cal
autoxcuda
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,468
So Cal
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Quote:
I have very limited experience with Manuel brakes. I have however worked on several Jose and Miguel brake systems so I'll give it my best shot..
(just kidding, couldn't resist )
Seriously, i would focus on two areas. Is the master an actual manual drum cylinder? Both fluid compartments(front and rear) are equal and small. I have seen some that have disc brake masters installed with all drums. It will work, but you will have pedal feel issues. The other area I would look is are the shoes glazed? This will cause the drum brake shoes to lose some of their ability to "self energize" when they come into contact with the drum wear surface.
Good Luck,
MB
What about flex lines that are internally deteriorated? I've seen that once, but the brakes pulled to one side. Could they be equally deteriorated????
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Re: Manuel brake question
[Re: Dougsmopars]
#432660
08/09/09 05:37 PM
08/09/09 05:37 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
Circle Track
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Circle Track
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
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Has it always been like this?. What bore is the M/C. I the exact same symptoms once & it was a partially crimped front line though I dont think that is your issue.
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Manuel brake question
[Re: RapidRobert]
#432661
08/09/09 05:55 PM
08/09/09 05:55 PM
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 2,295
dark side of the moon
Dougsmopars
OP
top fuel
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OP
top fuel
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 2,295
dark side of the moon
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master is a manuel drum master. No pull when breaking. I do get a little less pressure from front's when bleeding. Brakes work, will lock the front wheels but seems to need excessive pedal force to stop. Nice firm pedal, no fading, not soft. Car was born with power brakes. Last owner changed to manuel because of poor vac with big cam. When i drove the car stopping power was horrible. Thats when i did the brake job. Much better but not right. I don't know the exact bore. The master is a replacement for a 68 GTX. The best way to discribe the feel is like when power brakes loose the vac and it takes excessive force to stop the car. Pedal is hard but not stopping very quick. Car has plenty of go now need the woe.
Last edited by Dougsmopars; 08/09/09 05:59 PM.
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Re: Manuel brake question
[Re: Dougsmopars]
#432662
08/09/09 06:00 PM
08/09/09 06:00 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,786
Rio Linda, CA
John_Kunkel
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,786
Rio Linda, CA
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If the car was changed from power to manual was the MC installed on the power brake location on the firewall? If so, the pedal ratio is too low for manual brakes; the manual MC is mounted higher on the firewall and the pedal ratio is higher.
The INTERNET, the MISinformation superhighway
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Re: Manuel brake question
[Re: John_Kunkel]
#432664
08/09/09 06:40 PM
08/09/09 06:40 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,468
So Cal
autoxcuda
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,468
So Cal
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Quote:
If the car was changed from power to manual was the MC installed on the power brake location on the firewall? If so, the pedal ratio is too low for manual brakes; the manual MC is mounted higher on the firewall and the pedal ratio is higher.
 Nice call. 
Interesting to see if they did that on this car. I'd say it was a good bet.
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Re: Manuel brake question
[Re: RapidRobert]
#432668
08/09/09 10:30 PM
08/09/09 10:30 PM
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Deleted prior to arrival of politically biased moderators
Last edited by 440sixpack; 09/15/09 12:07 AM.
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Re: Manuel brake question
#432669
08/09/09 10:38 PM
08/09/09 10:38 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
Circle Track
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Circle Track
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
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440sixpack has an excellent point, premium shoes make a world of difference
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Manuel brake question
[Re: RapidRobert]
#432674
08/10/09 01:08 PM
08/10/09 01:08 PM
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
Quote:
I've looked into better shoes but so far can't find 11X3. If you know of any company that has 11X3 let me know.
You are in luck, there's a guy on eGay selling velvetouch full mettalic linings from the 60's & I bought several sets for my circle burner & I just checked & there are (2) Mopar sets left & one is the 11x3 that you are in need of & he's reduced the price to $50. I'm 'bout tempted to get em myself. guys that used them way back said they were awesome & would eat up drums but they worked.
I dont know that I'd recommend those. The characteristics of metallic/ velvetouch can be "touchy" They are MEANT for things like circle tracks and very hilly country where you use the brakes a lot and keep them warm. They don't stop worth $$$$ when cold, and worse, some of those would "come on" unpredictably. Friend of mine had them for awhile on his '70 Chev 3/4 4x4 back then. He'd be driving say, down the freeway, and have to make a hard stop for a traffic tie up. He'd step on the brakes, and they wouldn't do much, he'd step harder, and suddenly they'd START TO WORK as they warmed up, and you'd have to be RIGHT "on it" to LET UP on pedal pressure. He took them off the truck. They are VERY VERY hard on brake drums.
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Re: Manuel brake question
[Re: Dougsmopars]
#432676
08/11/09 05:28 PM
08/11/09 05:28 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
Circle Track
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Circle Track
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
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Doug on a prior brake thread 4 or 5 people touted Ceramic shoes & no mention of them eating drums which(from reports) would for sure be a problem w velvetouch(or other metallic) shoes. I was just thinking that $65 to your door might not be a bad deal(& it would depend on the cold performance and how fast they gobbled up those(not cheap) drums). they'll work for me in my app as I need the lightest weight I can get by with & still have enough sq in of area to stop adequately & 9" used early A drums are cheap & I certainly wont have a problem with running cool
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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