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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: BradH]
#429811
08/06/09 10:39 AM
08/06/09 10:39 AM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,274
s.w.fl
bonefish
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,274
s.w.fl
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: BradH]
#429816
08/06/09 11:36 AM
08/06/09 11:36 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,127
Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,127
Bend,OR USA
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I have two systems, FAST with dual sensors and the RPM option and a Innovate LM1 with the RPM and LC1 option which converts the LM1 from a single wide ban to a dual sensor. The FAST had one side failed within ten minutes of using it on a engine dyno test  FAST repaired it under warrentee and now the RPM feature doesn'r record  The FAST system has memory for one recording session and no provisions to store and tranfer that data to any other device. The good news is the Innovate LM1 failed after a lot of use and it was repaired under warrentee and it still works well  That system will store multiple sessions as well as let you hook up a laptop and view the session in real time or store the session in the LM1 and transfer that information to the laptop later. The bad thing about the LM1 is that it is a single sensor system, but they do now sell it as a dual wide ban systemm or you can buy the LC1 add on to convert the LM1 to a dual wide ban system I have not hooked up the LC1 into the LM1 yet so I can't offer any experiences with it yet, the LM1 also has room to add up to five sensors for oil temp or any other option you may want When it comes to tuning the AFR I don't think that there is a perfect ratio for all combinations, I use it to learn from, I lean it( part throtttle cruise, idle and WOT individually)) down until it starts to ping and then fatten it up to stop the pinging or surging at part throttle. The weather and fuel, winter mix versus summer mix, out here makes a difference, the fuel will make the car run differenent and read different  Ultimately, for racing, the time slip is the final input on my tuning set up on the carb and timing  There are other systems availble now that I have no expereinces with so don't be afraid to try them unless you want to go with a proven system 
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#429817
08/06/09 11:48 AM
08/06/09 11:48 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,915
A shed in England
Tig
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,915
A shed in England
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'74 Challenger..9.46 @ 145.9 1/4, 6.001 @ 118 1/8 so far. 4023lb !!! # N/A, Marsh performance 655ci, Indy Maxx, T/R, Indy 600-13 X's, Street legal, pump gas, full interior, Cal-Tracs, mufflers, 3:73's and real 10.5 radials.
9.51 @ 142.4 1/4, 6.003 @ 114 1/8 with our old mule KB, 572-13, 580 wedge.
RHD '68 Barracuda Fastback 323ci street/strip. Best ET 13.88 @ 99.03
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: CJK440]
#429823
08/07/09 09:24 AM
08/07/09 09:24 AM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 15,478
the boonies
aarcuda
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 15,478
the boonies
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Quote:
Quote:
I quite like the look of this:
http://www.gtechpro.com/egs.html
Its $300 for the tach and another $230 for the wideband add on?
i was going to get one of those but i ended up getting the LM1
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: aarcuda]
#429824
08/07/09 09:49 AM
08/07/09 09:49 AM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,066
Mo.
racerx
master
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master
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,066
Mo.
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I quite like the look of this:
http://www.gtechpro.com/egs.html
Its $300 for the tach and another $230 for the wide band add on?
i was going to get one of those but i ended up getting the LM1
I also Like that setup and posted up that system awhile back with very little response. 
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: DaytonaTurbo]
#429826
08/07/09 11:11 AM
08/07/09 11:11 AM
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,255
IL
furious70
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,255
IL
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I've got the LM-1 and the analog gauge in my Coronet. IMO the analog gauge is well worth the $ for racing. That way, just like any other gauge, you can very quickly look at it and know if you're safe, set tape marks on it, etc. For me, seeing a digital readout of a # and trying to think about whether that's ok or not while watching the other gauges, shifting, watching the other guy, etc, is too much to do.
My analog gauge reads 1 full point lean compared to the LM unit however. This is a common problem listed in their FAQ, they say it's grounding related. I've tried all sorts of things and not gotten it fixed. Not a huge deal, just set the tape marks in a different place and make sure it stays between them.
70 Sport Fury
68 Charger
69 Coronet
72 RR
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: furious70]
#429827
08/07/09 11:47 AM
08/07/09 11:47 AM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,274
s.w.fl
bonefish
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,274
s.w.fl
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i just looked at the INOVATIVE web site and they dont list the LM-1 in their product page,is it still available or is the lm -2 a replacemet?
Last edited by bonefish; 08/07/09 11:49 AM.
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 senso
[Re: bonefish]
#429828
08/07/09 11:52 AM
08/07/09 11:52 AM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 876
Arizona
PolyDart
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 876
Arizona
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Quote:
i just looked at the INOVATIVE web site and they dont list the LM-1 in their product page,is it still available or is the lm -2 a replacemet?
LM-2 is the replacement. You needed a serial port for the LM 1 to work. The LM 2 connects via USB.
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: Garceau]
#429829
08/07/09 11:54 AM
08/07/09 11:54 AM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,274
s.w.fl
bonefish
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 7,274
s.w.fl
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Quote:
Im a big fan of a good O2 set up.
Some will complain its 3-400 dollars. I say its still cheaper than 2 weekends at the track trying to tune the carb.
not to mention around here a DYNO session is 150 per hr,
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: racerx]
#429832
08/08/09 11:33 AM
08/08/09 11:33 AM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 15,478
the boonies
aarcuda
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 15,478
the boonies
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I quite like the look of this:
http://www.gtechpro.com/egs.html
Its $300 for the tach and another $230 for the wide band add on?
i was going to get one of those but i ended up getting the LM1
I also Like that setup and posted up that system awhile back with very little response.
same here. apparently, no one uses it and i didnt want to be the guinea pig
as for the LM2, the forum there has lots of unhappy people usingit. theres lots of bugs with it (or there was).. thats why i went with the LM1 (ebay) and im very happy with it
check out the attachment. its a jpg i made from the log file and added some data point
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 senso
[Re: PolyDart]
#429833
08/08/09 11:38 AM
08/08/09 11:38 AM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 15,478
the boonies
aarcuda
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 15,478
the boonies
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Quote:
Quote:
i just looked at the INOVATIVE web site and they dont list the LM-1 in their product page,is it still available or is the lm -2 a replacemet?
LM-2 is the replacement. You needed a serial port for the LM 1 to work. The LM 2 connects via USB.
you can get a serial to USB cable from radio shack that can hook your lm1 to a usb port. im using one right now
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: aarcuda]
#429834
08/09/09 06:31 AM
08/09/09 06:31 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,915
A shed in England
Tig
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,915
A shed in England
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I quite like the look of this:
http://www.gtechpro.com/egs.html
Its $300 for the tach and another $230 for the wide band add on?
i was going to get one of those but i ended up getting the LM1
I also Like that setup and posted up that system awhile back with very little response.
same here. apparently, no one uses it and i didnt want to be the guinea pig
I'll be the guinea pig in a month or two
'74 Challenger..9.46 @ 145.9 1/4, 6.001 @ 118 1/8 so far. 4023lb !!! # N/A, Marsh performance 655ci, Indy Maxx, T/R, Indy 600-13 X's, Street legal, pump gas, full interior, Cal-Tracs, mufflers, 3:73's and real 10.5 radials.
9.51 @ 142.4 1/4, 6.003 @ 114 1/8 with our old mule KB, 572-13, 580 wedge.
RHD '68 Barracuda Fastback 323ci street/strip. Best ET 13.88 @ 99.03
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: Tig]
#429835
08/09/09 04:47 PM
08/09/09 04:47 PM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,066
Mo.
racerx
master
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master
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,066
Mo.
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I quite like the look of this:
http://www.gtechpro.com/egs.html
Its $300 for the tach and another $230 for the wide band add on?
i was going to get one of those but i ended up getting the LM1
I also Like that setup and posted up that system awhile back with very little response.
same here. apparently, no one uses it and i didnt want to be the guinea pig
I'll be the guinea pig in a month or two
Tig Please post up results...Thax 
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: Mr71Bee]
#429838
08/09/09 11:05 PM
08/09/09 11:05 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
BradH
OP
Taking time off to work on my car
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OP
Taking time off to work on my car
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
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Quote:
Do these sensors work if I run leaded race gas?
Dallas
From what I've read, lead trashes the sensor. Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong on this point.
And thanks to everyone who has posted on this. I'm considering a system seriously, but haven't made any decisions on brand, single vs. dual sensors, etc.
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: BradH]
#429839
08/09/09 11:18 PM
08/09/09 11:18 PM
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 6,295
U.S.
moparniac
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 6,295
U.S.
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Go single and save money and just put another bung on the other side to check that bank whenever.....
Mopar Performance
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: CJK440]
#429841
08/10/09 10:12 AM
08/10/09 10:12 AM
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,765
quick77rt
Parts Problem
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Parts Problem
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,765
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I run my auto meter directly in my x pipe, might not be the perfect spot but it works. Is as basic as most say...weld in the bung tilt it up a bit, if all is cold let the unit preheat until you fire it. This is a simple vid, not worried about ide ect...just wot but with a six pack and spray its needed. Im surprised for the minor cost 3-4 hundred more people dont have them... Dont be afraid of the wide band units. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1JjBce4OyxoWOT wideband test.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Za7lfxoDFc
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: aarcuda]
#429843
08/10/09 12:51 PM
08/10/09 12:51 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
BradH
OP
Taking time off to work on my car
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OP
Taking time off to work on my car
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
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Quote:
as for the LM2, the forum there has lots of unhappy people usingit. theres lots of bugs with it (or there was)..
Such as? Is this stuff that was supposed to have been fixed in their 7/09 upgrade, or other issues that are still out there?
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: jinxy]
#429846
08/10/09 03:54 PM
08/10/09 03:54 PM
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,765
quick77rt
Parts Problem
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Parts Problem
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,765
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Most the ones ive seen all have in the instructions where they would prefer to see them placed, then you got to sort it out. I was runing one in each side but its overkill for me. You could alway but a bung in each side and swap from time to time, if all is equal????? My X pipe is very near my headers so all worked ok. Im no expert, this is just how I did mine, and it works pretty good. Quote:
I just ordered the Innovate DB gauge kit($229.00)Summit.
My car has tti headers on a small block with full 2 1/2" exhaust. Where is the best place to install the single sensor?
Good info on this thread
Jeff
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: BradH]
#429848
08/10/09 08:24 PM
08/10/09 08:24 PM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 15,478
the boonies
aarcuda
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 15,478
the boonies
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Quote:
Quote:
as for the LM2, the forum there has lots of unhappy people usingit. theres lots of bugs with it (or there was)..
Such as? Is this stuff that was supposed to have been fixed in their 7/09 upgrade, or other issues that are still out there?
cant say for sure. i looked on there back in april when i was looking looking to buy and i saw all the problems and went with the lm1. i had borrowed one from a friend and it worked so i went with a known unit vs an unknown with lots of bad press.
if they fixed the problems, that would be great. maybe an update is in the future.
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: aarcuda]
#429849
08/12/09 01:42 PM
08/12/09 01:42 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,915
A shed in England
Tig
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,915
A shed in England
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I've spoke to a few race guys who run the FAST and Innovate stand alone systems. They run leaded race fuel but change the sensor every season, a couple are blow thru turbo VW guys. The only real difference, I'm told, is the response of the sensor. The units calibrate themselves every time they are switched on as far as I'm aware. Another tip they told me was to mount the sensor at least 12 inches from an open header end as the turbulance can give false readings. I'll post results as soon as, but I'll have to fab fancy header extensions as the ends are close to the 'box crossmember / mount. I'm also ordering an extra sensor mount and 2 bungs. Thanx
'74 Challenger..9.46 @ 145.9 1/4, 6.001 @ 118 1/8 so far. 4023lb !!! # N/A, Marsh performance 655ci, Indy Maxx, T/R, Indy 600-13 X's, Street legal, pump gas, full interior, Cal-Tracs, mufflers, 3:73's and real 10.5 radials.
9.51 @ 142.4 1/4, 6.003 @ 114 1/8 with our old mule KB, 572-13, 580 wedge.
RHD '68 Barracuda Fastback 323ci street/strip. Best ET 13.88 @ 99.03
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: BradH]
#429850
08/12/09 01:56 PM
08/12/09 01:56 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
BradH
OP
Taking time off to work on my car
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OP
Taking time off to work on my car
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
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Any known - or common - issues w/ the FAST system?
How long has it been since the Innovate LM-1 been replaced by the LM-2? Are new LM-1s still available?
Also... my "big dummy" question of the day... where do you route the sensor cable so as to be able to read the display inside the car? Do you have to run it up through a (new?) hole in the floor pan?
Last edited by BradH; 08/12/09 02:12 PM.
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: Tig]
#429852
08/12/09 02:41 PM
08/12/09 02:41 PM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,066
Mo.
racerx
master
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master
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,066
Mo.
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Quote:
I've spoke to a few race guys who run the FAST and Innovate stand alone systems. They run leaded race fuel but change the sensor every season, a couple are blow thru turbo VW guys. The only real difference, I'm told, is the response of the sensor. The units calibrate themselves every time they are switched on as far as I'm aware. Another tip they told me was to mount the sensor at least 12 inches from an open header end as the turbulance can give false readings.
I'll post results as soon as, but I'll have to fab fancy header extensions as the ends are close to the 'box crossmember / mount. I'm also ordering an extra sensor mount and 2 bungs.
Thanx
Tig can u also post pic. of you're install.Thax.
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: convertriple]
#429854
08/13/09 03:27 AM
08/13/09 03:27 AM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
dOrk !
The village idiot's idiot
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The village idiot's idiot
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 30,424
Florida STAYcation
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Quote:
Can the sensors handle some ethanol, like 10-20% they put in the premium pump fuel?
Does fuel type alter the ratio you are aiming for?
Good question ....
And how about E85 ? ... I have zip experience with it but on some of the posts I hear people running E85 as lean as 12.5 to one and still making good power.
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: dOrk !]
#429855
08/13/09 05:21 AM
08/13/09 05:21 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,180
Detroit, MI
CokeBottleKid
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,180
Detroit, MI
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The Haze ran AV-gas for years, seems to take a while for the lead to cause damage. Wideband sensors are lambda sensors, meaning it reads A/F(stoich)/A/F(actual), so depending on what the display is setup for (typically gasoline) it doesn't matter whether you run pump gas, methanol, or E85 if it's reading 14.7 then that's stoich. When I get a steady income this will be the one I buy for general tuning. http://14point7.com/Widebands/JAW_1_041/JAW_1_041.htm
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Re: Tell me about installing & using wide-band O2 sensor!
[Re: racerx]
#429856
08/13/09 01:17 PM
08/13/09 01:17 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,915
A shed in England
Tig
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,915
A shed in England
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Tig can u also post pic. of you're install.Thax.
I will do, but don't expect anything soon. I've only just placed the order with a buddy and we are waiting on other stuff to be collected before it all gets sent over here. I figure a couple of months max, by which time our season is over so its an off season thing to install. Track results won't be 'till next year 
'74 Challenger..9.46 @ 145.9 1/4, 6.001 @ 118 1/8 so far. 4023lb !!! # N/A, Marsh performance 655ci, Indy Maxx, T/R, Indy 600-13 X's, Street legal, pump gas, full interior, Cal-Tracs, mufflers, 3:73's and real 10.5 radials.
9.51 @ 142.4 1/4, 6.003 @ 114 1/8 with our old mule KB, 572-13, 580 wedge.
RHD '68 Barracuda Fastback 323ci street/strip. Best ET 13.88 @ 99.03
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